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This thread made me think back to my old Sidewinder 3d pro joystick. What an awesome piece of hardware this was. Solid, lots of buttons, worked like a charm. Sadly I have no idea if I still have it, but if I find it, I'm gonna try to build that USB adapter thingy for it.
There's 3 features that matter on a joystick:
1) Z Axis
2) Force Feeback
3) Buttons that don't break

Of the above #2 is pretty much the only one that you might not care about (unless you're going to log under 10 hours on your joystick, then 3 doesn't matter either).

Pay money for the features you want or you're just throwing cash in the toilette.
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NightK: What is sad is that almost none future games are compatible with Joysticks...
No worries...From time to time (I admit - seldom) new space-sim hits the market. In the mean time have a look on
that list
I see there many games that will be compatible with your T.16000 :-)
I also played some racing games using joystick - I guess it was not so fun as with racing wheel but still better experience than with keyboard.
Post edited June 17, 2011 by tburger
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NightK: What is sad is that almost none future games are compatible with Joysticks...
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tburger: No worries...From time to time (I admit - seldom) new space-sim hits the market. In the mean time have a look on
that list
I see there many games that will be compatible with your T.16000 :-)
I also played some racing games using joystick - I guess it was not so fun as with racing wheel but still better experience than with keyboard.
Thbe problem is games like freelancer who are not compatible with joystick and the upcoming CSIS http://spacesimcentral.com/?p=277
Post edited June 17, 2011 by NightK
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orcishgamer: There's 3 features that matter on a joystick:
1) Z Axis
2) Force Feeback
3) Buttons that don't break
Regarding this, I've read reviews about the very, very cheap quality and frailty of the T.16000 buttons, while the rest of the mechanics are fine.
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orcishgamer: There's 3 features that matter on a joystick:
1) Z Axis
2) Force Feeback
3) Buttons that don't break
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Antaniserse: Regarding this, I've read reviews about the very, very cheap quality and frailty of the T.16000 buttons, while the rest of the mechanics are fine.
Saitek's joysticks always had easily breakable buttons, too (maybe not now, back in the Mechwarrior 4 days, they did, though). Really, back in the day we all just went Sidewinder Pro, hell, I'd still have mine if someone hadn't stolen it at a LAN party. Those things were indestructible.

I think we had a thread at some point where some hardcore joystick folks listed their best picks. It's be worth searching until you found it, it even had some GOG staff input:)
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Antaniserse: Regarding this, I've read reviews about the very, very cheap quality and frailty of the T.16000 buttons, while the rest of the mechanics are fine.
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orcishgamer: Saitek's joysticks always had easily breakable buttons, too (maybe not now, back in the Mechwarrior 4 days, they did, though). Really, back in the day we all just went Sidewinder Pro, hell, I'd still have mine if someone hadn't stolen it at a LAN party. Those things were indestructible.

I think we had a thread at some point where some hardcore joystick folks listed their best picks. It's be worth searching until you found it, it even had some GOG staff input:)
I'll look for it! anyway, I already ordered one t16000 from amazon.co.uk.
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orcishgamer: Really, back in the day we all just went Sidewinder Pro, hell, I'd still have mine if someone hadn't stolen it at a LAN party. Those things were indestructible.
Funny you mention that, because i still have mine right in front of me (the one without FF) and it works like a charm after... i don't know how many years, 10 maybe?
Post edited June 18, 2011 by Antaniserse
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orcishgamer: Really, back in the day we all just went Sidewinder Pro, hell, I'd still have mine if someone hadn't stolen it at a LAN party. Those things were indestructible.
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Antaniserse: Funny you mention that, because i still have mine right in front of me (the one without FF) and it works like a charm after... i don't know how many years, 10 maybe?
You just made me sad, but good for you. It's a beautiful joystick, I played a lot of Mechwarrior 4 with that bad boy.
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orcishgamer: Really, back in the day we all just went Sidewinder Pro, hell, I'd still have mine if someone hadn't stolen it at a LAN party. Those things were indestructible.
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Antaniserse: Funny you mention that, because i still have mine right in front of me (the one without FF) and it works like a charm after... i don't know how many years, 10 maybe?
How are you using it? I've been treating mine as a paperweight for years, but if there's a way to get it working in a modern Windows OS, I would be up for it.
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crackedegg: How are you using it? I've been treating mine as a paperweight for years, but if there's a way to get it working in a modern Windows OS, I would be up for it.
Good question... actually i'm still sticking with XP for my gaming machine; I have not tried it on any newer OS
What a coincidence, I just was discussing joysticks with a friend who's also planning on buying soon. I've owned a lot of joysticks throughout the years, so here are some of my experiences:

Microsoft Sidewinder series (pretty much all of them) were excellent, but they're pretty hard to come by nowadays.

The Saitek Cyborg 3d Gold was one of the best low-end joysticks I've ever used. I still have it and I'm lending it to a buddy so he can play Freespace 2 with it at the moment. Fun Fact: The prop for the bounty-hunter's joystick in the Firefly episode "Objects in Space" is a Cyborg 3d Gold. Again, these are also pretty hard to find nowadays.

