It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
Hey Goggers;

As many of you know, we announced on last Friday that we are going to introduce regional pricing for 3 new games coming up on GOG.com soon. Looking at the amount of reactions (over 3,500 comments at this very moment), it is obvious that this change is making many of you guys worried. We must have failed to clearly explain why our pricing policy for (some) newer games will change and what this means as a matter of fact for our PC & MAC classic games, which account for over 80% of our catalogue.

To be honest, our announcement was a bit vague simply because our future pricing policy is not 100% set in stone yet and we were just worried to make any promises before it was. You know, GOG.com has been growing quickly (thanks to you!), and the more we grow, the more we are worried to make some of you guys disappointed. This is why we were so (over-)cautious with our announcement.

We should have just been upfront about why we've made these changes and what they mean for us in the future and what we're planning. So let's talk. To be clear: what I'm talking about below is our plan. It's a plan that we believe we can accomplish, but while it's what we want to do with GOG, it may change some before it actually sees the light of day. Please don’t blame me for talking open-heartedly today and telling you about the plans and pricing policy we want to fight for and eventually achieve. The below plans aren't sure. The only guarantee I can give you is that we’ll do our best to fight for gamers while still making sure GOG.com as a whole grows (because well, we still want to be around 50 years from now, you know!). So, enough for the introduction, let’s get things started.

Why does GOG.com need to offer newer games at all?

We've been in business for 5 years now, and we've signed a big percentage of all of the classic content that can be legally untangled. There are still some big companies left we're trying to bring into the GOG.com fold, like LucasArts, Microsoft, Take2 and Bethesda, but what classic titles will we sign in the future once we have those partners on-board? We need to sign newer games or else just fire everyone and keep selling the same limited catalog. Either we bring you “not so old” releases from 2010+ or brand-new AAA titles, because these will become classic games tomorrow. It’s as simple as that.

Also, well, we want to expand beyond just classic games, hence the fact we have been offering you brand-new indie releases for almost 2 years now. Why expanding? Well, obviously, because the more games we sell, the more legitimacy we have on the market and the more likely it is that we can achieve our mission: making all PC & MAC video games 100% DRM-free, whether classic or brand-new titles.

To be straightforward (excuse my French):DRM is shit-- we'll never have any of it. It treats legitimate customers like rubbish and pirates don't have to bother with it. It's bad for gamers, and it's also bad for business and our partners. We want to make it easy and convenient for users to buy and play games; rather than give piracy a try. Happy gamers equals a healthy gaming industry; and this is what we fight for. Anyway, I am sure you well know our opinions about DRM.

To make the world of gaming DRM-free, we need to convince top-tier publishers & developers to give us a try with new games, just like they did with classic games. We need to make more case studies for the gaming industry, just like we successfully did back in 2011 with The Witcher 2. It was our first ever 100% DRM-free AAA day-1 release. GOG.com was the 2nd best-selling digital distribution platform worldwide for this title thanks to you guys, despite having regional prices for it. We need more breakthroughs like this to be able to show all the devs and publishers in our industry that DRM-free digital distribution is actually good for their business and their fans. And when I say breakthroughs, I am talking about really kick-ass games, with a potential metacritic score of 85% or more, AA+ and AAA kind of titles.

And this is exactly why we signed those 3 games we told you about last Friday. We believe those 3 games can be massive hits for hardcore gamers, that they can help us spread the DRM-free model among the industry for newer games and we did our best to convince their rights holders to give GOG.com a try. One of those games, as you see already, is Age of Wonders 3. We're planning more titles even beyond these first 3 soon.

Alright, but why is regional pricing needed for those (only 3 so far!) newer games then?

First of all, you have to be aware of an important fact when it comes to newer games: GOG.com cannot really decide what the prices should be. Top-tier developers and publishers usually have contractual obligations with their retail partners that oblige them to offer the game at the same price digitally and in retail. When they don’t have such contractual obligations, they are still encouraged to do so, or else their games might not get any exposure on the shelves in your favorite shops. This will change over time (as digital sales should overtake retail sales in the near future), but as of today, this is still a problem our industry is facing because retail is a big chunk of revenue and there’s nothing GOG.com can do to change that. We need to charge the recommended retail price for the boxed copies of the games in order for developers (or publishers) to either not get sued or at least get their games visible on shelves. You may recall that our sister company CD Projekt RED got sued for that in the past and we don’t want our partners to suffer from that too.

