It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
Community
General discussion (archive)Ubuntu 10.04 released!(61 posts)(61 posts)
(61 posts)
Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
This is my favourite topic
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
Arkose: Aside from the arbitrary relocation of the window controls this seems to be a stable release with lots of great improvements (especially if you are coming from 9.04 rather than 9.10, which included the early stages of some of these improvements).
avatar
Fenixp: ... ... Seriously, is there any reason whatsoever to do THAT?

No adequate reason has been given from what I've seen. I'm not sure that even the designers know their own reasons. In the words of one of the designers behind this decision, "Is it better or worse? It is quite hard to tell." I wish I was making this up.
This change has huge ramifications for Linux development, because this customisation only automatically applies to software using the native windowing system (metacity/compiz); programs that a different windowing system--and there are a lot in that category--do not inherit this preference and will continue to have the buttons on the right-hand side until their designers add specific support for this new behaviour. There will also be an expectation for the projects Ubuntu builds upon--such as Gnome--to implement support for this preference in their programs.
Also of significance is that this change is for the "LTS" (long-term support) branch, which is widely deployed by companies that want a reliable, regularly-patched version that will remain compatible with their existing software. Ubuntu 10 is compatible with software, oh yes, but not with the actual users.
If I was a primary Ubuntu user who didn't already know about this I would be really, really ticked off at the end of the upgrade process. The upgrade window presented to 9.x users warns about all sorts of potential issues, but not this.

The main reason is a fail attempt to be like a Mac. In all honesty we will have programs using right hand cursors as said above and windows on left. This is the dumbest idea ever. The main reason stuff is on the right, it just is. A standard is in place and anyone who tries to be different ends up being dumb as is the case with Macs and new Ubuntu.
Posted April 30, 2010
Haven't updated yet, but tell me something, the buttons on the top left placement thing affects only the Gnome desktop? Will it be okay for Xfce users or am i going to have to tinker with the source?
edit: i think i can bypass the whole mess if i install KDE.... synaptic i'm looking at you!
Post edited April 30, 2010 by Menelkir
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
tb87670: The main reason stuff is on the right, it just is. A standard is in place and anyone who tries to be different ends up being dumb as is the case with Macs and new Ubuntu.

Tradition aside, there is in fact a very good reason for why every OS eventually ended up doing it the same way: it keeps the window controls totally separate from the menus and eliminates any possibility of altering the program window while trying to reach a menu. The program's icon is still in the menu area, but it merely opens a menu of its own and does not automatically affect the window's state so hitting it by accident doesn't matter.
Already some Ubuntu veterans are complaining about accidentally closing or minimising a program when reaching for a menu because their aim was a few pixels off, and even those that are putting up with it are frustrated that the programs they use now have a mix of both left- and right-aligned window controls.
avatar
Menelkir: the buttons on the top left placement thing affects only the Gnome desktop? Will it be okay for Xfce users or am i going to have to tinker with the source?

This is Gnome only for now; KDE and the rest do not yet have this functionality.
For Gnome you can switch between control positions with a single terminal command as described here (you probably need to restart to see the change). Regardless of your preference, software that doesn't use the native windowing system will have right-aligned controls no matter what.
Post edited April 30, 2010 by Arkose
Posted April 30, 2010
i wish i had a reason to use ubuntu :( damn my music producing ways!
Posted April 30, 2010
This supposedly fixes the placement of the window controls:
gconftool-2 --set /apps/metacity/general/button_layout --type string menu:minimize,maximize,close
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
denyasis: Not sure what they used to replace HAL, but, it loads a few seconds faster on startup.
avatar
Kingoftherings: I'm pretty sure 10.04 stil uses HAL. I don't believe xorg-server 1.8.0 made it in, and even if it did, there are tons of other applications that use HAL.
By the way, I think what you were referring to is that xorg-server 1.8.0 now uses udev instead of HAL.

I think HAL was totally dropped to be replaced by devicekit
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
KeitaroBaka: I think HAL was totally dropped to be replaced by devicekit