I've also owned the Saitek X52. It's a pretty decent stick for its price and will satisfy most players. I've found it quite durable (I know someone mentioned that the quality of Saitek's joysticks are lacking, but I believe those are for the lower end ones that have come out lately). It's not as accurate as some of the high end models, and it does have a positive ramp that I'm not too crazy about, but it's quite decent for the price you'll find it at nowadays. The Pro version is an improvement in every way, but at that price point you get into hardcore Flight Simmer territory.

I currently use the CH Fighterstick, throttle, and pedals. CH REALLY builds excellent quality products. It certainly isn't as pretty as some of the others on the market, but it's VERY durable, has excellent components, and is the most reliable joystick I've ever used. The software is still pretty much the best in the industry, and I've seen people comparing it favorably to the Thrustmaster Warthog (a $400 stick) that's just been released. Someone once commented that the CH stick is the Cadillac of joysticks, and I think I'd have to agree. The one thing you may NOT like is that it has no Z axis. (In other words, no twist.) I've been using the pedals for that, but I know that many people without pedals have grown attached to the Z-axis. Be sure to keep this in mind. Also, the X and Y axis can be felt more distinctly than something like the Saitek X52, but I find that for most flight sims, this is desirable for me. In games like Descent, the joystick is just loose enough that this axis division is not noticeable enough to ruin your aim game.

The Saitek X65 I don't really recommend. It's certainly nifty to have a pressure-sensitive joystick, but it just doesn't provide enough feedback, I find. It's a pricey one, so if you really want to go that route, definitely try before you buy.

The Thrustmaster Cougar is also a classic, but its internals are rather shoddy. (Generally people buy it to soup it up with their own components.) It's been replaced by the Thrustmaster Warthog. I probably wouldn't recommend bothering with the Cougar these days, even though it still has a huge following.

The Logitech G940 is a good one for a high-end force-feedback stick. A lot of IL-2 players like this one for that very reason. It's pretty darn expensive though.

All in all, if you're going for a lower price, the Thrustmaster 16000 is okay, I guess, but I'd definitely recommend investing in a nice joystick that will last a long time. The X52 is a good place to start, despite its criticisms. But definitely take a look at some of the higher end ones too, just to get an idea of your choices.
@NightK,

I was also in the same boat a few months ago. I wanted to buy a stick for space sims since I had gone back to playing Privateer. I eventually decided on the Thrustmaster HOTAS X. It's a PS3 and PC joystick in 1. One of its advantages is that it is pretty similar to a plain gamepad that is supported in most games.

I had some trouble getting the stick to work in Privateer. Privateer and Dosbox have joystick incompatibility problems. I couldn't calibrate the stick in the diskette version of Privateer because I couldn't move past the calibration screen. :( I went back to diagnosing the problem last week since I got a CD of Privateer. I managed to make the stick work using external software like Key2Joy and Xpadder. However, the stick's deadzone is the size of Texas. I can't hit anything even with the ITTS on because the movement increments on the stick was too large. Until now, I haven't found a solution for the deadzone problem.

I played the stick on FreeSpace 1 and it was well supported there.

I'm not sure about future support for joysticks but support from legacy games important to you should also be considered. Wing Commander I and II (I can bet my left nut that the WC series is coming on Gog :D) can only support two button joysticks in game. I'm pretty sure that you can add more functions with the use of software though.

On the low end, I think you should also consider if getting a gamepad will be sufficient for you. The XBox 360 pad is well supported in DosBox so it should be easy easy enough to map keys without getting extra software.

On the higher end, I'd point you to the CH Products sticks. They seem to have pretty good software and these seem to be pretty precise.
Post edited June 19, 2011 by chip168
I just finally got a joystick again myself after a long time of not having one - Privateer's release pushed me over. After some deliberation I picked the CH Products Flightstick Pro. Yes, I've also looked at the Fighter/Combatstick, but the whole mess of multiple hatswitches and a lot of reviews saying that some buttons were hard to reach made my decision for me. I was looking for something simple and comfortable so I went with the former. Sure, it was a bit pricey, but in the long run it's probably a better investment. The lack of z-axis (twist) doesn't bother me as I've never had a joystick with such a feature and the little experience I've had with such just made it feel odd to me. Same with force feedback.

Anyway, it works beautifully with all joystick-supported games available on GoG. Descent, Privateer, Freespace, etc... Good times.

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chip168: Wing Commander I and II (I can bet my left nut that the WC series is coming on Gog :D) can only support two button joysticks in game. I'm pretty sure that you can add more functions with the use of software though.
Actually, just using DOSBox's own key-mapper does the trick. For example, for Privateer I have targeting and lock-on mapped to my additional buttons, while my hatswitch has been assigned to throttle controls.
Post edited June 19, 2011 by mistermumbles
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mistermumbles: Actually, just using DOSBox's own key-mapper does the trick. For example, for Privateer I have targeting and lock-on mapped to my additional buttons, while my hatswitch has been assigned to throttle controls.
It's good that DosBox works for your CH joystick. I've been fiddling with DosBox's keymapper for a couple of days already but I couldn't get Privateer to recognize more than button 1. :(