My Final Verdict on LOST: Come for the plot, stay for the characters.
The first few seasons get your brain active in trying to figure out what the hell is going on at the island. You stick it out cliff hanger after cliff hanger hoping you will figure it out, but it only gets increasingly confusing. Along the way, there is some great character development. You really grow attached to these people from viewing their struggles. To appreciate LOST, you have to be willing to give up on the plot at some point while still caring about the characters.
I can't say I'm disappointed in the finale, but only because the rest of the season had prepared me for the fact that there was no way in hell they could tie all the loose strings together in the plot. In fact, I really liked the finale. What they did was create incredible pathos for all of the characters. I think they excelled at that. I was moved throughout the final episode and cried like a baby every time another couple in the sideways reality regained their memory of their life on the island. Though I disliked them at first, I came to really appreciate the flash sideways scenes by the end of this season because in the remembering moments it made everything on the island seem more important and worthwhile. The finale tied things up for me emotionally, if not intellectually.
Ultimately, I do feel a bit jipped about the plot of the whole series though. I put quite a lot of thought into trying to figure out what was going on, only to realize that it's an unsolvable riddle. The story is too nonsensical for there to be any real derivable answers that coherently weave everything together. I felt similarly about the movie Donnie Darko, which also provided a really cool experience that was ultimately never explainable, though it gave the illusion of providing you clues that would lead to some sort of sensible conclusion.
I've enjoyed LOST. I would still recommend it to those that haven't seen it. Ultimately, I don't know if an explanation to all of the events of the season would have felt all that satisfying. It's a bit of a cop out, but understanding the show is about understanding the struggles of the people, not making sense of the situations that they struggle through. I still found that a gratifying experience, despite some lingering feeling that I should have been able to figure it all out. I guess that's how life is though.

Same here.
I don't see what the point of the show is, and I don't care.
Actually, I don't watch TV at all anymore. It's all garbage.

I will fight you if it means proving TNG is the best of the lot. Voyager was so bad that IIRC one of the episodes was labeled non-canon.

How do you know it's garbage if you don't watch it?
Personally, I think over the past decade, TV has become a much better medium than it was in the past. I prefer TV series over movies now. Series like Californication, LOST, 24, The Office, 30 Rock, Dexter and others have convinced me that television can be excellent.

Oh fucking hell, no you didn't.

TNG the best out of three?
The Q episodes... man. They were epic indeed. There was so much crap tough...
Remember the episode where people devolved? I so hope it is not canon either because it was 3.14 times worse than warp 10 Voyager episode. That episode at least had some funny moments.
Voyager was interesting. I really enjoyed it. Kim, Paris, FUCKING DOCTOR, Janeway, Kes. all fun characters... TNG had Data and Picard and sometimes the doc and miles. Rest of the cast... boring.
The storyline. lost from home, unexplored regions, far from known civilization, full of dangers beats what TNG ever showed us (with Q and borg centered episodes)
There is also TNGs outdatteness if i may make up a word. good ol' 80's never really suit me. It is not about special effects... it is about the style of camp tng had. Magic monsters, talking heads in the center of galaxy (great episode because Barkley makes everything win but still if it wasn't him the plot would be pretty bad)
Voyager was much better than TNG.
Of course both shows don't compare to the awesomeness of what was DS9.
Great characters such as bashir, miles, quark.... Q punching Sisko...
Can't forget of course about magnificent bastards aka Cardassians, Garak is one of the coolest characters ever in S-F series... along O'Niel and Mckay.
Great storylines, politics, brutal truth behind happy federation, amusing ferengi business, great war stories, magnificent space battles.
Deep Space Nine is the best ST.
Sorry for incoherent reply... but if you wanna fight over it....
Bring it on sweetcheeks!
:)

Don't dis the Admiral!

