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toxicTom: And I was afraid I was crossing a line here :-)....
Not at all, and I agree with you about the armour. I get the point that it's to make the female character look alluring, and if it's done in the right way it can work nicely. Games that don't take themselves too seriously can usually pull it off, but with the more serious games, it just ruins the look and feel of the game. It can be used in a serious game, especially if it's the style of the tribe/warriors, such as the Forsworn rebel faction. If it's men and women wearing similar armour then it looks fine, but when you have a big strong man in full armour and woman warrior stood next to him in bikini-armour, it just looks silly and unrealistic.

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toxicTom: The obvious one would be "if I'm to stare at someone's ass for the next 40+ hours it should at least be a nice looking one"...
That seems to be one of the main reason I hear for guys playing female character. Which is an okay reason, it's understandable that if you are going to stare at a character for hours on end that it should at least appeal to you. But I'm sure as with you, there are other reason why they enjoy playing female characters, even if they don't know why. Perhaps it's just because it makes a change from all the male characters that dominate games, or that it allows you to play in a different mindset with a woman. You mention "especially of I can create one with that "deceiving looks" - pretty, maybe a little fragile - but deadly", it would be unlikely you would play like this with a male character (though nothing would stop you), so perhaps it's the new outlook on the game that you enjoy, experiencing it through a different prospective than just the male hero role. Or maybe you just realised that we women are more kick arse then you men ;-).
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ddickinson: Out of curiosity, why do you prefer to play female characters when there is no romance? I understand why you would prefer not to in a romance story, but what makes you prefer women in normal stories over the male characters?
Wouldn't it be better to ask those questions in the boys thread?
It's rather hard to filter out the girls answers here and I have to admit, that I'm a bit responsible too.
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Klumpen0815: Wouldn't it be better to ask those questions in the boys thread?
It's rather hard to filter out the girls answers here and I have to admit, that I'm a bit responsible too.
You are probably right, but as the thread is a bit quiet at the moment, I thought it wouldn't really matter. I can always ask it again for the guys giveaway. I was thinking of having a few questions on the next giveaway, people (the guys or the girls) can answer all the questions or just the ones they want. I am quite interested to see what variety of genres we have for the guys and what kind of off-topic discussion develop, if any.
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ddickinson: RPG's are a little different, especially if there is a lot of character building interactions. The female characters also seem to be limited in what they can do in RPGs. Take Diablo 2 that I mentioned earlier in the thread. I prefer to play as the Barbarian or the Paladin, I enjoy beating the hell out of my enemy, get up close and personal and bash the living crap out of the demonic forces with my sword, axe, club or mace, hear them squeal in pain as I slay them and scream for more blood...BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! Sorry about that, got a little carried away :-D. As there is not a lot of character development in Diablo 2, it's not really and issue, but I would have preferred to play a female character who could also use hand to hand weapons for some good pummelling.

It's much worse when the game allows character development, where you make decisions that effect the story. The whole point of a roleplaying game is that I become engrossed in the story, that I picture myself as the valiant hero. It's a bit had to do that when you're stuck playing a man all the time, or even worse, a female character who is trapped in a story full of somewhat repetitive clichés.

The part you mention about being able to play female character with the same (or comparable) options as a male is something I would love. Take my Diablo 2 example, I would love there to be a warrior maiden or a Valkyrie type warrior who is the female white knight. She can handle some magic but also swords, axes, and other hand weapons. Just like the Paladin, but more kick arse :-).
But there is, and you can!
There are several melee builds you can make with the amazon in Diablo 2, if you can find the right gear as some of these builds are heavily gear-dependent. You can make a spearazon that fights with a lance in close combat instead of throwing javelins from afar, or a tankazon that fights with sword & shield and relies on the skills from the passive skills tree.
The amazon's skill tree is the most versatile and most fun of all the characters in Diablo 2, playing a regular bowazon is fun as well but it was the last thing I tried as everything else seemed more interesting.

And don't forget about the Valkyrie, it's the most durable summon of any character in the game. If you put enough skill points into your Valkyrie, she can even tank boss monsters. And depending on which aura she spawns with, she looks quite awe-inspiring as she stands there and stoically pokes away at her enemies with a war lance, one monster at a time and not being the least bit worried about being completely surrounded in close quarter combat. All of this while listening to Wagner on her iPod.
Post edited October 25, 2014 by awalterj
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awalterj: ...
But you see, close combat with a lance is nothing compared to an axe, war hammer, or a trusty sword. It has been a while since I played Diablo 2, but I did not know (or maybe I just forgot) that Amazons could carry swords.

