Both Condemned 1 and Manhunt 1 are excellent games. Manhunt 2 is not, I haven't played Condemned 2.

Manhunt 2 was okay, it lacked much needed polish.

MH1 and Cond 1 are great tho, and I never bothered with Cond 2 because there was never a PC port.

It was either Manhunt or Condemned that I bought on the cheap and tried to install... only to find that the DRM made it unplayable. I don't remember what it was but that DRM system did NOT like my computer. I remembered the disasters revolving around StarForce (probably not the DRM used but I related the two) and purged the thing from my system.

It would be nice to see them on GOG free of that insanity.

That's sucks, it was probably Condemned. I don't remember if Manhunt originally came with any DRM.

Once again, I've said that at least Postal has historical significance in the development of computer gaming. Otherwise, yes my critique applies to the Postal series as well as the Manhunt series (which is not currently available on GOG).

The violence in Carmageddon is cartoonish and absurd; it is not intended to be visceral or emulate real violence -- just like it is not intended to simulate real racing.

I am just asking GOG (and probably all of us) to take a step back and really think about whether or not the ultra-violence I've described in previous posts crosses the line.

I know that all of us have a line that should not be crossed for violence in video games, and for me that line is drawn when a game is designed to incentivize and reward extremely brutal/visceral actions (e.g. slitting someone's throat, blowing off their head with a gun, smashing in the face of an enemy until their head explodes, etc.) -- keep in mind these actions happen to enemies who are already "down".

I guess the next question is to GOG and the community, "Where do you draw the line and why?" For those who might claim never to draw the line, then "Are all forms and expressions of violence appropriate for video games? Even the most extreme and disturbing?"

Saying "it's just a game" would oversimplify the argument a little too much, but the bottom line is that it's an arcadey blow things up... game.

Are the actions depicted by the arcade character moral? Probably not.
Is it over the top? Probably.
Is it entertaining? Probably so.

If someone looks at a game like this and/or Carmageddon and says, "Hey, this looks like a great idea!" I feel like the problem lies more in that particular individual than the game.
While we're on the topic of "disturbing" violence, I really would like to see Harvester on GOG (after a thread this weekend reminded me of how wonderfully ridiculous it is).

Exactly. I know that when i play games, i take it with "a pinch of salt" (meaning i don't take it seriously). I've played Manhunt, Postal 2, Leisure suit larry box office bust, duke nukem, GTA series. It doesn't matter.

What i kind of get frustrated about is the fact that distribution sights use the extreme violence as a selling point, before any gameplay merits it may have. Look at this, it's edgy! You should buy because you can't see or do these things anywhere else. It's "mature".

If someone doesn't agree with something, that's fine. They don't have to buy it, and they shouldn't prevent those that do want to buy it. I don't need an imaginary line. If I come across a painting at a museum I don't like, I don't get to rip it off the wall and trash it so no one else can look at it. Walk on.

If Postal had any significance to gaming, it was a middle finger to censorship. When you asked GOG to take it down because you don't agree with it, that's pretty much censorship no? That's the same mentality people like Lieberman have, which is why Postal 2's easiest difficulty mode is "Leibermode". Again poking fun at people like that.

I respect your opinion about the game, but not requesting GOG to take it down. That's unneeded.

I think the cartoonish graphics softens the violence quite a bit. Some of the stuff in phantasmagoria is far more disturbing imo, and that's been on GOG for ages.

And I don't really care how significant a game is to gaming history. I'm not a historian, I'm a gamer. I only care if a game is fun, and this game looks like it is.

Agreed. Manhunt is a surprisingly good game, especially in the later levels when the game actually starts having an actual and interesting plot. It's sad that the game's reputation overshadowed all of its qualities. But well, Rockstar knew what they were getting into. :P

In terms of game mechanics Postal 2 may not reward extreme violence but purely psychologically speaking it is supposed to and does. This is proven by any player who does that kind of stuff in the game while technically he's not being rewarded - but he does enjoy experimenting with the disgusting options Postal gives him (and enjoyment is a reward, eh?). And I'm quite sure that that's true for pretty much all people who like the game. That's why Postal 2 is even more disturbing than Manhunt or any other game I've ever seen.

This looks like something I might have played in my teens, but not anymore.

I understand your point now. GOG has recently had a few ultraviolent releases where they tout the violence as the number one "Grab me!" appeal of the game.

To be fair though, GOG usually tries to highlight the biggest factors of a release that would "differentiate" it from other games. A few days ago, GOG highlighted the difficulty and dungeoneering for a Grimrock promo. Before that, they highlighted FTL's ship design/management or something or other.

Looking at the catalog, I think it's safe to say that ultraviolence is just one of the many elements represented.

And that's why they should release some Humongous Entertainment classics to balance ou-oookkkkaaayyy I'm done for now.