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General discussion (archive)Jesus BioShock is Long...(44 posts)(44 posts)
(44 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted September 13, 2010
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Bodyless: ...

Well they also did that in first System Shock. I still think that game simply has ingenious way to set difficulty.
Posted September 13, 2010
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stonebro: Really makes me reflect on what a fucking horrible game MW2 actually is.

QFT
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frostcircus: Also, DEAR GOD LORD the only thing more staggering than the game's helicopter count is Captain Price's gibberish poetry before the final level. It's just... jaw-dropping. He was such a likeable character in CoD4, and now he's... doing this. That speech is a new low for writing in games.

I hate that god-damned Captain Fucking Price. Are IW incapable of creating another character, or is he fucking immortal? Fighting in WW2 and then in present days without any change in look. If there will be any CoD: Future Warfare, I bet my left nut that he will be there again.
Posted September 13, 2010
I have started playing Bioshock a number of times since I originally bought it (shortly after release), and have never finished it. I managed to reach the exploding submarine and the Poseidon area, but always lost interest pretty soon.
I have to confess that I have a difficult time finishing any linear, "plot-driven" game these days. I guess I don't have the patience to wade through mediocre gameplay to follow the game's "story", which is generally awful anyway (Bioshock had its moments, but the plot was basically recycled from earlier 'Shock games, complete with twist). I thought Bioshock looked great, but killing stupid splicers again and again became too much of a complete and utter bore.
If I want a narrative, I'll read a book or watch a film. When I play a game, I want to be able to kill some time doing stuff that engages either my brain (puzzles, turn-based strategy, etc.) or my reflexes (twitch shooting), but it has to be relatively varied and/or deep. Bioshock was shallow, repetitive, and boring.
I would actually have preferred it if instead they had made it a proper adventure game, with you exploring Rapture, doing puzzles (that were actually, you know, interesting and worthwhile, rather than of the "go here, fetch that, pull this lever"-variety), and only very occasionally engaging in a fight. But I guess that doesn't sell.
I've never understood the "it's too short" argument when it comes to games. If the gameplay is great, how can a game be too short? Again, this tends to boil down to developer sticking stories in their games in order to be "cinematic" (bah!). I don't recall anyone ever complaining about Sonic the Hedgehog being short, for example.
Likewise, I don't understand the complaints levelled at, for example, Sins of a Solar Empire, viz. that it did not include a singleplayer, "story-driven" campaign. Why would you need a story (rather than, say, a setting, which Sins did have) if the gameplay was great? I don't see many people complaining that Civilization doesn't have a "story" in the linear, narrative sense.
Anyway, this is probably a minority opinion.
Posted September 13, 2010
I personally thought Bioshock 1 was a little too long. But that's mostly down to my not having much time for games these days.
It was still an awesome game, though it could have been really awesome with just a few tweaks. I did find everything after the twist to be a little disappointing though. The first half was definitely the best.
I have no problem with long games (though right now i personally don't have the time to finish them often), but I do have a problem with filler and wasting my time.
Of course, one person's filler is another person's length. (er..). One person's boring padding is another person's fun. Diablo is insanely popular, but for me it seems like 99% filler.
But all my favorite games had very little filler, and most of the ones i loved at the start and then lost interest in were the ones with too much filler. I think 80% of games would benefit from a 20% cut in length.
Wasting my time mostly comes from making me replay the same thing over and over. Whether it be checkpoints that make me replay something dozen's of times, or RTS games that make me build the same base dozens of times.
Of course, for some people that's "challenge". It used to be for me, but now i have other things to do with my time.
But neither of these really apply to bioshock. It just needed to open up in the second half, imho.
Posted September 13, 2010
Bioshock is short compared to Doom 3. At least that's what it feels like.
Posted September 13, 2010
I guess because I was more interested in the story and atmosphere and environment, I found it way too long. It really started to drag the last few levels.
Posted September 13, 2010
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JoshoB: I have started playing Bioshock a number of times since I originally bought it (shortly after release), and have never finished it. I managed to reach the exploding submarine and the Poseidon area, but always lost interest pretty soon.
I have to confess that I have a difficult time finishing any linear, "plot-driven" game these days. I guess I don't have the patience to wade through mediocre gameplay to follow the game's "story", which is generally awful anyway (Bioshock had its moments, but the plot was basically recycled from earlier 'Shock games, complete with twist). I thought Bioshock looked great, but killing stupid splicers again and again became too much of a complete and utter bore.