On top of that, you have to know that there are still many top-tier devs and publishers that are scared about DRM-free gaming. They're half-convinced it will make piracy worse, and flat pricing means that we're also asking them to earn less, too. Earn less, you say? Why is that? Well, when we sell a game in the EU or UK, VAT gets deducted from the price before anyone receives any profit. That means we're asking our partners to try out DRM-free gaming and at the same time also earn 19% - 25% less from us. Other stores, such as Steam, price their games regionally and have pricing that's more equitable to developers and publishers. So flat pricing + DRM-Free is something many devs and publishers simply refuse. Can you blame them? The best argument we can make to convince a publisher or developer to try DRM-Free gaming is that it earns money. Telling them to sacrifice income while they try selling a game with no copy protection is not a way to make that argument.

Getting back to those 3 new upcoming games coming up. The first one is Age of Wonders 3, which you can pre-order right now on GOG.com. The next 2 ones will be Divine Divinity: Original Sin and The Witcher 3. We’re very excited to offer those games DRM-free worldwide and we hope you’ll love them.

Still, we know some countries are really being screwed with regional pricing (Western Europe, UK, Australia) and as mentioned above, we’ll do our very best, for every release of a new game, to convince our partners to offer something special for the gamers living there.

And don’t forget guys: if regional pricing for those few big (as in, “AA+”) new games is a problem for you, you can always wait. In a few months. The game will be discounted on sale, and at 60, 70, or 80% off, the price difference will be minimal indeed. In a few years it will become a classic in its own right, and then we have the possibility to to make it flat-priced anyway (read next!) The choice is always yours. All we are after is to present it to you 100% DRM-free. We are sure you will make the best choice for yourself, and let others enjoy their own freedom to make choices as well.

So, what is going to happen with classic games then?

Classic content accounts for about 80% of our catalog, so yes, this is a super important topic. We've mentioned here above that we can’t control prices for new games, but we do have a lot of influence when it comes to classic games. GOG.com is the store that made this market visible and viable digitally, and we're the ones who established the prices we charge. We believe that we have a good record to argue for fair pricing with our partners.

So let's talk about the pricing for classics that we're shooting for. For $5.99 classics, we would like to make the games 3.49 GBP, 4.49 EUR, 199 RUB, and $6.49 AUD. For $9.99 classics, our targets are 5.99 GBP, 7.49 EUR, 349 RUB, and $10.99 AUD. This is what we’ve got in mind at the moment. We’ll do our best to make that happen, and we think it will. How? Well, we have made our partners quite happy with GOG.com's sales for years - thanks to you guys :). We have created a global, legal, successful digital distribution market of classics for them. This market didn't exist 5 years ago. By (re)making all those games compatible with modern operating systems for MAC and PC, we've made forgotten games profitable again. When it comes to classic games, we can tell them that we know more about this market than anyone. :) Being retrogaming freaks ourselves, we know that 5.99 EUR or GBP is crazy expensive for a classic game (compared to 5.99 USD). We have always argued that classic games only sell well if they have reasonable prices. Unfair regional pricing equals piracy and that’s the last thing anybody wants.

What’s next?

We will do our very best to make all of the above happen. This means three things:

First, we will work to make our industry go DRM-free in the future for both classic and new games (that’s our mission!).

Second, we will fight hard to have an attractive offer for those AA+ new games for our European, British and Australian users, despite regional pricing that we have to stick to.

Third, we will switch to fair local pricing for classic games, as I mentioned above.

TheEnigmaticT earlier mentioned that he would eat his hat if we ever brought DRM to GOG.com. I'm going to go one step further: by the end of this year, I'm making the promise that we will have converted our classic catalog over to fair regional pricing as outlined above. If not, we'll set up a record a video of some horrible public shaming for me, TheEnigmaticT, and w0rma. In fact, you know what? Feel free to make suggestions below for something appropriate (but also safe enough that we won't get the video banned on YouTube) so you feel that we're motivated to get this done quickly. I'll pick one that's scary enough from the comments below and we'll let you know which one we're sticking to.

