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I don't like to think of the two as enemies, more like fair competitors operating on the same market.
GOG simply suits my personal needs better. For things I can't get from GOG or retail (like some LucasArts classics, Bloodlines, New Vegas and so on), Steam is still the best digital distribution alternative. Of course I'll get them again on GOG if they ever appear here.
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Elmofongo: Another day another Steam vs GOG related thread :-/
The site would crash if there wasn't one of these every day.
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Elmofongo: Another day another Steam vs GOG related thread :-/
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Mr.Caine: The site would crash if there wasn't one of these every day.
I guess it's like on the Lost-island.
You know, where they have to push the button every 108 minutes, otherwise *nasty* things would happen.
(Checking the time ... how long until one has to start the next of those threads?)
Okay, I'll bite. Well, I like GOG because of the DRM free nature of the games, and I like the selection of relatively obscure titles like Sin Gold and Shogo. Even though I will never buy from Steam again I do admit in ways its library is slightly better mostly because it has the Quake and Wolfenstein games. However, GOG is certainly getting a better library, just in the past month they've added S.T.A.L.K.E.R. and Red Faction. I would appreciate more 1C and Deep Silver titles, oh well. Overall, I prefer GOG.
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Elmofongo: Another day another Steam vs GOG related thread :-/
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Mr.Caine: The site would crash if there wasn't one of these every day.
You have uncovered our darkest secret: GOG is powered by the energy that is generated in those "Steam vs. GOG" threads. :P
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Mr.Caine: The site would crash if there wasn't one of these every day.
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JudasIscariot: You have uncovered our darkest secret: GOG is powered by the energy that is generated in those "Steam vs. GOG" threads. :P
My work here is done.

http://cdn.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/poochie.gif
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Elmofongo: Another day another Steam vs GOG related thread :-/
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Mr.Caine: The site would crash if there wasn't one of these every day.
That's interesting because I'm having to deal with this debate not here but on Kickstarter. A lot of the Kickstarter projects start having this debate about 6 months to a year into their development. I'll explain why in a minute. I only use Steam when I'm forced too. It does have its plus and minus but I will always choose and pay more for DRM-free options. If they put Bioshock Infinite here, I'll pay full price. I'm really thankful for GOG for DRM-free and no-CD check.

I support new PC games being develop on Kickstarter but I'm starting to see a disturbing trend. I'll use the Kickstarter PC game I'm supporting as an example: Dead State: The Zombie Survival RPG

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/70755535/dead-state-the-zombie-survival-rpg

Dead State is IMO a very promising survival zombie horror game that contains RPG. I have been watching it even before it was put on Kickstarter. When you look at the main page that shows the Pledges: You see DRM-free, DRM-free, DRM-free. I'm thinking the developer choose this because they were not greenlit for Steam and there was no guarantee that there would be. So backers pledged to this game and I did too because it said you will get a DRM-free copy of this game. Because Steam is the majority and give tools for developers to do "early access" which reaches a wide range of potential customers, many developers want to use it. So a post came out 10 months later that said they were greenlit but they were careful to say DRM-free and Steam are equally supported:

We will still be offering DRM-free versions, but for those who want to activate on Steam, that option will now be available.

Although we were told the beta was only going to be released on STEAM. That happens a lot.

But the post that got the DRM-free vs Steam debate started again was on Feb 8, 2014.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/70755535/dead-state-the-zombie-survival-rpg/posts/742420

It was frustrating to be told that the beta would only be on Steam. But in this post, the developer made the DRM-free backers feel that the Steam version was more important, and went on to given reasons why Steam was a better choice. Of course they said they would give you a DRM-free version but they didn't make the backers who support DRM-free feel better because of how they presented themselves in the post. They also said they hadn't look into other service so don't ask for now. But it felt like a slap in the face to DRM-free backers. The developers are so commented to Steam at this time that although they said they would eventual release content for the DRM-free version, Steam would get updates first. But there is no guarantees.

I posted this:

I'm very concern with the trend I'm seeing in game companies using Kickstarter when boasting DRM-free to get support funding and then nudging backers to use STEAM after they have been greenlighted.

I also said:

I do get why the developers wants to use STEAM and listed a lot of good business reasons to use STEAM. I just wish more game developers would create post like this one on day 1. (ex. If we get greenlit we are going to primarily use STEAM) I would appreciate that more.