As for the Valkyrie, well it is only a summon, if it had been a playable character, then that would have been my character of choice when it comes to cursing the three evils, while listing to Wagner of course :-). The only thing I would change would be the weapon, from a lance to a sword, as a sword is more traditional for a Shield Maiden of Valhalla (though they do still use spears, but I'm more of a sword girl).
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ddickinson: The only thing I would change would be the weapon, from a lance to a sword, as a sword is more traditional for a Shield Maiden of Valhalla (though they do still use spears, but I'm more of a sword girl).
Fast battle axe (with a quite tiny blade) + (often big) round shield was way more common for warriors back then afaik.
Post edited October 25, 2014 by Klumpen0815
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ddickinson: Or maybe you just realised that we women are more kick arse then you men ;-).
Well in a way you definitely are. I was there both times when my wife gave birth to our little ones. And each time it was impressive, fascinating and yes, frightening. Since then I know what real fighting, enduring and triumph means. No warrior defeating hundreds of foes on the battlefield can compare to that. And women all over the world do it (have have done it for almost eternity) thousands of times a day.

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ddickinson: Perhaps it's just because it makes a change from all the male characters that dominate games, or that it allows you to play in a different mindset with a woman. You mention "especially of I can create one with that "deceiving looks" - pretty, maybe a little fragile - but deadly", it would be unlikely you would play like this with a male character (though nothing would stop you), so perhaps it's the new outlook on the game that you enjoy, experiencing it through a different prospective than just the male hero role.
Yes you might be up to something here. I find the "male hero" perspective... limiting. Even in games like TES that offer equal possibilities regardless of sex I find myself kind of "trapped" when I play a male hero. I know that this is entirely my doing. Or call it "imprint". I find it a lot easier to play the compassionate role when playing a female character. I think the mental spectrum is a lot broader. I can be the infamous "damsel in distress" (okay most games don't support this) on the one extreme or the tough warrior woman (Xena FTW) on the other side of the spectrum. As a male character I find myself limited (or I'm limiting myself) to be the "manly man". The "boys don't cry"-rule is pretty hard to get rid of. A strange side effect of this is, while I tend to play characters on the "good" side of the spectrum as female character I will be more curious for the grey areas, playing more shady and often "dirty". As a male character I tend to play a more "Paladin" approach with stricter rules to do no evil and an overall more present (self-imposed) code of fairness.

Well to be clear that's all considering the more "free" games (mostly RPG). I will not as Garret from Thief ask the guard for a fair duel. Nor will I as April from TLJ go look for the sniper rifle.

So in the end one reason for me to play female characters could be to get rid of mental blockades that I grew up with and that would be enforced or awakened by playing a male character. Makes for easier exploration of all the "what ifs" that a game offers. Especially playing "a little more evil" is easier with female characters for me - not because women are inherently more evil *snicker* - but to get rid of the "having to be a gentleman and shining knight" that somehow is anchored in my brain. As I said - playing a "set" character, like Garret or Agent 47 or the Postal dude frees me of these limits - because they are obviously not ME. But even in a game like Planescape: Torment where the character is "set" but in beginning much like a blank sheet I feel the compulsion to act more like the "I'm a good male man" that I can't really seem to get rid of - that has become some form instinct. And the difference is even more pronounced in true "open" games like TES or Fallout or VtM:Bloodlines.
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toxicTom: ...
Thank you for the very insightful response, it is a very good explanation of why a guy plays a female character, and it's much more than just "something pretty to look at".

You seem to reinforce what I was thinking. I figured that most guys would have a set perception for a male character, maybe due to the fact that they are always portrayed the same in movies and games. I understand you point about feeling trapped as a male character, as we tend to put ourselves into the character, you are limited to your own values. If you are generally a nice, kind hearted person, then it's only logical that this comes out when you role-play. As you can't really put yourself in the female character's shoes, it allows you the freedom to imagine a wider spectrum of roles, from the slightly vulnerable to the slightly evil.

Perhaps this is why I like playing the melee characters that are normally men. I think I would be less blood hungry if I were playing as a female character, even one that had the same features as a male character. I don't think I would change my style too much, but I think I would be more open to magic and archery as an extension to my sword and shield as a female character. I guess like you, I would play the (female) character with some of myself in there, whereas with the male characters I can have a bit of fun and play the mindless barbarian.
Post edited October 26, 2014 by ddickinson
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ddickinson: Or maybe you just realised that we women are more kick arse then you men ;-).
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toxicTom: Well in a way you definitely are. I was there both times when my wife gave birth to our little ones. And each time it was impressive, fascinating and yes, frightening. Since then I know what real fighting, enduring and triumph means. No warrior defeating hundreds of foes on the battlefield can compare to that. And women all over the world do it (have have done it for almost eternity) thousands of times a day.