Worst. Star Trek Series. Ever.
1) They recycled plots from previous Star Trek series'
2) The actors were TOLD to act wooden. Just watch some out-takes. The wooden as a table Robert Beltran suddenly bursts with charisma.
3) Technobabble was taken to whole new levels. Deus Ex Machina was invented in nearly every episode.
4) The Borg were utterly ruined. Sure TNG already spoiled them in I Borg but First Contact repaired some of that damage ony for Voyager to completely flush them down the toilet as a threat
5) Races no one cared about. Hirogen? Crenim? Kazon? Malon? - kill them all off I don't care.
6) Torres was pointless. We already explored Klingons with Worf in TNG. Seska the Cardassian was wasted.
7) Neelix.
8) Tom Paris was originally trying to sex up Kes who was 8 years old. Yes 8!
9) Reliance on guest stars like The Rock and Andy Dick
10) Neelix
11) No character development whatsoever. The characters were the same in Endgame as they were in Caretaker. Janeway would in one episode bend over backwards for an Alien culture, the next she would stomp all over them.
12) Voyager was as powerful as the writers wanted it to be. It was pummeled by the technologically inferior Kazon then next week it's blowing up Borg cubes for shits and giggles.
13) Q you mentioned. It speaks volumes that the most memorable episodes feature a character from TNG. Other memorable episodes also feature such characters as Geordie, Troi and Barklay.
14) Neelix
Deep Space Nine was Trek at it's finest. TNG a close second for the Klingon Civil war and any episode with the Romulans. TOS is third simply because it wasn't as good as you remember. Enterprise comes in fourth for the thrid season with Manny Coto as show runner (Berman had gone completely mad by this point). Voyager comes in very much last after the Animated TOS.

I've stopped watching Lost in the beginning of 4th season, I think, mostly because I ran out of time to do it and catch with my favorite series. Also, I used to watch mostly in dvd with my ex, who was responsible to make me like a lot of series.
Anyway, it was very fun until that point, but there were many things non-sense happening by the time and I kind of lost the interest.
But yesterday I saw the finale... well, I love to watch the ending of famous series :P Didn't look so bad, although I believe many were disappointed because of unanswered questions. But I think it ended nice (SPOILER ALERT), just the same way it started, with a Jack close up on his closed eyes.

First i watched Voyager.... then tng. so evne if the recycled the plots they did them much better
I should rip your heart out and feed it to your sister because you say Picardo acts wooden. :D
Worf, tasha, the the telepath... Number One... they didn't act wooden?
Maybe.
TNG had less babble more MAGIC! (remember one of the first episodes with the shiftchanger?
Ruined because they got their butt kicked at the end? Because there was even more terrifying enemy out there capable of taking even borg out?
Far from it. Borg in TNG were empty characters. Space zombies. Voyager gave them character development. we saw how they work, we saw there flaws and we saw that Voyager even with inside help stand no chances against them. The only way the managed to survive was trickery, deception, not brute force like Enterprise tried to fight them. Borg were awesome.
and TNG had ferengi and bunch of other races i cannot even name. what is the difference
Never liked Klingon as I see them as bullies, dirty animals and hated every episode of worf (including episodes on DS9) Torres added something to the Klingon myth... her conflict between two sides. mediocre storyline but there were few gems out there.
agreed. one character. Much better than wesley tough...
And? Your point? she was an adult. her Earth age matters not. Is Whoopie's character (have her name at the tip of my tongue) a pedophile because she sexes up 40 year old man (who compared to her is just a child?)
Reliance? cameos
Frasier Crane the captain of federation ship...something... oh. and bringing ol' star trek characters is nothing more than fanwank. awesome but how is that different?
Acting Ensign Wesley Crusher!
Tuvok was... He was a vulcan tough. Character dev. would be wrong for him. We did see him a bit differently at the end tough.
We saw Doctor's evolution from simple sarcastic medical program who is just that to full grown member of the big family. Rebellious Torres calming herself growing up, Paris a father, a husband a person on whom you can count but who once was a complete loser...
Chakotay...okay: i got nuthing...
Never was inferior to Kazon. Against big armada and motherships little yoyager (which was not enterprise) stand no chances. Neither against borg. every time they won they won by trickery, and by having an inside knowledge provided by seven. rewatch the episodes and you will see that Voyager never fought 'fair' against Borg...
I mentioned Q in regards of TNG. Q there was much more interesting as he was more the God than trickster/benevolent angel as portrayed in Voyager (entirely in character tough)
Year of Hell, The whole war against the species... Unimatrix zero are very memorable. Better than Enterprise growing a baby. and holodeck is... a gate (man that was bad) Delixe: Child prodigy....
I had never seen TOS...
Hated the Klingon storyline. Hate Klingons altogether
Except when it involved Quark.
as of enterprise. saw only first season. need to catch up.
At least we are in agreement that DS9 rules.
But I just cannot place TNG above Voyager. I don't have the nostalgia googles like you seem to have (perfectly understandable. I have them for other stuff :) ) I had only seen the whole series just last year.
I don't believe it is as great as many claims.
Picard living a life on long dead planet, Four lights, data losing memories, mother who lost her son wants only revenge and she sees her son in Data...
Very memorable episodes. Great writing...
but there was SOO much crap.
already mentioned ship baby, anti-evolution, final of season 1, Shiftchanger, Wiliam becoming Q and doing cheap tricks...
and many many more.
The premise i also found less interesting, less fun than lost in space....
Characters: Picard, Data, Beverly (oh. remember the story with perverted ghost?) great characters.
and sometimes barkley (he is win) and miles (i really liked him in DS9)
rest
Worf, Wesley, Ryker, the blind guy (god dammit. having problems with names today) all boring characters who rarely had any interesting storyline.
so
DS9
big gap
Voyager
medium to small gap
TNG.

