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General discussion (archive)How Bethesda Screwed Arkane(51 posts)(51 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 08, 2013
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Titanium: Singing a contract with a catch 22 and no outside independent quality inspector is... well, it's not really ideal, is it? No wonder anyone can take advantage of such concepts as "quality". As far as I know, Bethesda might have actually perceived the quality of the developing game to be inferior to what was contractually agreed upon.
Was my thought as well, but remember that Arkane actually hadn't had a full project since 2006 (Dark Messiah of Might & Magic) and were forced to do contract work (like helping out on Bioshock 2) in order to survive. So if the claims are true, they wouldn't had little choice but to accept Bethesda's contract just to do work.

Bethesda isn't new to doing weird catch 22 contracts though, you might remember the whole thing about Obsidian not getting paid bonus's for Fallout: New Vegas because the Metacritic score was 1 point too low.
Posted June 08, 2013
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langurmonkey: Tony Montana: You know what capitalism is? Getting fucked!

You guys remember Bethesda going after Notch? They are worse than EA.
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PetrusOctavianus: Notch tried to trademark the word "scrolls". That makes him just as bad as Bethesda and EA.
This is bullshit. If I try to trademark a product called "silly bike" does that mean I trademarked the words "silly" and "bike"?
Posted June 08, 2013
if ea was considered the head of the mafia family then 2k games, gearbox, Bethesda are sure part of the family
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Notch tried to trademark the word "scrolls". That makes him just as bad as Bethesda and EA.
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silviucc: This is bullshit. If I try to trademark a product called "silly bike" does that mean I trademarked the words "silly" and "bike"?
A more apt comparison would be if you tried to trademark "bike".
Posted June 08, 2013
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mystral: Legally, you can't trademark common English words, anyway.
http://www.apple.com/legal/intellectual-property/trademark/appletmlist.html
Posted June 08, 2013
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langurmonkey: Tony Montana: You know what capitalism is? Getting fucked!

You guys remember Bethesda going after Notch? They are worse than EA.
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PetrusOctavianus: Notch tried to trademark the word "scrolls". That makes him just as bad as Bethesda and EA.
Oh yeah, I forgot about that part of the story.
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Notch tried to trademark the word "scrolls". That makes him just as bad as Bethesda and EA.
Why ? there is nothing wrong with trademarking the name of your games.

Trademarks are limited in scope, if he managed to trademark the word "scroll" it wouldn't mean that nobody else would ever be able to use the word "scroll" without asking for his permission, simply that nobody would be able to release a game called "scroll". Trademarking the name of your game/movie/etc... is something very common, it's not that different than reserving the DNS name for it.
Post edited June 08, 2013 by Gersen
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Notch tried to trademark the word "scrolls". That makes him just as bad as Bethesda and EA.
He did try to trademark "Scrolls", but I'm not sure why you see it as an issue. There is no issue with trademarks being single, common words, as long as the context of the trademark is properly defined. For instances, Microsoft's trademark on "Windows" is in the context of software so it applies only to software products and you won't see MS causing any problems for those selling actual physical windows. Same with "Apple". The application for "Scrolls" was similar- the context of the application was for electronic entertainment (and if memory serves a few merchandise tie-in items that Notch had planned). There is an issue if someone is trying to trademark a common word while using it in a descriptive sense, but none of that was going on here.

