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hedwards: I'm pretty sure that it's legal to sell them, every manufacturer I've bought a computer from since MS stopped including discs has offered discs for cash.
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Namur: It's legal to burn Windows OS's on disks and go about selling them at an arbitary price, regardless of what price might be ? I really don't think so. I don't doubt for a minute that manufacturers will willingly, and happily, sell them for cash though.
The discs aren't useful without activation and MS is the party that controls activation. back in times of yore you'd be furnished with the same disc so that you could reinstall.

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hedwards: I'm not really sure what's so special about Comet that MS is trying to go after them.
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Namur: They were caught doing it and there's enough evidence of them doing it repeatedly to the extent of one and a half million quid in profits ? ;)
They made profits providing something that MS no longer provides. It's not really any different from when shops charge to remove adware from computers that the manufacturers insist on larding the computers up.

The discs themselves are useless without either activation or a crack. Anybody wanting the later has more than a few places to find them, and MS ultimately controls activation of the copies.

As I've said before it's common practice for major OEMs these days to charge for replacement discs, I'd love to know what specifically it was that mad MS start caring. The price is in line with the ones I've seen for replacement discs.
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hedwards: And yet whenever I buy a computer they offer to sell me the recovery discs. It's not like I'm buying from small fly by night systems integrators either. If it weren't legal you'd think that MS would have started enforcing their rights years ago.

Really the whole situation is bullshit and ultimately MS' fault.
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wodmarach: The OEM has the right to sell the disc thats the thing they have a contract with MS to burn and create their own discs Comet doesn't
I wasn't aware that Comet doesn't sell their own machines. Yes that would make a difference and probably enough of one for MS to win the suit. Although the whole thing is stupid seeing as MS is the party that activates the discs and anybody wanting to use the discs would need a valid key.
Post edited January 04, 2012 by hedwards
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hedwards: And yet whenever I buy a computer they offer to sell me the recovery discs. It's not like I'm buying from small fly by night systems integrators either. If it weren't legal you'd think that MS would have started enforcing their rights years ago.

Really the whole situation is bullshit and ultimately MS' fault.
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wodmarach: The OEM has the right to sell the disc thats the thing they have a contract with MS to burn and create their own discs Comet doesn't
I wonder what MS would do to me or others who sometimes help people burn recovery discs for other people's computers?(and charge a few bucks for doing so.)
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GameRager: I wonder what MS would do to me or others who sometimes help people burn recovery discs for other people's computers?(and charge a few bucks for doing so.)
nothing you aren't charging them for making the discs your charging them for your time or even just accepting a gift (you're also small scale and worth maybe a grand after costs)
I received a letter from HP informing me that they had lost a class action suit for not informing buyers that disk space was being used for the recovery disk / apps. Seems that advertising a disk size and then not giving full access to the full amount was illegal. Also, there was no way to create the recovery disks (at that time)

I was asked to check the OS and Apps for which I wanted to receive recovery disks. I assume the idea was giving me the disks would allow me to format and utilize the full hard drive. I got the disks in the mail a few weeks later. From then on, HP was loudly explaining how their recovery system used disk space and began offering a way to create the disks. Been SOP every since.

I seem to remember, back in the day, that MS required the OS disks to be shipped with every computer sold with their OS installed. Some guy with a spreadsheet did the math and put a stop to that I guess.

Edit: Must have been later as I remember it was an XP system, I had purchased one of the first systems offered with XP . . . =)
Post edited January 04, 2012 by Stuff
This, ladies and gentlemen, is a true and proper case of real piracy. Somebody selling something for which they held no rights.

Whoever in the legal department signed this off should be shot. While I'm certainly no expert on common law ( or fairy tale magic, as I like to call it ;-P), this can't have been authorised by any legal professional.

You just don't do stuff like that without a written agreement with MS...
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azrael-: Especially if we're really talking about tailor-made recovery discs, because they're usually tied to a quite specific hardware configuration. Also, "real" recovery discs have the nasty habit of wiping the PC's HDD clean in the "recovery" process.
These seem to have been mass produced (factory pressing not burnt at the time of sale) which kinda makes me think they weren't tailored for the actual machine they were sold with...
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SimonG: This, ladies and gentlemen, is a true and proper case of real piracy.
You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means. :)
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SimonG: This, ladies and gentlemen, is a true and proper case of real piracy. Somebody selling something for which they held no rights.