I hope that this explanation has helped ease your worry a bit and help you keep your faith in GOG.com as a place that's different, awesome, and that always fights for what's best for gamers. If you have any questions, comments or ideas, feel free to address them to us below and TheEnigmaticT and I will answer them to the best of our abilities tomorrow. We hear you loud and clear, so please do continue sharing your feedback with us. At the end of the day GOG.com is your place; without you guys it would just be a website where a few crazy people from Europe talk about old games. :)

I end many of my emails with this, but there's rarely a time to use it more appropriately than here:

“Best DRM-free wishes,

Guillaume Rambourg,
(TheFrenchMonk)
Managing Director -- GOG.com”
avatar
torqual76: 3. Non censored versions. With different versions for regions i will get the german, censored, low violence version. I do not want to buy censored versions of games.
Fallout 1 and 2 are censored here anyway.
If you fail to meet your goals, your punishment should be bringing all of the dosbox games to native linux packaging along with offering linux clients for games that have them!
avatar
hedwards: In many ways Steam has a better client. It's mostly the DRM related bits that are the problem. I do all my downloading on Linux because lgogdownloader is vastly superior.
avatar
graspee: Not all games on steam have drm- the steamworks drm is optional. You probably know this already but quite a few games on steam will run fine from their directories without steam even running, even ones that can interact with steam for achievements etc.- as is the case for dungeons of dredmor.
Yes, but most of the general crappiness in the Steam client is directly related to the DRM and related code.
avatar
Agrilla: now in denmark the top of the page reed
pre-order €44.99

that is the infamous 1 euro = 1 doller scrow over we normal see in steam. Now also starting to show up on GOG.
I know, I just meant it's not exactly news, it's the reason this thread exists.
avatar
torqual76: 3. Non censored versions. With different versions for regions i will get the german, censored, low violence version. I do not want to buy censored versions of games.
avatar
graspee: Fallout 1 and 2 are censored here anyway.
Fallout 1 or 2 are not here anyway.
high rated
avatar
StormHammer: Thank you for adding further clarification on this point, TeT. It is appreciated.

I wonder if you are willing (or able) to answer some more specific questions?

- What happens if you cannot convince existing publishers to maintain the low prices you have outlined for 'classic' titles? Will you simply raise the prices if a publisher demands it? Or would those games be removed from the catalogue?
It hasn't come up yet, so we don't know.

avatar
StormHammer: - Would the regional pricing policy still remain if you fail in your attempt to attract new AAA games from larger publishers (EA, Ubisoft, Microsoft, Activision, Disney, Warner Bros.) onto the site DRM-Free?
Let's say that we have our reasons to believe it will not fail.

avatar
StormHammer: - Will gifting across regions still be allowed for regionally priced titles?
For the moment, yes. If we see something crazy like 40% of the revenue from a game comes from gift codes sold from Russia and redeemed elsewhere, we'll have to investigate other options. Basically, if people aren't complete tools, things will remain as they are.

avatar
StormHammer: - Will certain games be region-locked, or not be available in a region, if requested by the publisher? If so, how will that be implemented?
It has not really come up yet. That said, I don't know that regional availability of a game is crappy treatment from us. Preventing you from playing a game you bought because of your physical location is definitely crappy treatment and would fit under any definition of DRM I can think of. So that's certainly not in the works.

I guess the question is one of philisophy: if we can get a game, but are not allowed to sell it in a few countries that collectively make up less than 1% of our users, should we? Is a DRM-Free game (classic or new) for 99.5% of us worth denying the .5%?

avatar
StormHammer: - What currency will take precedence for a gifted game - the gift-giver's region, or the recipient?
I'm...not sure what you're asking. A gifted game is free for the user. Why would the currency matter?

avatar
StormHammer: - What further measures will be implemented (if any) to accommodate regular patching of games? I ask this because new AAA titles are notorious for requiring multiple patches.
There's an announcement that's pending on that, but it's a few months out now and if I spoil it I will have my thumbs removed with starving badgers. Suffice it to say that we're aware of the problem and looking at ways to make it better.

avatar
StormHammer: - How will you prevent people from simply faking accounts in other (cheaper) regions to get around the regional pricing system?
The same way we prevent pirates from downloading our games from torrents. :)

avatar
StormHammer: - For European countries that do not use the Euro as their currency, will you be adding their local currency to the storefront in the future so they do not incur further conversion rate costs?
I know we'll be rolling out more currencies in the future. The exact what and when I do not know. I can guarantee that for some of the countries it won't be any time soon that they see their local currency on GOG. We're looking into whether it's generally better to keep countries that aren't on Euro on USD or if they'd be better off with EUR instead.