Also, keep in mind that the purpose of trademark law is to prevent consumer confusion, and the likeliness of confusion is a key consideration in any trademark dispute case (this is why you still have both Apple Records and Apple Computers, despite the many lawsuits between them).
Posted June 08, 2013
well but at least dishonored could slap the name "bethesda" on the advertisement, which probably boosted their sales by 50%. so its all good in my book.
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: According to Wikipedia and Gamasutra part of their settlement was that Notch/Majong would not trademark "Scrolls". So I got the impression that they planned to do it.
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mystral: Well, I don't know. I didn't like Minecraft so I pay little attention to what Notch does. But I've never seen any mention of him wanting to trademark "Scrolls". Legally, you can't trademark common English words, anyway.
From what I've read he did try and trademark "Scrolls" which is precisely what sent Bethesda's lawyers into a feeding frenzy. I don't see how that makes him particularly terrible, mind. Not unless he would then do a Langdell. Which is something that would seem out of character.
Posted June 08, 2013
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mystral: Well, I don't know. I didn't like Minecraft so I pay little attention to what Notch does. But I've never seen any mention of him wanting to trademark "Scrolls". Legally, you can't trademark common English words, anyway.
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Navagon: From what I've read he did try and trademark "Scrolls" which is precisely what sent Bethesda's lawyers into a feeding frenzy. I don't see how that makes him particularly terrible, mind. Not unless he would then do a Langdell. Which is something that would seem out of character.
Well, I just thought it was rather cheeky to trademark "Scrolls" when there already were games called "Elder Scrolls".
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Well, I just thought it was rather cheeky to trademark "Scrolls" when there already were games called "Elder Scrolls".
Personally I think that all single common word trademarks should be invalidated. Cheeky, yes. But anything more than that would depend on his intent.
Posted June 08, 2013
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvJtSx0_VlQ

Bethesda are lying scumbags? No way!

Welcome to 10 years ago
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liquidsnakehpks: if ea was considered the head of the mafia family then 2k games, gearbox, Bethesda are sure part of the family
EA: Fat albino midget that nobody likes.

Activision: Military dude that drives around the neighborhood, asking people for a ride, then raping them in the car with his crowbar after making so many promises.

Bethesda: EA's fat boyfriend that drives a moped.

Capcom: Girl that sells cookies door to door in the neighborhood. She was kidnapped and raped at the house with the sign "Resident Evil 4 & 5."

Nintendo: Asian guy that's crying in his window because people stopped visiting him.
Post edited June 08, 2013 by Roman5
Posted June 08, 2013
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Crosmando: When you discover Bethesda started to reject milestones at not only Arkane, but Splash Damage and inXile, you start to see a pattern. Knowing the fate of Arkane, if you were the Prey 2 developer would just sit there and see what happens or would you confront the publisher?
A quick search about those devs + rejected milestone showed up.... absolutely nothing but recent rumors / allegations following the story of Bethesda trying to play hardball with Human Head.
I'm not claiming it isn't so or defending Bethesda. But no source at all or even a small indication from one of those devs in all those years, IS pointing towards conspiracy theories...
Posted June 08, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Well, I just thought it was rather cheeky to trademark "Scrolls" when there already were games called "Elder Scrolls".
iD, owned by Bethesda, registered the trademark "Rage" despite the existence of Primal Rage, SpeedRage, Streets of Rage, Turok: Rage Wars, Fist of the North Star: Ken's Rage, The Simpsons: Road Rage, Spectral Force 3: Innocent Rage, Kendo Rage, Wolverine: Adamantium Rage, Rage of Mages and Star Wars Galaxies: Episode III Rage of the Wookiees. How cheeky of them, right?

No, I don't think so. Registering a trademark for the title of your game is what you're supposed to do (Notch's lawyers actually chewed him out because he didn't want to register Minecraft, but he relented and applied for Minecraft and Scrolls together to save making an extra trip). Registering "Scrolls", had the application been successful, would give them exclusive rights to use the word "Scrolls" as the full title of a game, as well as some minor variations, like perhaps "The Scrolls" or "Scrolls 2: Oh No! More Scrolls!", but not exclusivity over any title with the word "scrolls" in it because that's a single common word so there's only so much protection a trademark would offer. It wouldn't give them rights over the name for books, movies, company names or almost anything else unless they added those to their application, and even then the applicability would be limited.

(I hope SimonG pops around - he would no doubt have an opinion far more informed than mine)

I'm not sure how you could construe applying for the trademark as "cheeky" at all, unless you're suggesting that he persuaded Jakob Porsér to choose that name in the first place while planning to make a play for Bethesda's trademark rights all along, which is... possible, but so far-fetched that I don't find it plausible at all.
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General discussion (archive)How Bethesda Screwed Arkane(51 posts)(51 posts)
(51 posts)