Whoever in the legal department signed this off should be shot. While I'm certainly no expert on common law ( or fairy tale magic, as I like to call it ;-P), this can't have been authorised by any legal professional.

You just don't do stuff like that without a written agreement with MS...
They're arguing they provided a service because MS wasn't providing the discs (which MS don't have to do) and real OEM's will provide the actual recovery discs here if you call them for a LOT less than comet was charging ( p+p most commonly)
Post edited January 04, 2012 by wodmarach
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wodmarach: They're arguing they provided a service because MS wasn't providing the discs (which MS don't have to do) and real OEM's will provide the actual recovery discs here if you call them for a LOT less than comet was charging ( p+p most commonly)
But even for somebody without any legal knowledge this sounds kinda shoddy. And before you do something like this in the millions, you better ask somebody who knows this stuff.

I mean, that wasn't a local computer shack making a few more bucks. How could they expect to get away with this?

Edit: Some of you might remember the rage fits I threw about CDPs legal action. But this right here, is something worth going to court for. Never thought I would say this, but I'm with MS on this one. (And it will be settled out of court anyway)
Post edited January 04, 2012 by SimonG
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SimonG: This, ladies and gentlemen, is a true and proper case of real piracy. Somebody selling something for which they held no rights.

Whoever in the legal department signed this off should be shot. While I'm certainly no expert on common law ( or fairy tale magic, as I like to call it ;-P), this can't have been authorised by any legal professional.

You just don't do stuff like that without a written agreement with MS...
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wodmarach: They're arguing they provided a service because MS wasn't providing the discs (which MS don't have to do) and real OEM's will provide the actual recovery discs here if you call them for a LOT less than comet was charging ( p+p most commonly)
You mean s&h right? ;)

:P
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wodmarach: They're arguing they provided a service because MS wasn't providing the discs (which MS don't have to do) and real OEM's will provide the actual recovery discs here if you call them for a LOT less than comet was charging ( p+p most commonly)
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GameRager: You mean s&h right? ;)

:P
It's the UK so no its P+P you yanks and your s&h *rolls eyes*
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SimonG: But even for somebody without any legal knowledge this sounds kinda shoddy. And before you do something like this in the millions, you better ask somebody who knows this stuff.
Oh yeah they don't have a leg to stand on the person who thought this would be ok has probably been fired by now.. I expect the settlement will be at least twice the profit they made plus costs if it gets to court it'll be enough to kill the parent company.
Post edited January 04, 2012 by wodmarach
No discs provided with pre-built systems is shitty. It's that simple. Yes, they're attacking a company that is in the wrong. That however doesn't make them right in any sense other than legally.
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Navagon: No discs provided with pre-built systems is shitty. It's that simple. Yes, they're attacking a company that is in the wrong. That however doesn't make them right in any sense other than legally.
It could be however the first shot in an attempt to let MS put back in the rule about including discs with machines if they can get it done without another antitrust hearing it's kinda a win on both sides (we get back our discs MS gets their branded discs back out there) but some will scream it's them forcing the discs on purchasers yadda yadda yadda
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wodmarach: for creating copies of windows
This actually seems fairly clean cut tbh though they really did mass produce windows discs and sold them (at 15 quid a pop!) they are arguing it's because MS doesn't provide recovery discs anymore (actually the OEMs choice not MS's btw).
I know it goes against the grain for some but I feel a need to be on MS's side this time... if they had charged for the discs only (a couple of pence maybe) I could see a defence but £15?!?
This is what copyright was actually created to stop, sure, take them to the cleaners. From what you've described MS is in the right here.
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Navagon: No discs provided with pre-built systems is shitty. It's that simple. Yes, they're attacking a company that is in the wrong. That however doesn't make them right in any sense other than legally.
Come on, fifteen quid? That costs them all of my sympathy. Perhaps as a gesture of customer support for free it would be ok, but not as a blatant profiteering act.