Of course the Steam supporters, who are the majority, were saying how much better Steam is and how DRM-free backers are whinny and complainers. Of course, it's easy to do that if you would like and prefer the game on Steam. The developer boasted that 99% of the backers even preferred Steam which I don't totally believe. Some Steam users really believe that it's not really DRM. If you go to wiki it says its DRM in the first sentence.

One the Pro-Steam comments posted was a link to how more than 50% of indie-games sales come from Steam, but the article for Defender's Quest actually praised GOG and said GOG was going to continue to grow and be an excellent alternate to Steam in the future. The data showed that a game developer is neglecting about 20 to 40% of their business if only going with Steam.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/186940/defenders_quest_by_the_numbers_.php

So I had some thoughts for GOG in helping becoming more connected with Kickstarter projects. The Carmegeddon Returns and Wasteland 2 Kickstarters seem to be connected from the start with GOG. I think if GOG had a team that reached out to more Kickstarter projects as they are first starting to get them interested in using GOG, maybe more developers will embrace GOG from the start. I get very worried when developers switch more emphasis to Steam also because of DLC. Meaning we will get a DRM-free game as promised but ignored after that for future content.

But this doesn't address the other issue of early access. GOG business model is restoring and updating old games to work on modern operating systems. I value this so much. But if GOG starts to get more into promoting more current games, maybe GOG needs to start looking into an early access of their own to compete with Steam - if not for all games, maybe just Kickstarters projects. The reason being is the backers have already paid for the game so there is no worry of piracy.

These debates will continue because Steam's biggest strength is convenience. That's what I read from Steam users. Steam creates a library for you and updates the games bought. You don't have to think too much. You buy the game, install it, and then play it. I agree to a point BUT Steam still controls the account and library of games and can take it away with an updated "terms of service" contract issue and other horror stories I read on the web. I remember that one time I went to play a game on Steam and the client got corrupted. I spent 6 hours fixing it and lost my day playing a game.

But the biggest convenience for me is being able to play my game independent of any service and even the internet or CD check. That I can preserve the PC games I love most and they are with me even if a game company or game service shuts down; that I can play them when I want to not when someone else decide when I can play them.
Post edited February 15, 2014 by hickszzz
Steam's only advantage is that it has a much bigger catalog. Steam used to be cheaper than GOG when games were on sales, but now GOG is actually cheaper.
I'm sorry that you typed out that much for absolutely nothing hickszzz.These types of threads here most of the time are a mere couple sentences denouncing steam as satan and GoG as the one true savoir.Their nothing but breeding ground for flame wars and fanboyism.Which is why quite a few members are upset with them.That's all there is to it.No one is looking to have a level headed debate here.
Post edited February 15, 2014 by Mr.Caine
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Mr.Caine: I'm sorry that you typed out that much for absolutely nothing hickszzz.These types of threads here most of the time are a mere couple sentences denouncing steam as satan and GoG as the one true savoir.Their nothing but breeding ground for flame wars and fanboyism.Which is why quite a few members are upset with them.That's all there is to it.No one is looking to have a level headed debate here.
I actually thought it was a really informative post. It stated the vague frustration I've been feeling with certain Kickstarters in a much clearer way then I've been able to define. Who knows, maybe this time the thread will be different and actually useful! I can dream can't I?
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Mr.Caine: I'm sorry that you typed out that much for absolutely nothing hickszzz.These types of threads here most of the time are a mere couple sentences denouncing steam as satan and GoG as the one true savoir.Their nothing but breeding ground for flame wars and fanboyism.Which is why quite a few members are upset with them.That's all there is to it.No one is looking to have a level headed debate here.
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Melhelix: I actually thought it was a really informative post. It stated the vague frustration I've been feeling with certain Kickstarters in a much clearer way then I've been able to define. Who knows, maybe this time the thread will be different and actually useful! I can dream can't I?
His post is good indeed but in this thread it will be buried in no time.
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hickszzz: ....maybe GOG needs to start looking into an early access of their own to compete with Steam....
I'm finding this "early access", "alpha game" trend quite tiresome and irritating.
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Mr.Frost: I'm finding this "early access", "alpha game" trend quite tiresome and irritating.
Get off my lawn, kids!
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hickszzz: So I had some thoughts for GOG in helping becoming more connected with Kickstarter projects.
I 'm wary of GOG and Kickstarter getting 'more connected'.

Kickstarts are becoming a fad. And they're not all successful. And as it becomes more fad'ish, more and more crappy ones will appear.