Yes, HAL is deprecated now, but there are still a few applications that use it. At least on my system those would be K3B the KDE CD Burning app, and Gnomad2, which I use to transfer music to my MP3 player.
I don't use Ubuntu, so I don't know if still comes with HAL pre-installed.
Devicekit was going to replace HAL, but they're merging it into udev.
Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeviceKit
Posted April 30, 2010
What the hell were they thinking with putting the window controls on the left side? I can understand the desire for innovation or to be different, but this change is really ill-considered.
Posted April 30, 2010
I am terribly, terribly disappointed with Ubuntu.
Things started going downhill from Hardy Heron, when things turned into "innovation". Things were changed to distract from consistency and usability, to make way for innovation and user friendliness.
This is something that should not be in Canonical's hands. Linux and OSS is about freedom, in both usability and license.
Social and cloud integration and moving the window buttons to the left hand side are just a few things that point to Ubuntu's impending total collapse. Innovation is eating the project up.
Ubuntu was made as a reguarly updated alternative to Debian, which has very infrequent updates and its packages are very old for usability instead of high version numbers. This system worked wonderfully until Canoncal felt that "new users" needed a bit of hand holding.
Yes. Ubuntu is a fantastic starting point for Linux users. Or at least, it used to be. It no longer is. There are no good choices for the new user anymore.
If I ever use Linux, I tend to use Arch which gives me 360 degrees of freedom with my system, and I like it that.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
TheJoe: I am terribly, terribly disappointed with Ubuntu.
Things started going downhill from Hardy Heron, when things turned into "innovation". Things were changed to distract from consistency and usability, to make way for innovation and user friendliness.
This is something that should not be in Canonical's hands. Linux and OSS is about freedom, in both usability and license.
Social and cloud integration and moving the window buttons to the left hand side are just a few things that point to Ubuntu's impending total collapse. Innovation is eating the project up.
Ubuntu was made as a reguarly updated alternative to Debian, which has very infrequent updates and its packages are very old for usability instead of high version numbers. This system worked wonderfully until Canoncal felt that "new users" needed a bit of hand holding.
Yes. Ubuntu is a fantastic starting point for Linux users. Or at least, it used to be. It no longer is. There are no good choices for the new user anymore.
If I ever use Linux, I tend to use Arch which gives me 360 degrees of freedom with my system, and I like it that.

RAGING JOE.
Used Gentoo for several years. Loved it. Arch is a close second.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
TheJoe: ....

Isn't mandriva based upon older versions of Ubuntu? I have a good experience with that, since it's... Well... Pretty much the same thing, it just had way better performance on my system :D I am far from being sure thou.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
TheJoe: ....
avatar
Fenixp: Isn't mandriva based upon older versions of Ubuntu? I have a good experience with that, since it's... Well... Pretty much the same thing, it just had way better performance on my system :D I am far from being sure thou.

I've never used Mandriva.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
TheJoe: I am terribly, terribly disappointed with Ubuntu.
Things started going downhill from Hardy Heron, when things turned into "innovation". Things were changed to distract from consistency and usability, to make way for innovation and user friendliness.
This is something that should not be in Canonical's hands. Linux and OSS is about freedom, in both usability and license.
Social and cloud integration and moving the window buttons to the left hand side are just a few things that point to Ubuntu's impending total collapse. Innovation is eating the project up.
Ubuntu was made as a reguarly updated alternative to Debian, which has very infrequent updates and its packages are very old for usability instead of high version numbers. This system worked wonderfully until Canoncal felt that "new users" needed a bit of hand holding.
Yes. Ubuntu is a fantastic starting point for Linux users. Or at least, it used to be. It no longer is. There are no good choices for the new user anymore.
If I ever use Linux, I tend to use Arch which gives me 360 degrees of freedom with my system, and I like it that.

I feel the same, I remember the old days when Ubuntu was a project with promise. Now it's a sham of it's former self. I guess everything goes from good to bad after a long while, heck Windows started off as a decent program and now turned into the ugly M$ corporation that purposely annihilates all competition we see nowadays. Canonical really shouldn't have their hands on Ubuntu, I agree with you on that.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
phanboy4: RAGING JOE.

Yeah. Joe needs a breather. Those damn window buttons just WON'T STAY STILL RAAAAAAAWR
avatar
phanboy4: Used Gentoo for several years. Loved it. Arch is a close second.

I loved Gentoo for years too. Ubuntu inspired me to give it a pass, though. I've been reasonably happy ever since. I hope someday they get the sound system figured out, though. A new set of modules and patches and workarounds for existing apps every year or so gets old after a while. Though I recognize that it breaks compatibilities in newer, better, more efficient ways, PortAudio makes me want to kill.
Posted April 30, 2010
avatar
TheJoe: ....
avatar
Fenixp: Isn't mandriva based upon older versions of Ubuntu? I have a good experience with that, since it's... Well... Pretty much the same thing, it just had way better performance on my system :D I am far from being sure thou.

no.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandriva_Linux
Pages:
1
2
3
4
5
This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)Ubuntu 10.04 released!(61 posts)(61 posts)
(61 posts)