That is the Issue.

give it a shot by starting a thread on either the Steam forums or RPS stating "I like Origin" and see what happens.

Why would I do that when I already know how badly people will behave? Besides, as I mentioned I am not on any crusade to convert people to my own preferences so I don't need to start threads telling people how much I like Steam, Origin, GOG, Mac App Store or anyplace else.

I don't care where other people want to shop. It's fine with me and I guess that would be the difference.

You, good sir (or mam), are not what I term a "Steam Fanboy."

I have my own issues with Steam, but those issues are about Valve leveraging its user base to punish publishers who try to release PC game versions that do not include Steam. It has been stated time and time again that the most damaging policies Valve has for Steam is that every game released on Steam has to have its own version and that said Steam version can only accept Steam version DLC.

the first issue hurts Publishers because in addition to carrying support costs for any console versions (which can run into the hundreds of thousands per platform) they would then have to foot the bill for supporting two nearly identical versions on one platform, the second issue tightens the screws because it damages competing vendors ability to competitively price against steam while generating even more support costs as you then have your support staff wasting time on the clock dealing with version mismatch issues because consumers don't understand why they can't use Steam DLC with non-Steam versions of their games (or vise versa) when both versions are for the PC.

this leaves publishers with the choice of eating excessive support costs to support both vanilla PC and Steam versions, or alienating one of the user bases by abandoning it to focus on the other. This is not unlike Walmart deciding that it would require unique versions of games sold, with accompanying version specific DLC that would only be sold through Walmart. (Something that was entirely possible 10 years ago when Walmart mandated specific content edited versions of movies and books that it sold, and publishers had to conform because Walmart controlled the market)

I myself could give not give two shits if someone likes using Steam, the issue I have is that by in large I have little choice besides "Steam or don't play it" when it comes to big budget PC titles. Normally I would blame the publishers for being douche bags, but most publishers would happily support universal PC releases if it didn't double their support costs, and they have to pay the bills as much as anyone else ... Steam is the one causing this issue, not them.

the problem is that what few publishers break from Steam's control and choose the path less traveled of supporting vanilla PC releases, the "true believers" of steam pour out into hate parades to discredit the competing service and force publishers back into exclusively supporting Steam.

Even if the effect is kind of backhanded (as EA did it more to support its partner vendors that were being hurt by Steam), developing Origin has probably been the most consumer friendly thing EA has done in years because it gives customers a universal platform to access their games, regardless of where you bought them from (remember that Origin will honor ANY product code for a EA title, even DLC bought from steam, with a Origin version of the game).

yet EA is raping everyone's nostrils with Origin.

Same for Ubisoft fucking puppys with Uplay, but no mention of how Ubisoft has made a near complete reversal on its always on DRM (as well as beeing one of GOG's biggest & oldest partners for putting out classic titles DRM free), because Uplay is shit for not being Steam.

Heh, because it amuses me...

All hail GabeN, our glorious leader! See the Marvel of his Beard! No, I am not worthy to wear one myself, but perhaps some day I will be! All curse SecuROM, Tages, Gamestop, Origin, our eternal enemies! Vigilance, friends, ever vigilance! It is your task friends, nay your duty, to report and correct any untruths spread by the Enemy! Brave GabeN from his seat at Olympus, Seattle courageously fought the dragons of Microsoft, the foul chimera of retail, the demons of consol^H^H^H^H *expunge expunge* with no more than a new piece of software, a mod for an 8 year old game and Half Life 2. How could he succeed? How could be conquer adversity and major negativity from Our Enemies? With Bravery, Honesty and Good Old Fashioned Pluck, that's how! Brave GabeN, creator of the method of downloading software (!!!), creator of patching (!!!), creator of multiplayer gaming (!!! seriously, I've heard it said...), smiter of DRM (!!!), he who Saved PC gaming singlehandedly (!!!), he who always has the best and cheapest sales (!!!) etc etc (yeah, not quite an increase in chocolate production for the tenth straight year, but certainly a lot of myths dressed up in certainty)

To be moderately serious, the thing that imo really sets 'steam worship'- and many other types of fandom, frankly- apart from fascism is that Steam fans tend to prosetylise and evangelise while fascists don't. Fascists want an exclusive club that makes them feel intrinsically special due to an accident of birth, they don't want just everyone to join and want some groups excluded. Certain groups of football fans could be termed as fascists (and often are actual fascists), but not many other fan groups. And, of course, there's the small matter of real world fascism being a deeply unpleasant philosophy responsible for millions of deaths while video gaming and fandom in general is a trivial and ultimately unimportant pursuit, to consider.

A far better analogue to steam fans would be a religious one, where a Messianic Figure gives Wonderous Gifts to his Followers from the Goodness of His Heart while Bravely Defending adherents from the Benighted Hordes outside. Why would anyone not want to be one of the Enlightened? Is it mere Ignorance? Is it Malfeasance? There's only one way to find out, spread The Word, Brother! But listen not to the Infidel, for he Lies!

Also, you got the heroic narrative part wrong. ALL of the Chosen People (and ONLY the Chosen People) are heroes.

