It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
But one does buy movies to watch them just for a couple of hours and I don't have a problem with purchasing used movies either, even if they try to come up with things like DIVX. Shouldn't you then be allowed to sell it to somebody else, or are you stuck with something that perhaps you didn't like and regret purchasing on the first place? And if you don't want Gamestop to take all the money from such a sale, you can try to sell it directly to somebody through a garage sale or anything along those lines. At least that's the way I see it.
I don't buy used games, aside from 8/16 bit carts no longer readily produced.
I don't often buy new either, $100 Australian (Upto $140 in some cases for new 360/PS3 releases) is just insane. But since people here will continue to buy at that price, it continues to sell at that price.
I do know it it was cheaper, I would do more than 1 or 2 retail purchases a year (even at the reduced price I do now). GOG/Steam/Stardock/etc... at least have the value right, even if the AUD to USD is pretty poor right now.
Aside from the price drop, after a few months there is a good supply of patches and mods out there.
I wouldn't say other industries don't complain, they are just less vocal about it to their potential customers. With the gaming community, such a customer base involves many fairly technology savy people.
Post edited December 05, 2008 by Ois
Deejrandom makes an excellent point. For people in his situation with a limited budget, used games are a great way to get games and keep playing. Eventually, when money becomes less of an issue, these gamers will remember good games they've played and will more than likely purchase new games from those companies.
On the other side of things, there are people like me where the budget is much more fluid and can afford to spend money on new games. But (still being budget conscious) used games offer me the chance to try out something different and see if I like it. If I do, I'm highly likely to buy more from that company. This is exactly what happened with BioWare and NWN. I bought NWN1 used and loved it. As a result, I bought both NWN1 expansions new and the Diamond Edition twice (for family) and this also led me to buy Jade Empire, KotOR, NWN2 and both the NWN2 expansions, and even The Witcher. So, as a result of one used game purchase BioWare, Obsidian, and even CDProjekt benefited by me buying several other games from them as new purchases (and I bought The Witcher twice: original release and Enhanced Edition).
It's a huge mistake for game companies to try to kill the used game market. IMO, it will only serve to bite them in that a$$. (Of course, at this point, seeing what they're doing with their misguided DRM schemes and their attempts to kill second hand sales, I feel they probably deserve what they get.)
The EB Games across the street from where I live (talk about temptation) had informed me in the summer that they are no longer buying/selling used PC games. No problems or concerns as yet with the console stuff but to hell with the PC people.
I feel that when something happens in the PC world it is but a matter of time before the same is reflected for consoles. Can't the publishers/devs. admit that there is enough buisness for EVERYONE to be happy? Maybe publishers have too many executives that need to maintain their golf club memberships.
What's next, will publishers attack video stores like Blockbuster for renting games that they don't see any benefit from?
Well, the reason for them not selling used PC games anymore is because of CD keys and playing online and stuff like that, at least that's what they told me last time I asked.
avatar
honorbuddy: Well, the reason for them not selling used PC games anymore is because of CD keys and playing online and stuff like that, at least that's what they told me last time I asked.

Yeah, most places I know stopped selling used PC games, there's only a few shops I know of that do, Goodwill, St. Vincent Depaul, and a local store, called Bookmans, but I doubt many, if any of you, have heard of Bookmans
avatar
deejrandom: Because they got money from the original purchase.
avatar
pkt-zer0: I was asking why is it better that someone else is getting money off subsequent purchases. The way I see it, you and the developer both lose money, while the completely unnecessary middleman gets rich. So instead of buying a used copy of a recent game, might as well just pirate it, as the developers aren't seeing a cent from you either way.
avatar
deejrandom: You don't see Ford wanting money for every used car that is sold in America. The Used Car dealerships get all the money for those; such is life.

Car-to-software comparisons won't really work here. You don't buy cars just to ride about in them for 20-40 hours or whatever duration that a single-player game lasts nowadays.

I don't agree; you buy both of them. I'm talking about the after market sales, not the value of the piece. And i don't see it the same way as you, obviously. You call it an unnecessary middle man, but there is always a middle man...even during the original purchase of the game.
I don't see any difference from used game sales then any other "used" media or owned object...the concept is the same. The reason the "middle" man is making money is because he is buying the used games back from people who don't want them any more. Kind of like a used car dealer buys cars back from people that don't want them any more...or a used CD shop..used tv shop...etc. The reason he makes money is because he puts out the money to buy the games back, just like any seller of used items.
avatar
deejrandom: You call it an unnecessary middle man, but there is always a middle man...even during the original purchase of the game.

And indeed, I'd be in favour of removing them from the equation as well, as much as possible. (See Greg Costikyan's rants on the death of the gaming industry) Still, 30% or whatever it is the devs get from retail sales are more than the 0% from second-hand sales.
Anyhow, I still don't see how the existence of Gamestop and its ilk is beneficial, overall. The only argument for them seemed to be giving an alternative to people with less money - that's what piracy is for. Basically, if you don't intend to give the developers any money for their trouble, why the heck would you just throw your cash out the window? Save up instead so you can buy a game later on.
avatar
pkt-zer0: Anyhow, I still don't see how the existence of Gamestop and its ilk is beneficial, overall. The only argument for them seemed to be giving an alternative to people with less money - that's what piracy is for. Basically, if you don't intend to give the developers any money for their trouble, why the heck would you just throw your cash out the window? Save up instead so you can buy a game later on.