I literally grew up with ST. Watching a ST episode for like a dozen years every single night before bed. <3
Call me crazy, but I really, really like Enterprise. Probably because it used new technology while being filmed. But the plot was also enjoyable, and I felt somewhat deep character evolution.
About DS9, I actually :blush: let a few tears go when it ended. It was an epic finale. Hell, the whole DS9 was epic!
TNG and Voyager, I watched a few seasons of both, but can't really tell which one is better, probably because I never got to the end of both.
TOS, I haven't seen more than a few episodes of it, it was before my time I guess.
I would love a new ST to come out, though making a plot would be somewhat hard (without messing up the story of the previous series).

Watching Voyager before TNG makes your position more understandable. Remember that TNG was 1989 VOY was 1995.
Never said Picardo was wooden, but he was hamstrung by lousy writing and poor directing. For the record I have always said Picardo, Ryan and Russ were the best things about VOY. Jeri Ryan in particular is to be applauded for being a decent actor despite the fact she was only hired because Berman wanted a sexy Borg.
On the Technobabble TNG was far better because at least Data and LaForge tried to explain it. They didn't bother in VOY. An example from VOY episode Scorpion Pt 1:
Torres: "I'm going to try a skeletal lock"
Janeway: "Skeletal lock?"
Torres: "I've only just thought about it"
Me: Facepalm
The Borg were better as collective Cyborgs. They were better being a faceless enemy. making them human robbed them of any sense of mystery.
TNG had races people cared about. You may not like Klingons but the fact is we all know them. We know Cardassians, we know Ferengi and we only know a little about the Romulans (TNG: Unification = Epic). The races in VOY didn't matter as we know they only exist for that episode.
Worf had far better development than Torres did. We actually watched him through TNG and DS9 become not a Klingon but what Klingon's aspire to be. It was the magic of his character. He idolized people like Gowron and Kahless then realized they were deeply flawed individuals. Torres had a dream about a ghost ship...
Neelix was Berman's Mary Sue. He was in almost every episode even when there was no need for him. The writers even had to stretch to include him at Berman's order.
Regardless of how Ocampans age Kes was still 8 years old. The Neelix/Paris love triangle was uncomfortable for many people because of that. Regardless of Jennifer Lien's real age the character should have been off limits for teh sechs.
There is a difference with the use of guest stars. The Rock actually had an episode written for him (Tsunkatze) which was horrible. There were plenty of others who played roles like Kutwood Smith. My issue is writing an episode specifically to include a guest star.
On Wesley Crusher even Wil Wheaton hated the character. He was a demand from Gene Roddenberry. When Roddenberry died Crusher was phased out. Kicking Roddenberry upstairs was the smartest thing Paramount did.
Character development was shite as you admit. The Doctor, Seven and Tuvok are the only ones who developed, also the best actors.
Species 8472 were destroyed by that stupid episode where they found the Federation training camp. Nice one Berman. A writer comes up with a real genuine threat and you completely ruin them by making them not so bad after all and Chakotay might even sex one up!