avatar
StormHammer: - You have agreed to offer pre-order bonus DLC for Age Of Wonders III, which means people who do not preorder will not receive it. Does this mean other games will now be offered for preorder with bonus DLC? Will such games be offered in the future with all DLC bundled together?
That's more or less unanswerable, since I'm sure we will sign games at E3 (which is in June) which we don't even know exist today.

avatar
StormHammer: - How many lemmings died as a result of all these changes?
Many lemmings died to bring us this information.

avatar
StormHammer: Thanks in advance for any answers you can offer.
Cheers. :)

EDIT: If people AREN'T complete tools. >.>
Post edited February 28, 2014 by TheEnigmaticT
avatar
srkelley5: If you fail to meet your goals, your punishment should be bringing all of the dosbox games to native linux packaging along with offering linux clients for games that have them!
Were they to add Linux support I might well forgive them, or at least speed the rate at which I stop being pissed at them.

But, for the time being, I won't be buying anything here.
avatar
CarrionCrow: Eye of the beholder franchise
Blade Runner
No One Lives Forever
Aliens vs. Predator 1+2
Emperor of the Fading Suns
Heavy gear
Mechwarrior games
The Wheel of Time

Gotta love grim realities of a situation. 8 names listed as 31 flavors of screwed, and personally interested in 5 of 'em.
Yeah. It's sad. :(

Life is easy. Then the lawyers get involved. >.>
high rated
avatar
TheEnigmaticT: For the moment, yes. If we see something crazy like 40% of the revenue from a game comes from gift codes sold from Russia and redeemed elsewhere, we'll have to investigate other options. Basically, if people are complete tools, things will remain as they are.
Emphasis mine.

Do you still not understand that a huge part of what's pissing people off here isn't the change, but the arrogant attitude that you guys are displaying? It was going to be messy anyways, but insulting us isn't going to improve things.
avatar
CarrionCrow: Eye of the beholder franchise
Blade Runner
No One Lives Forever
Aliens vs. Predator 1+2
Emperor of the Fading Suns
Heavy gear
Mechwarrior games
The Wheel of Time

Gotta love grim realities of a situation. 8 names listed as 31 flavors of screwed, and personally interested in 5 of 'em.
avatar
TheEnigmaticT: Yeah. It's sad. :(

Life is easy. Then the lawyers get involved. >.>
You can only do what's possible. I'll try to not break out the lit pitchforks next time I get an urge to remind myself how badly I draw Eye of the Beholder maps.
avatar
Darkalex6: It doesn't have less value. It's literally the same offer, except for a few pictures (much value, #wow).
It does have DRM though, but I am a vidicative little bastard and I should like to buy from people that don't lie to me - Steam never claimed to have any rules, I know what I am getting into.
I think that's many of us, and why GOG will lose so many customers.

DotEmu has regional pricing. I know that when I buy from them, and they never promised otherwise.

Steam has DRM and regional pricing. If I chose to buy from Steam (I don't), I'd know what I was letting myself in for.

GamersGate has more DRM-free games than GOG, and they are often cheaper even with regional pricing. Their downloader is intrusive and their All Steam All the Time for most newer games, pisses me off. But, again, I know what I'm letting myself in for if I go back there.

GOG built its whole business on two main principles, and then dropped one overnight, It then treated its customers like children or idiots when it decided to tell us. Something each GOG employee still seems to be doing with their condescending attitudes and false apologies.

I guess I must be vindictive as well because, as much as I would love to buy at least four games in today's sale, nah.....not happening.

I have principles and, unlike GOG, I was brought up to stick with them not drop them if something a little easier came along.
avatar
DianamicAbrasi0n: Stormhammer wrote:
Will certain games be region-locked, or not be available in a region, if requested by the publisher? If so, how will that be implemented?

It's bad enough that console platforms still permit that. If it were to seep into PC that would be truly AWFUL. Choices matter, and everyone should be able to play and support ALL of the games.
Unfortunately, it already has seeped onto PC on places like Steam. There are many games unavailable in the UK on Steam that are available in other regions, and vice versa. That is why I asked that specific question in relation to GOG.com.
high rated
avatar
TheEnigmaticT: <snip>
Kept quiet after stating my stance Tuesday (and just looking at staff replies now), and now I didn't mean to write anything so my mind's quite messy, but this is quite a reply. Unfortunately, doesn't change the fact itself.