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ddickinson: Perhaps it's just because it makes a change from all the male characters that dominate games, or that it allows you to play in a different mindset with a woman. You mention "especially of I can create one with that "deceiving looks" - pretty, maybe a little fragile - but deadly", it would be unlikely you would play like this with a male character (though nothing would stop you), so perhaps it's the new outlook on the game that you enjoy, experiencing it through a different prospective than just the male hero role.
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toxicTom: Yes you might be up to something here. I find the "male hero" perspective... limiting. Even in games like TES that offer equal possibilities regardless of sex I find myself kind of "trapped" when I play a male hero. I know that this is entirely my doing. Or call it "imprint". I find it a lot easier to play the compassionate role when playing a female character. I think the mental spectrum is a lot broader. I can be the infamous "damsel in distress" (okay most games don't support this) on the one extreme or the tough warrior woman (Xena FTW) on the other side of the spectrum. As a male character I find myself limited (or I'm limiting myself) to be the "manly man". The "boys don't cry"-rule is pretty hard to get rid of. A strange side effect of this is, while I tend to play characters on the "good" side of the spectrum as female character I will be more curious for the grey areas, playing more shady and often "dirty". As a male character I tend to play a more "Paladin" approach with stricter rules to do no evil and an overall more present (self-imposed) code of fairness.

Well to be clear that's all considering the more "free" games (mostly RPG). I will not as Garret from Thief ask the guard for a fair duel. Nor will I as April from TLJ go look for the sniper rifle.

So in the end one reason for me to play female characters could be to get rid of mental blockades that I grew up with and that would be enforced or awakened by playing a male character. Makes for easier exploration of all the "what ifs" that a game offers. Especially playing "a little more evil" is easier with female characters for me - not because women are inherently more evil *snicker* - but to get rid of the "having to be a gentleman and shining knight" that somehow is anchored in my brain. As I said - playing a "set" character, like Garret or Agent 47 or the Postal dude frees me of these limits - because they are obviously not ME. But even in a game like Planescape: Torment where the character is "set" but in beginning much like a blank sheet I feel the compulsion to act more like the "I'm a good male man" that I can't really seem to get rid of - that has become some form instinct. And the difference is even more pronounced in true "open" games like TES or Fallout or VtM:Bloodlines.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFBOQzSk14c
Yes. I'll pass on having babies though after I've seen what it's like :-P
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awalterj: There are strategy games with little to no busywork and high stress (Incubation) and strategy games with lots of busy work and little to no stress (Anno & Settlers series) , but I can't think of many strategy games that have little busywork and are low stress at the same time, I'm sure there are such games but I'm currently drawing a blank here.

How about Advance Wars? Aside form having to resupply your units (ammo & fuel) there isn't a lot of micromanaging and it's easy to keep the overview. Due to the game being turn based, it is more like a tricky puzzle game, it will make your brain smoke at times but it's not hectic or stressful.
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FoxySage: Hmm, interesting. I don't find strategy games stressful, i play them because they're relaxing to play and you can play them for hours on end. (Mainly turn-based strategy like Civilization, and slow paced RTS games like The Settlers, EU IV, Age of Empires)

I like playing games in my own pace, that lets me think over my actions and different strategies/tactics. Any games that requires quick reflexes and/or snap decisions i find stressful.
My husband and son like strategy games more than I do. They also find the type you describe to be relaxing. I was just trying to work out why I didn't respond the same way. I'll take a look at Advance Wars sometime. After all, even if I don't get into it, I can pass it on to family members who probably will. Thanks for the recommendation!
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toxicTom: Yes. I'll pass on having babies though after I've seen what it's like :-P
No fear, I will have as much fun with the 'guys giveaway' as I do with this one, though I suspect vastly less attention.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcjlzSod0CE
I like to ask is this Giveaway conteset even finished?
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Elmofongo: I like to ask is this Giveaway conteset even finished?
Nope! From the OP
6. The giveaway will end on Sunday 26th October, at 12:00 GMT.

Tomorrow, its only a day away! *sings*
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awalterj: ...
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ddickinson: But you see, close combat with a lance is nothing compared to an axe, war hammer, or a trusty sword. It has been a while since I played Diablo 2, but I did not know (or maybe I just forgot) that Amazons could carry swords.

As for the Valkyrie, well it is only a summon, if it had been a playable character, then that would have been my character of choice when it comes to cursing the three evils, while listing to Wagner of course :-). The only thing I would change would be the weapon, from a lance to a sword, as a sword is more traditional for a Shield Maiden of Valhalla (though they do still use spears, but I'm more of a sword girl).
Amazons can carry swords but they don't have any skills in their skill tree that add elemental damage to sword attacks or other one-handed melee weapons, only to spears, javelins and bows. So it seems pointless to go down the one-handed melee weapon route but there is a way to build a sword & shield (or axe/mace/flail & shield) amazon: you'll have to put all your skill points into the passive tree, maxing out the valkyrie, critical strike and defense skills until you are a real shield maiden that is so hard to hit that most monsters would die of old age before they could land a single blow on you - but of course you'll compassionately put them out of their misery first.
This is probably one of the most unorthodox builds you can have, it's slow and tedious going because you have no attacks that damage multiple enemies at the same time so you'll have to hack & slay everything one by one - which kinda sounds like what you wanted anyway.
Post edited October 26, 2014 by awalterj