This was right at the start of the slew of accusations thrown my way.

BUT, re-reading Damnation's post, this is untrue.
The vacuum cleaner died with the contents of his dustbag spread around.
Can't say with 100% certainty whether the bag was ruptured, but it certainly wasn't caused by unplugging.

So I make a (now obviously) very stupid comment, meant to inspire more talking.
(So at least it was sort of succesful!)

Vitek uses this as a reason to throw all kinds of accusation my way, BASED ON A FALSE PREMISE

So who is the more scummy: The 1st timer who makes a blunder or the experienced player who bases an arguement on something demonstrably untrue?

Popinjay has so far made exactly 2 posts.
Both of which give very little & then add a vote to Viteks target....
That's suspicious activity right there.

Perhaps my suggestion that the 3 have revealed themselves was more accurate than some people liked, & this is why those same 3 are now hounding me.

What 3? Popinjay and Vitek maybe I can understand, possibly, but other then two votes in the early stages I don't see much.

As for myself? What I'm seeing in response makes me suspicious, what might have been an innocent mistake has become something you're incredibly defensive about. That's raising some alarms in my head.

You may very well be town or a neutral that isn't anti-town, but your reaction to a slight bit of pressure by declaring the people voting for you as mafia seems to me to be an attempt to draw attention away from yourself.

I still want to hear everyone else's thoughts, maybe someone is thinking in a way that I'm not, it's possible, it is early/late for me.

I AM very defensive.
I see pressure starting to build & want to head it off before it reaches critical mass.
I see Vitek acting as a leader.
I see Popinjay following this lead.
Whether you are doing the same or not is frankly too early to tell.
BUT you DO still have a vote on me and fit neatly into the triangle I mentioned earlier.
Not 100% sure whether you are a bystander caught up in the witchunt or the 3rd scum, playing a little smarter than the other two.
Frankly, you've attacked me. You also pointed to suspicous behaviour by Pop, but rather than voting him, you went for Elbaz.
Perhaps you were worried about building too much pressure on your co-conspirator?

Just to clarify:
In game 3, Orryrro claimed a name that struck alarm bells & he was being hounded over this right to the end of the game, even though he turned out town.

I see a lot of correlation & don't really want to have to go through that.
I would rather spend my time & energy finding the real bad guys.

Rodzaju he is trying to play us all by pretending to be objective. Singling out members of the group to divert attention from the scum. Vote Rodzaju now and we will be one step closer to revealing those with evil intent.

I don't believe I ever claimed to be objective.
I claimed to be stupid. I claimed to be defensive.
In a game like this, can anyone ever be truly objective?
If you're town, you're subjectively biased against mafia (or at least those you percieve as such).
If you're mafia, you're subjectively biased against town (or at least those you percieve as such).

Singling out members of the group?
Isn't that exactly what you did with Nmillar and now me?

You'll be one step closer because there'll be one less innocent in the way.

No, it's not false. He was killed by unplugging and having his dustbug blown.
"The next day, you all find the vacuum cleaner unplugged and the dustbag compartment blown to smithereens."

And the sentance I cited above, "Go unplug some scummy whiteware!", leads me to believe unpluggging is more important element of his death. Of course, I can be wrong but until proven wrong I'll stick to it.
Now I could point out you are the one completly lefting out something inconvenient from his death scene and presenting it in way that fits you.

Are you implying my vote, first vote of the game, random vote, was orchestrated move to get someone lynched? And do you think it could work, if I and Popinjay were scum-buddies, that each time I vote soemone he jumps in and vote the same person? I think we wouldn't last even two days.

Why is he playing smarter than me? I think I should be offended. :-)
You shouldn't consider everyone who votes you throughout the game scum. You could also end with thinking there are 11 mafia and all are out to get you. ;-)

I still haven't seen anything that would make me unvote you. On the contrary, I don't like your over defensivness, the way you try to accuse me from false premise while you use it yourself.
I would like to hear from others too. It's easy for mafia to see and watch while few towns fight among themselves. It happened before and I don't want to see it again this time.

Also I don't like Popinjays posts at all. Just bandwagoning without too much contribution or reasoning. I understand it's early to judge players contributions (when some haven't posted yet) but I don't like the way he prompts people to quickly vote Rodzaju.

Before I address each of your points, a bit about how I see votes.
Early votes are most likely purely random, to stimulate conversation.
More than 1 early vote for the same person, looks more threatening.
I've seen days go by with several people carring 1 or 2 votes each.
However, This group is split into mostly 2 time zone areas.
I could easily go to bed on 2 votes & wake up on 5-7.
Especially as others were also questioning my motive that had not yet voted.

My attempt to make idle conversation backfired badly.
Claiming or fishing seems to be heavily frowned upon.
This, combines with the above mentioned sleep ambush panicked me.
Perhaps that's my inexperience.
Perhaps I'm just paranoid.
Perhaps people really are out to get me ;)

When Pop followed your first vote, apart from making himself look bad, it didn't really mean anything.
When he followed your second vote, especially seen through the lens of my predicament, it looks co-ordinated.

My first mention of the Vitek/Pop/Twilight triangle (when Twilight 2nded your vote) WAS largely to give people something else to look at.
However, when Pop came back and added his vote, it added weight to the idea.

Now I've had some sleep & the chance to step back a bit, let's try again.

I did deliberately ignore the unplugged bit.
To me, this tied into the "Go unplug some scum" line, which as previously mentioned I believe to be metaphorical, rather than literal.

