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Coelocanth: According to Vogel's blog, there's no DRM on their games.

Here is a thread I started in December 2009 on the Spiderweb forum regarding DRM. You tell me if it has DRM or not?
I just reread it again, and I am still confused. It seems DRMish to me, and the GG version uses SecuRom for sure; I would think GG does not throw that on without the direction of the publisher.
By-the-way, Jeff's blog says, "No Obnoxious DRM!" not "No DRM" on his games. You have to keep asking for unlock codes if you change machines, take it to a new machine, etc.
If this is what GOG did I doubt people would think it DRM free.
Post edited August 27, 2010 by Faithful
I'd say Geneforge all the way. When I tried the demo of Geneforge 1 I just got rather sucked in. Had to buy it.
The story varies a bit. In my opinion it gets better and better.
There's usually also a few factions to side with, adding to replayability.(Though there's only two in 3 and 4.)
You can play the game without having played the previous ones, sure. But you get a better understanding of the various ideologies and so on by having played them. Plus there's a few characters you might notice from the previous games. Quite interesting to see how they change.
Also, Overthrow IS the grand finale. It probably means a bit more to someone who has played the previous games, rather than someone who has just found it.
Note: There is no good or bad in Geneforge. Just different ideologies really. Though there are one or two I'm sure many would agree is "bad" or "evil".
Also, Faithful is correct. It is rather light DRM, but DRM none the less.
Just a registration key to unlock. As many as you like. (More or less.) But it is still DRM.
Yep, good point. I misread Jeff's blog. Note that I wasn't making a call on it either way, just trying to provide info (that should teach me to read my source a little more carefully). I consider a game key to be a light form of DRM as well.
I wish I were wrong on the DRM as I would really like to play the games. I could even live with a game key, but Jeff's games are more than that.
You cannot buy the game receive a key and have that key work forever. You have to keep asking for new keys for anything new you want to do. For me, it is that which is the deal breaker, it a bit more than lite DRM it must snap your computers footprint and log it and if you alter it, bingo, new key needed.
Just too bad.
Really? It didn't sound that restrictive from the description. That is too bad.
The obvious solution would be the back up the install file onto DVD, lock, stock and barrel. Apparently, if you treat it like a .zip install game (e.g. Gish, Lugaru etc) you should get round it.
And anyway, the developer's very forthcoming with keys. Apparently.
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Faithful: Here is a thread I started in December 2009 on the Spiderweb forum regarding DRM. You tell me if it has DRM or not?
I just reread it again, and I am still confused. It seems DRMish to me, and the GG version uses SecuRom for sure; I would think GG does not throw that on without the direction of the publisher.
By-the-way, Jeff's blog says, "No Obnoxious DRM!" not "No DRM" on his games. You have to keep asking for unlock codes if you change machines, take it to a new machine, etc.
If this is what GOG did I doubt people would think it DRM free.

Curse it! I bought it off Gamersgate before reading that thread! Looks like if you uninstall the game, you need to get another serial number...
I'm not sure I like this any more than I do with EA's 5-activation limit -- my personal preference.
Post edited August 29, 2010 by lowyhong
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lowyhong: Curse it! I bought it off Gamersgate before reading that thread! Looks like if you uninstall the game, you need to get another serial number...

At least with a GamersGate purchase you can just ask GamersGate to sort that out for you.
Maybe it is only me, but it seems foolish to repeatedly make paying customers ask for new codes each and every time.
I con only imagine that you will end up waiting a day or so to play the game since you have to wait for the code. Unless each install plays like the demo until the new code is received and activated.
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Faithful: Maybe it is only me, but it seems foolish to repeatedly make paying customers ask for new codes each and every time.

It's not just you :P
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Faithful: Maybe it is only me, but it seems foolish to repeatedly make paying customers ask for new codes each and every time.
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lowyhong: It's not just you :P

Well, that a relief! Thanks :o)
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Faithful: I wish I were wrong on the DRM as I would really like to play the games. I could even live with a game key, but Jeff's games are more than that.
You cannot buy the game receive a key and have that key work forever. You have to keep asking for new keys for anything new you want to do. For me, it is that which is the deal breaker, it a bit more than lite DRM it must snap your computers footprint and log it and if you alter it, bingo, new key needed.
Just too bad.

I don't know how the file structure works in Windows for preference files in userspace, but as mentioned above on the link to the Spiderweb forums, on the Mac, Geneforge and Avernum store the license code that is emailed to you in a .plist file stored in your user's Preferences folder. If you want to move your install of Geneforge or Avernum to another Mac you own/use, just copy the .plist file over as well. I'd assume that you'd do a similar procedure in Windows. Additionally, my experience, whenever I've done a reinstall of Avernum or Geneforge my registration is always retained, provided that I didn't do a totally clean reinstall.
I don't want to get into a debate about what is and what isn't DRM, but I generally associate the term with excessive systems that go out of their way to limit the amount of installations that can be made with the game (e.g. Hothead Games' five-installation limit on Penny Arcade Adventures), require a user to be online all the time, need to be played through a specific additional client app, require online "activation", or are actually directly tied to the user's specific hardware (Kavasoft's iConquer comes to mind).
In my experience, Jeff's games up to date don't suffer from any of those problems. I can install on as many of my machines as I wish, and I'm not tied down to any limited online activation system. Considering the sheer amount of work that Jeff's put into the game (remember, Spiderweb is essentially a one-man shop), I don't mind at all that Jeff has the system that he has.
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rampancy: I don't know how the file structure works in Windows for preference files in userspace, but as mentioned above on the link to the Spiderweb forums, on the Mac, Geneforge and Avernum store the license code that is emailed to you in a .plist file stored in your user's Preferences folder. If you want to move your install of Geneforge or Avernum to another Mac you own/use, just copy the .plist file over as well. I'd assume that you'd do a similar procedure in Windows. Additionally, my experience, whenever I've done a reinstall of Avernum or Geneforge my registration is always retained, provided that I didn't do a totally clean reinstall.

Thanks for the tip bro!!! I missed that tip in the Spiderweb forums.
Anyone have an idea on where the file is located in Windows?
Post edited August 29, 2010 by lowyhong
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lowyhong: Thanks for the tip bro!!! I missed that tip in the Spiderweb forums.
Anyone have an idea on where the file is located in Windows?

From what I can ascertain at this link: [url=here]http://www.avernum.com/avernum3/techsupp.html[/url], it looks like the file you're looking for would be called something like "Avernum3.dat" (obviously, the name would be more relevant to which game you have). It might be in the root game folder, though beyond that I don't know where else it could be; I'm sure an experienced Windows user would know.
PS: I really suggest you sign up and get involved on the Spiderweb Forums; there are a lot of really friendly folks there who'll help you if you get stuck, especially if you want to be a "Power Gamer" and get as much of the good loot (e.g. artifacts and weapons) as possible.
Post edited August 29, 2010 by rampancy
The community seems like an ok bunch, so I'll take your advice and try that when I get around to playing the games. Thanks again.