Any 'bad', 'failed', or 'promises changed' Kickstarts that are "GOG connected" would reflect poorly on GOG. GOG doesn't need resultant the negative word.

It's wonderful for GOG to 'reach out' to Kickstarted projects (as deemed appropriate), but to 'connect' to them is not so good, I fear.

JMO :)
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hickszzz: We will still be offering DRM-free versions, but for those who want to activate on Steam, that option will now be available.

Although we were told the beta was only going to be released on STEAM. That happens a lot.

But the post that got the DRM-free vs Steam debate started again was on Feb 8, 2014.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/70755535/dead-state-the-zombie-survival-rpg/posts/742420

It was frustrating to be told that the beta would only be on Steam. But in this post, the developer made the DRM-free backers feel that the Steam version was more important, and went on to given reasons why Steam was a better choice. Of course they said they would give you a DRM-free version but they didn't make the backers who support DRM-free feel better because of how they presented themselves in the post. They also said they hadn't look into other service so don't ask for now. But it felt like a slap in the face to DRM-free backers. The developers are so commented to Steam at this time that although they said they would eventual release content for the DRM-free version, Steam would get updates first. But there is no guarantees.

I posted this:

I'm very concern with the trend I'm seeing in game companies using Kickstarter when boasting DRM-free to get support funding and then nudging backers to use STEAM after they have been greenlighted.

I also said:

I do get why the developers wants to use STEAM and listed a lot of good business reasons to use STEAM. I just wish more game developers would create post like this one on day 1. (ex. If we get greenlit we are going to primarily use STEAM) I would appreciate that more.

So I had some thoughts for GOG in helping becoming more connected with Kickstarter projects. The Carmegeddon Returns and Wasteland 2 Kickstarters seem to be connected from the start with GOG. I think if GOG had a team that reached out to more Kickstarter projects as they are first starting to get them interested in using GOG, maybe more developers will embrace GOG from the start. I get very worried when developers switch more emphasis to Steam also because of DLC. Meaning we will get a DRM-free game as promised but ignored after that for future content.

But this doesn't address the other issue of early access. GOG business model is restoring and updating old games to work on modern operating systems. I value this so much. But if GOG starts to get more into promoting more current games, maybe GOG needs to start looking into an early access of their own to compete with Steam - if not for all games, maybe just Kickstarters projects. The reason being is the backers have already paid for the game so there is no worry of piracy.
THose who have followed Kickstarter would have seen this worrying trend already. Way too many Steam fan's keep pushing a project to be on Steam. Thing is a KS project is there because a dev believed enough in a game to share that with others out there and to put that into reality.Its not meant to be a stepping stone to jump onto Early Access or Greenlight , which i am actually starting to suspect is the case.
Failed Kickstarters - seen a few of those creep onto Steam via greenlight (some offerred drm free before but havent when this has happened - which is fair enough if this is the only way to get funds to continue making the game).
Successful ones unfortunately who offer Beta/Alpha access will take the early access road to supply beta/alpha as it makes business sense (i call it lazy as well FWIW). The funny thing is. A successful Kickstarter SHOULD mean the amounts received from KS + paypal slacker backers is all thats needed fund start, production and completion of the game which doesnt seem the case ie DF.
Once they get onto EA , some devs are overtly influenced by what Steam backers and EA's want in the game, crappy achievements and steam trading cards and incorporating bloody steamworks (see Banner Saga. And dont tell me this doesn't happen - looking at various KS forums where these kind of requests are very common) etc.
Instead of catering to everyone, they *do* play favorites (yeah devs will give a good business reason for this blah blah). Dev's how about just making a game without all the crappy bells and whistles specific to a given platform ie Steam? .
Also less KS projects bother to even offer drm free in their tiers let alone mention it in their FAQ's. People have to ask and ask for it in comments section (once backed).
The one thing about KS and GOG, GOG will only deal with finished games atm. I contacted several devs about drm free but because games were in development (obviously) nothing could be promised. KS projects with bigger teams ie InXile, Obsidian, Larian can obviously promise drm free as they are more likely to be accepted by GOG to be sold at some point, but with the majority - i CAN see where they are coming from about release on GOG, just not the flimsy excuses for not having a DRM free version regardless whether it will be on GOG or not.
I wish dev's on KS would make it clear (like yourself) whether a game will be Steam only or not (even this is not guaranteed but they should be offering through their own site by default anyway).

PS I was very interested in Dead State.Now my interest is lukewarm at best.
Post edited February 15, 2014 by Niggles