That sub part is less than halfway through the game! lol.
Anyway, I very much enjoy narrative in my games, FPS and RPG games anyway... I need that context, that unique feel. Every FPS has basically been the same game since Wolfenstein, only now even simpler due to the removal of puzzles or keys in most cases. The thing that keeps me playing these games is immersion in the game world through art, story, characters and graphics. Without that feeling I find them boring.
You don/t necessarily need a lot of writing for that either, I find Left 4 Dead to be a great and immersive game despite the lack of real narrative.
Posted September 13, 2010
I found BioShock to be of appropriate length. Having never played SS1 or SS2, I actually wanted it to be longer than it was. Took me about 15 hours my first playthrough on normal to finish it.
Picked up BioShock 2 finally, and I like it a lot, it's not entirely the same as BioShock 1 as some people have said, but I find I go through ammo much faster. I'm assuming that's because I don't have a wrench to smack people upside the head anymore ;)
Anyway 2 is pretty good, though it's not as compelling as the first one. I've seen some people complain about 2's graphics, but honestly I can see an improvement over 1, which is all a person can ask for. Then again, a lot of people on the Steam forums come up with non-existent issues for post count so...
Anyway sorry to hear you did not enjoy BioShock as much as you might have if it were shorter. I guess everyone has their own preferences. For me, it was a breath of fresh air. It was the first FPS I'd played that had RPG elements to it.
-Cym
Posted September 14, 2010
Modern Warfare 2 was awesome because you had to run away from those falling helicopters (It was my favorite thing about the game). I think that summed up the game since it was just one action set piece to the next with a plot thrown in between segments to showcase a fun action game. To think this was a military simulator like Flashpoint or the old Rainbow Six games is to delude yourself, the Call of Duty series has always been about action set pieces from the beginning like with the first Call of Duty capitalizing on Enemy at the Gates with those Stalingrad levels.
Now onto BioShock, it was one of those games I felt had perfect length. I enjoyed it thoroughly and the only other game where the length I felt had perfect length as well was GTA IV. Now the only game I can recall from memory that was longer than it should be was the Ghostbusters game. I loved the game but I just wanted it to end when I got to the graveyard level.
Posted September 14, 2010
That's why I love jump&run games. They got a respective lenght, mostly due exploration of the environment. Imagine the hours I wasted on Jack and Daxter.... 8P
Posted September 14, 2010
Just beat it... second time ever, and it was just as great of a game as the first go-round I thought. The only part that felt like it could or should be cut is the little sister escort mission at the end, I was kind of done with the game right when that started. I like the boss fight though, I never understood what was supposed to be so horrible about that.
Posted September 14, 2010
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StingingVelvet: I like the boss fight though, I never understood what was supposed to be so horrible about that.

I didn't mind it. Certainly a lot better than the ending of some games. At least it fit the theme of Rapture and represented a logical conclusion of the out of control genetic engineering. I haven't liked any of the suggested alternatives that I've read.
Posted September 14, 2010
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StingingVelvet: I like the boss fight though, I never understood what was supposed to be so horrible about that.
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Navagon: I didn't mind it. Certainly a lot better than the ending of some games. At least it fit the theme of Rapture and represented a logical conclusion of the out of control genetic engineering. I haven't liked any of the suggested alternatives that I've read.

BioShock 2 just throws an endless stream of tough enemies at you for 5 minutes before the cutscene... not sure how much better that is, if any.
Posted September 14, 2010
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JoshoB: I have started playing Bioshock a number of times since I originally bought it (shortly after release), and have never finished it. I managed to reach the exploding submarine and the Poseidon area, but always lost interest pretty soon.
I have to confess that I have a difficult time finishing any linear, "plot-driven" game these days. I guess I don't have the patience to wade through mediocre gameplay to follow the game's "story", which is generally awful anyway (Bioshock had its moments, but the plot was basically recycled from earlier 'Shock games, complete with twist). I thought Bioshock looked great, but killing stupid splicers again and again became too much of a complete and utter bore.

I'm the total opposite. Any game without a narrative and I'll get bored pretty quick, even if the gameplay itself is great.
If you only got as far as the sub, that's not even a quarter of the way through, and not up to the twist. Though you've probably heard all about it by now. (trying not to give anything away).
TBH, while the basic structure of the story might well be recycled from previous *shock games, it's never been about the basic story structure, it's about the way it's told (the characters, the diaries, the small incidental things you find, like the pictures in the little sister training center.
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StingingVelvet: I like the boss fight though, I never understood what was supposed to be so horrible about that.
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Navagon: I didn't mind it. Certainly a lot better than the ending of some games. At least it fit the theme of Rapture and represented a logical conclusion of the out of control genetic engineering. I haven't liked any of the suggested alternatives that I've read.

Tom Chick's alternative sounded awesome.
I didn't mind the boss fight, but I thought it was kind of generic - which was a bit of a letdown. The character (who i won't name here) wasn't really about power and combat, more about sneakiness and plotting. It seemed a bit out of place for him to suddenly morph into one of those "shoot it till it dies" tough bosses.
I'm assuming the visual image was supposed to be important *looks at the cover of Atlas Shrugged*, but I didn't think it worked that great.
A more character driven boss/ending would have been a little more appropriate imho. but it was ok.
Post edited September 14, 2010 by soulgrindr
Posted September 14, 2010
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StingingVelvet: BioShock 2 just throws an endless stream of tough enemies at you for 5 minutes before the cutscene... not sure how much better that is, if any.

Well, again, I didn't consider it inappropriate in the context of the storyline. But I'm pretty sure there was a more imaginative way to go about it.
I think the main problem with both endings is that they're both so focussed on being a straightforward FPS while the rest of the game was focussed more on telling the story of Rapture and showing what it has become.
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General discussion (archive)Jesus BioShock is Long...(44 posts)(44 posts)
(44 posts)