But yeah, that's pretty much it. It's a BIG DEAL though -- they're more interested in conversion than obliteration, and that makes them easier to placate and ignore, which makes them relatively unthreatening. As you described, some fandoms (film and music have a few of them too) do have a truly fascist world-view, and these tend to be exceptionally dangerous people (see second-wave black metal, and some offshoots of it). By comparison, a crazy semi-religious Steam worshipper (even one with an axe and a loose definition of heresy) is actually far less problematic.

The topic is steam fanboys, that's the first party. Adolf Hitler gets a mention in the first line of the second paragraph the OP quotes, that's the second party.

The thing is, Steam does not make anybody do anything. A lot of your post read to me like you are very unhappy about the exclusivity of some titles to Steam and your perceived reasons for why that is, how wrong it is, how helpless the publishers are, etc.

I think developers and publishers simply evaluate cost versus benefit and make decisions accordingly to maximize profits when deciding where to sell their games and if they are willing to be exclusive to any particular platform, be it Steam, PS3, XBox 360, etc. It's all about the money. EA did not create Origin and Ubisoft did not drop its online DRM, to be nice folks. Those decisions were motivated by money. Period.

Nobody makes a company like Bethesda decide to release a game like Skyrim with a requirement that the Steam client be used. Obviously, Bethesda decided the features were a plus and that going exclusive with Steam which also offers a DRM few gamers care about was a plus. Certainly, access to 40,000,000 online game shoppers was a plus too. Why didn't they release a version without Steam? I guess they decided they couldn't be bothered - it was not worth it - there was not enough profit potential to bother doing so.

Is that all Valve and Steam's fault? Well, I guess one could argue that it is in that they have built Steam up from a simple, buggy, multiplayer client into an online store that is also a fully featured gaming platform at this point which also features DRM publisher's like that seems to palatable to a very large group of game buying consumers.

I respect that you may hate this outcome if you hate DRM of any kind and you hate clients or if you simply hate Gabe for whatever personal reasons you might have. But as I just pointed out above, Steam is not some terrible evil that poor hapless publishers are bending over to in subservience.

As for the DLC issue, EA tried to pull a fast one with in-app purchases of DLC that cut Steam out of the money but still used them to serve up the goods from their servers. That's pretty hard to defend in my opinion. I am not particularly anti-EA either but that was a dick move and no wonder Valve said no way that's gonna fly. So, EA took their toys and went home. Fair enough. But that was EA's choice and again this just goes to show that they had a choice after all. They said screw Steam, we want ALL the money from DLC sales so we'll run our own store then and get it, which is fine. It's their products. They can sell them however they want to sell them.

As for special Steam versions of games and DLC, well of course they are. A unique build is required if you are going to use any client features such as the DRM which is probably the most commonly used one. A unique build is required if you want Steam Workshop, achievements, multiplayer using VAC, etc. These however are BENEFITS to developers and publishers they choose to take advantage of. Nobody is making them do this. They could create a vanilla version that conforms to Steams packaging requirements in the most basic way and incur little cost in addition to a non-Steam release. As always, it is their call.

So, you really cannot blame Steam for creating an environment that some developers and publishers find attractive for releasing titles exclusive to Steam. If you want to blame somebody for that, you need to blame those same developers and publishers because it is them making the choice, not Valve.

As far as consumers go too, nobody is making any of us do anything either. There are lots of options aside of Steam including for the AAA Steam exclusives although you'll have to look beyond the PC to consoles for them. Exclusives are not a new thing and they are certainly here to stay. We might as well get used to it. I personally am not thrilled about EA/Origin exclusives really but oh, well. There are certain titles that will be which I want to play so I'll adjust my attitude and have fun with them anyway.

Personally, I feel that at the end of the day none of this stuff is a terribly big deal and I don't let any of it ever get me upset. It wouldn't help anyway. They don't care what I think, none of them. It's all about what the markets want, will bear, etc. and I'm just one little Indian.

The moderators on the Steam forum are definitely fascists, I remember seeing people banned for the most trivial of things, even threads with mild criticism toward Valve are shut-down quickly without explanation.

I quite like how, after only the other day discovering what fascism was (based on a google search and a review of a wikipedia entry) you consider you are qualified to argue with other people (who clearly know what they are talking about) about the finer points of fascism.

Dunning-Kruger Effect in action right here folks.

The two Parties I was referring to were either the Nazi Party, or Hitler himself. While he's given a mention in that quote, the 2 paragraphs are a straight dump from Wikipedia, and Godwin's law requires someone to make a direct comparison between someone and one of those 2, not a possible hint.

Several indie devs have said that the interface, developer tools and service that Steam provides are quite amazing. Have you ever considered the possibility that the service Steam is offering (MP interface, achievements interface, workshop integration, autopatching, cloud and community features) are just good enough that Steam doesn't actually have to force anyone to do anything? I can tell you for a fact that developing all that stuff in-house is pretty damn difficult and costly.
You're either with us or against us, eh?

Just as a little sidenote there: If Steam was the evil dictatorship you're making it out to be, I'm fairly sure indie devs would not make steam-free copies of their games out of the profits from Steam sales. Steam is powerful enough to force exclusivity.

i'll let you have it, in the end we'd just be arguing over some moronic fuckwit who's equating steam fans with fascists.

Fair point, we'll call it a draw.