From where I'm standing (and I hope you won't take this simple anger, an outburst, just wanting to make a mess or anything else of the sort - it's not... which incidentally also means there will be no "cooling off" for it), it does not matter why it was done and it does not matter that you will still provide a better service than any other shop of any significance (which is true). What matters is that flat price worldwide was one of your clear, specific principles and you now got rid of it. You said you never will, you made a point of this as one of your, shall we say, crusades, of the publishers you rejected over it, and now you wave it all away. Doesn't matter why, doesn't matter how much you try to make up for it, it starts and ends there.

Frankly, seeing as it's the "industry standard", I don't think anybody would have attacked you directly if from day one you'd have had such prices. I mean, nobody'd have noticed, it'd have been one less reason why you were the best games shop out there, but you'd have still been the best and the attacks over the issue would have been directed at publishers (and governments, where that's also a factor), as it is everywhere else. But that wasn't what you did. You chose this principle, and now you chose to move away from it. That doesn't fly. Can't and won't accept that.

As for the better service than others and doing it to have more games DRM-free, yes, that's true, as I said. However, if all you want is a DRM-free copy of a game, you don't need to purchase it. That's a fact, and you yourselves admit nobody needs to buy a game, but doing so is a choice. So DRM-free is a prerequisite to being worth buying, but not enough in itself. A good enough reason is wanting to support the developer, but in that case you try to see if you can purchase it directly. If not, you look at the intermediaries, which in this case are the publisher, which is usually the clear evil entity, and the store. If the store is no longer the good guy, to make up for the publisher, it's not worth it. And now you're no longer the good guy. Better than the rest doesn't make you good, if solely because you betrayed your principles, your word.

Bottom line, I never bought from Steam, Origin, Uplay, whatever, nor do I (or will I) have an account on any of those, and keep lashing out at those who do. At the same time, all these years till you finally offered a payment method I could use two months ago, I didn't "pirate" any game available on GOG, simply waiting till I'll be able to buy it, someday. Granted, was about to give up on that, but then PSC got implemented... Which incidentally also means I paid 8.5-8.8% more for my purchases over these 2 months, due to PSC's fees, which I grumbled about, but grumbled at PSC, not at you, "ate" those fees and that was that to finally be able to support you through purchases as well. (Incidentally, seeing as my currency isn't the Euro either, conversion fees would continue to be added anyway.)

Now, after such a betrayal, I can't say you're the exception anymore. Again, better than the rest doesn't mean good enough.

avatar
TheEnigmaticT: 2. That's problematic as I've mentioned in other posts. This would mean that the price for every game in the catalog would change every day. Also, we would be unable to advertise anywhere, send emails on the weekend to tell you what's on sale, or even post prices in sales to social media. It also means that anyone who comes to GOG.com will be unsure what price he or she will be asked to pay today, and in general results in a bad experience for the end users. For the majority of people who use any website, complicating the checkout process is a surefire way to make them not want to buy.
Wanted to set this aside (though I'm sure others have said the same by now): Why not simply say "x.xx USD or the equivalent in your local currency" or something of the sort? Solves the ad pricing problems, doesn't it? As for the checkout process, how about allowing people to select currency from their profile instead, like they select the country? So no changes to gamecards or checkout, just uses the selected currency from user settings.
That would make this an awesome change instead of a terrible one. (Terrible because it's that same betrayal of principle, no matter how tiny the difference is or the fact that for some it'll be even cheaper.)

(The video reply was poorer than these replies actually imho. Sorry.)
Post edited February 28, 2014 by Cavalary
This may have been answered already.

Say GOG offers a game for pre-order and the regional pricing is in effect, GOG offers a choice of 5 titles to the buyer to make the purchase "fair" the person buying the game is not a forumite and has no interest in any of the games on offer. Is that a case of "tough shit, those are your choices take it or leave it" ?

obviously that wouldnt be the official line in those exact words.
avatar
TheEnigmaticT: That's...actually pretty awesome. I hope you won't mind if we reply in kind. ;)
All right, I admit, that was cool :)
(as opposed to checking metascore when deciding what to release :))
Post edited February 28, 2014 by Novotnus