As said, I do not believe your first vote was intended to get a lynch.
However, Pop does seem to be paying an unusual amount of attention to your actions.
You vote, he votes.
You interrogate, He attacks and drums up support for the attack.

I suggested Twilight was playing smarter in the context of the "Triangle".
He was less obvious about following your lead, waiting until there was an actual suspicion.
This would make it harder to draw a link to you, without specifically looking for it.
Pop has been very clear in following you.
Seeing how suspicious Pop looks, a link to you makes you look suspicious.
Not everyone who ever votes for me is going to be scum, but when your back's against the wall, you come out fighting.

To sum up, I currently believe Pop is definitely scum.
It's unclear whether you are leading him, or he is following you.
Maybe you've got a stalker, or maybe you are together.
Either way, questions remain.
Either way, you are the directing force.
That makes you more dangerous than him.

I'm really sorry that I haven't made more than two or even 55 posts to justify why I think Rodzaju is scum.

Vitek may well be scum but I certainly wouldn't be so obvious to follow him if I was.

I'm just afraid that come night one of us is going to be dead and I don't care who it is as long as it's not me. We need to start flushing out the obvious suspects. Those with verbose nonsense that reflects on their sleep patterns, paranoia and inexperience with this game only promotes a sense of innocences that I find laughably scum like.

You should care about who may end up dead come the night time. What if it's a town power role like cop or doc? If you're just a plain Townie, I'm sorry to say that power roles are more important than yourself.

Rodzaju, you are going a bit nuts on the explanations, but I'm going to chalk that up to you just being nervous when three people have decided to vote for you at the start of the day.

Hmm I must agree with TwilightBard here, about the reactions to a soft claim. Never would have expected results like this. But it goes to show, one never knows what can occur.

We see Rodzaju being very defensive, this could be out of fright from being lynched making the town lose one, but this early in the game losing a town for a mislynch ain't exactly that much of a problem. It clears some doubts about people and tells us a bit about those who lynched the fellow. On the other hand, if Rodzaju is indeed a town and is a power role as well, then I might see a reason for this defensive way, as it would backfire on ourself if we lynched a power role (But if thats the case, Do not tell anything about that yet, your not really in a danger zone and outing a power role for the scum to see will not help us, unless you will be almost 100% lynched anyway). .Still if he is indeed a power role I would blame the inexperience on his fairly strange and very defensive way.

So looking how things stand right now, I see Rodzaju being very defensive, currently without a very good reason except being scum to explain this behavior.

I see Vitek clearly trying to be objective and consider the whats being said, although still the first to vote for Rodzaju - followed by TwilightBard. Both of which are appearing to me as the ones most focused on what Rodzaju is saying (in his defense).

Then there is Popinjay, which strikes me as odd. He doesn't seem to have much trouble joining up on wagons and doesn't state any argument for any reasons why he does it - except some one-liner comment. He also immediately gets defensive when Vitek points this out:

And then the first response from Popinjays is:

Again this doesn't explain any reasoning at all - its just a strangely defensive comment. And why this defensive from just one post asking him to post a little more reasoning and commenting that its fairly suspicious not to do so? Seems to me that he must have either:

1: Some hidden agenda
2: Is trying to cover himself or something similar?

And gets defensive when someone notices his behavior.

Then he also writes two other odd things:


Now that might just be me reading this in a strange way, but I read this in 3 different ways:

1: If Vitek and Popinjay is both scum, his argument is that it would be too obvious if he helped him out. (Now I doubt that Vitek is mafia, so this argument doesn't really say me anything, except I find it a bit scummy).

2: if Vitek is a townie and Popinjay is a scum, then Popinjay would gladly jump on any bandwagon started by Vitek, because he would know that Vitek was not scum and therefore it wouldn't be obvious that Popinjay was scum?? (Now thats a weird argument).

3: If neither is scum, then Popinjay is still jumping on a bandwagon without much reasoning - so back to where we left of, with no proper reasons stated.

Well enterprise already said this - but this doesn't sound like a townie worried on behalf of the entire town, like the rest of us. It sounds like someone with a hidden agenda who doesn't really care if town loses or wins. It could be because he is either scum or a third party. I am mostly leaning toward third party due to his lack of reasons for jumping on wagons and the mention of scum hunting.

So yea, until we settled the other matter: FOS: Popinjay

Now I am waiting to hear what others have to say about whats been going on, hoping that it will make things a bit more clear.

Damn, now you made me sit and wish that I made the post. It states just the thing I had in mind about the electrical stuff (Although I did point it out that it weren't stated it had to be electrical (Looking back I see how it sounds like I was talking about Rod, but the "he" was meant as Damnation)) and you also have a great point about waiting and see if the pattern about electrical or not is true, thereby ensuring a possibility for certainty about an eventual future lynch.

Whatever the case about the power I still find the reactions intriguing - but I stated those above, so no need to do so again,

Admittedly, when I first pointed it out, I wasn't the first to do so either, and yeah it was a bit suspicious, but at the time not enough to really justify doing anything when I could poke for reactions from people who haven't posted yet. Or at least from the people that haven't played yet, I thought that getting more voices was more important then chasing a noted person that others were watching as well.

Now, however, is a whole new ballgame. First time I could see as an inexperienced player following an experienced player's initial vote without noticing that it should be random. Second time...I'm not quite sure what to think. It's extremely suspicious and needs to be taken into greater focus.

I'm still greatly interested in what you're getting at, but for now I don't see a point in continuing this.

Unvote Rodzaju

And of course, there's more, as soon as I figure out what went wrong with my formatting