Yes, but second hand stores are a moral alternative to those opposed to outright stealing. At least somebody gets their money, even if they did nothing for it but put a price tag on it.
avatar
Weclock: Yes, but second hand stores are a moral alternative to those opposed to outright stealing. At least somebody gets their money, even if they did nothing for it but put a price tag on it.

Yeah, the same way somebody would get your money if you just threw it out the window. People should try being more discerning consumers than that. Also, someone gets your money even if you pirate a game now and save up for a new game to buy later. The difference being that in the latter case, the people getting your cash are actually a bit more involved with the creation of the product than just sticking a price tag on the box.
If you consider depriving the developers of cash "outright stealing", then clearly buying games second-hand is no lesser a crime.
avatar
pkt-zer0: Yeah, the same way somebody would get your money if you just threw it out the window. People should try being more discerning consumers than that. Also, someone gets your money even if you pirate a game now and save up for a new game to buy later. The difference being that in the latter case, the people getting your cash are actually a bit more involved with the creation of the product than just sticking a price tag on the box.
If you consider depriving the developers of cash "outright stealing", then clearly buying games second-hand is no lesser a crime.

Throughout history people always had the right to sell their used possessions. No one ever complained about it, because it's so simple - I bought it, I can sell it. Please give me one logical reason why I should be deprived of my legal right to sell something I no longer need or use?
The only argument for them seemed to be giving an alternative to people with less money - that's what piracy is for.

So if I cannot afford a new car I should pick one on the street and steel it, instead of buying used, cheaper one? Forgive me, but that's simply the most stupid argument I ever read on this board.
Post edited December 05, 2008 by sahib
avatar
sahib: So if I cannot afford a new car I should pick one on the street and steel it, instead of buying used, cheaper one? Forgive me, but that's simply the most stupid argument I ever read on this board.

I already noted the car analogies didn't work. If you managed to make an identical copy of a car for no cost whatsoever - sure, go ahead. Maybe the used-car salesmen will find a more productive job, then.
Post edited December 05, 2008 by pkt-zer0
avatar
deejrandom: You call it an unnecessary middle man, but there is always a middle man...even during the original purchase of the game.
avatar
pkt-zer0: And indeed, I'd be in favour of removing them from the equation as well, as much as possible. (See Greg Costikyan's rants on the death of the gaming industry) Still, 30% or whatever it is the devs get from retail sales are more than the 0% from second-hand sales.
Anyhow, I still don't see how the existence of Gamestop and its ilk is beneficial, overall. The only argument for them seemed to be giving an alternative to people with less money - that's what piracy is for. Basically, if you don't intend to give the developers any money for their trouble, why the heck would you just throw your cash out the window? Save up instead so you can buy a game later on.

i think the existence of game stop and the like are just a part of being in a commercial society with a free market. I already know that the devs got the money from the game I purchase, used or not. Being on a budget, why should I pay 60 to 70 bucks for a new 360 game when I can use that same 60 bucks and buy 3 older games for a lot less money?
This is the reality of it: The game companies need to realize this and rework their strategy accordingly. GOG.com is a great idea. I also like the idea of DLC and games on the xbox arcade/PSN/steam etc. These are reworked gaming strategies and they are all doing very well.
As for equating buying a used game with piracy? That is very unfair. You wouldn't say "well you might as well pirate a movie instead of buying a used copy of it because you are poor."
I think it boils down to this: I don't agree with you on this subject, I don't look at buying a used game as something less moral just because the game company that made it isn't getting my money.
The Companies need to step up, stop belly aching, and change with the times.
avatar
sahib: So if I cannot afford a new car I should pick one on the street and steel it, instead of buying used, cheaper one? Forgive me, but that's simply the most stupid argument I ever read on this board.
avatar
pkt-zer0: I already noted the car analogies didn't work. If you managed to make an identical copy of a car for no cost whatsoever - sure, go ahead. Maybe the used-car salesmen will find a more productive job, then.

You noted it yes, but you were wrong ;)
avatar
sahib: So if I cannot afford a new car I should pick one on the street and steel it, instead of buying used, cheaper one? Forgive me, but that's simply the most stupid argument I ever read on this board.
avatar
pkt-zer0: I already noted the car analogies didn't work.

Yup, and I fully disagree with you. I can sell a new car after driving it for a day, simply because I don't like the colour. I can sell a game after 3 years, when I finally stop playing it - and there are some games, like BG2, that I still install and play. There is no difference between a car and a game. Both are sold (you see that word there - sold, not rented) as specific products, designed for a specific purpose. One is transportation, the other is entertainment. As long as I bought anything I have the right to destroy it, sell it, give it away for free or even eat it. No one can stop me, because the idea of buying and selling your possessions is as old as mankind itself.
Post edited December 05, 2008 by sahib