i know that's why i mentioned it. But that does not mean tng is better because it was first...
you really don't give much credit to janeway actress. Remember the fake voyager reconstruction by the aliens? She played Earth Evil Empire captain. Brilliant...
and here character had quite few brilliant episodes. Janeway was different from other captains... she was motherly. I loved that but it did hear it wasn't that popular... doesn't mean she is not great actress (rewatch the episode where she was pissed at torres for betraying her or the one with q junior)
heh. yeah. similar scene was in ds9...
for double episode maybe.
after that they needed a characterization or they are just space zombies like in shaun of the dead.
dangerous... yet hardly a suspense creating enemies. first contact was good right? because it gave us queen.
True... ferengi were pathetic in TNG. only in DS9 we saw them differently...
Enterprise was flying around familiar territory. rarely going where no man has gone before.
it of course gave us more species development. doesn't make it better (for example: borg did get character development and you hate it)
DS9 gave us even more than both series combined when it comes to cardassian. we ddin't know practically anything about them but at the end of ds9 we know their arts, foods, culture, politics, family structure, history...
it depends on what story was being showned.
Voyager was always on the move. Only few species could keep up with them. always new frontier
DS9 was stationary: in depth development of certain species like ferengin or cardassian.
TNG was something in between. It had bunch of crappy aliens never mentioned again and bunch of well developed ones.
Not a plus not a minus... just how well the species were presented.
And Voyager had few interesting species... with their own civil wars, problems, and cultures. Present for only one episode but brining something new every week.
Well. worf did have 11 years of development...
and torres had more than just dreams about ghost ship (what was so bad about this? religion, afterlife, i would assume for Klingon fan it would be an interesting ep)
did you forget the baby episode. were we got glimpse on what it means to be half-breed. that idealistic federation for a child different is still the same crap we suffer now.
episode about whether it is ethical to play with child's genes? To force others (the doctor) to do what you want even if you believe it is for great good?
Yes. I did admit... no point attacking him over again... because TNG was not better with the boy wonder.
So?
people are idiots.
Kes was an adult. whether she was 8 years old doesn't matter.
or are you suggesting it is alright for human adult to sleep with 25 year old El-Aurian (Guinan species) even tough the alien will be still a child?
Kes was an adult. Young one but an adult. she would die at age 12 or something right? so she should die alone? really. that's so lame i don't even...
rolf. you know i didn't actually see that episode (tsunkatze)...
and Kurtwood played the captain in year of hell? and he was brilliant.
so what's the problem with guest stars if they do job properly. Judge the episode for what it is, whether the guest star does the job properly and fits, whether the writing is good. Personally i don't give a crap. Heck. I didn't even recognized Grammer when made a cameo but i had seen every single episode but two (the last ones) of Frasier. i blame the age difference.
So? should i rate tng higher because everyone agrees that Wesley sux and that finally managed to kick him out?
I didn't admit that. i said the opposite (with the exception of chakotay. he was really the same all the way through)
Paris, Kim from geeky pushover to making Klingon snatch wet badass, Torres, Kes...
Did he really sex one up? don't remember that details.
and i do admit that was not one of the greatest episodes. but you cannot say they ruined the whole species really?
Personally i don't consider villains who are always evil like borg at first and species 8472 to be good villains.
for few episodes. but then they are getting repetitive and boring.
introduction of the queen, info on who the borg are and how they operate. more info on how the collective operates and who are the drones (blowing ships full of them doesn't look so nice does it? in TNG it wasn't that a big of a deal. just mindless zombies)
that made enemy great
the 8472 they could handle it better i admit. much better. but the idea is sound. A random species is a threat to them. they prepare an espionage mission only to be discovered by said species. faces were given to the enemy... even if it ended on peaceful tone it still made 8472 something better than they were before (well... few more episodes should have been devoted to it as the episode was not that good)
great talking to you. I miss star trek now. need to see whole ent. series :)

SG1

Stargate, really? I guess I'll give it a shot if I find the time.