Very true, that. Before their involvement in WWII, Japan went on a barbaric rampage. They should just accept that there will never be enough rug for them to sweep it all under. By trying to play it down they're just making it seem as if, from a moral standpoint, the present regime is no better.

As far as I know, the criminalisation of holocaust denial is an EU initiative. Seeing as Germany is an integral part of the EU they can hardly exclude themselves from that. But yes, it is a pretty difficult balance to maintain.

That is not the case:
The European Union's Framework decision on Racism and Xenophobia states that denying or grossly trivialising "crimes of genocide" should be made "punishable in all EU Member States".
The operative words here being "should be made". Holocaust denial laws exist in only 14 countries. The EU consists of 27 countries.

Oh, true, but then Halo came out... ;P /joke
I mean, the party that waged a Holy War with abortion, homosexuality, atheists and metalheads [i sh.t Ye not!] is out, for a long time, hopefully.;)
I've seen more gay'ee people who grew up on Britney [leave britney aloooooone].;P
Which reminds me of an interesting serial killer case i was reading about lately. An interesting twist to the homosexual intolerance matter. ;)
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I wonder if they'll ban the soviet red star, and the hammer, and the sickle, because it may offend the Katyn Forest Massacre obsessed people.
And so a simple question, that one might read as "when will Wolfenstein come to GOG", turns into a political debate of totalitarian symbolism from years ago.;>
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Ah. Thanks for the clarification. But it's still their initiative which Germany, being a key member, would find difficult to avoid following.

Thanks to the censorship of the Hakenkreuz, the game "Death to Spies", which is set in World War 2 and is based on the Soviet side of WW2 events, features a generic black cross, or a swastika with the offending bits cut off.

Just because the EU at some point made a statement of intent, it doesn't automatically follow that the German law is a direct result of that. It may well predate the EU directive, but I have no information on that. I'm just saying that you can't simply assume that one is a result of the other. Correlation does not imply causation.

I don't get it.. What about the excellent movie , or [url=http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0363163/]Downfall.
I mean, they aren't movies that glorified the Third Reich and have an abundance of symbols, uniforms and greetings that fall under that law, yet games are censored? Crazy. Crazier than Australian Classifications.

Agreed, Downfall is a masterpiece that needs to be seen.

I did a double take when I saw the guy who played Hitler. "They had cryostasis back then?!" ;P
Awesome movie, though. And some of the YouTube clips are bloody hilarious... Downfall 2: Xbox Live.
Stalingrad is a must see. Epic war movie that focuses more on the human side of things rather than the "let's kick arse" perspective.

Yes, thanks! Thread is answered in my opinion and can be closed (or left open).
And by the way, for Commandos 1 I have to set my system settings to Austrian or something (but not the place where I live, strangely enough).
Because the mostly 60+ years old politicians (just kidding, or am I?) can't recognize games as art but recognize movies as art, and in art it is legal to show such symbols. Movies glorifying crimes etc can however be banned, but this doesn't render the possession of it illegal (this generally applies to violent pornography by law but the Bundesprüfstelle für jugendgefährdende Medien can decide if games or movies are banned like this - however, their bans on movies and games expire after some time, I think ten years, making it only not possible to advertise it in any way but allowing to sell it again).

Didn't the Bionic Commando games have Nazi symbols in them at first? I think the original version did, then it was replaced with the familiar hawk/falcon symbol for US and EU versions. And worse yet, project Albatross was an attempt to revive Hitler so you could beat him in the end of the game!!!!!!
That's a game/series with the most Nazi symbolism I have seen myself.

funniest post ever, an american trying to tell germans, of all people, they arent educated.
and back to the point: the use of the swastika is only outlawed in the context of nazi symbolism, stuff u mention like indian religion is specifically excluded from such ban.
i would generally support a ban on the use of the symbol in a racist/nationalistic/trivializing (i.e. toys and games) context, and allowing its use in stuff like art and serious movies. what i dont get though is not allowing it in certain games BUT allowing it in movies like indiana jones which are far from serious movies lolz.

I fail to see a) why movies should be seen as more "serious" than games, and b) why a game about WWII should be viewed as trivializing it.

This is amazingly accurate coming from a 16-year old american boy to be honest.
It was probably just luck. :P
But yes, the german ban on nazi symbolism is perplexing. At one side it's as if they want to escape from their history. No need to, the reasons for WW2 happening are fairly clear and didn't just involve the german side. On another side, if they're going to ban all nazi symbolism, then they'd have to ban all of the following;
* The swastika
* The death's head symbol (concentration camp units), basically a skull & crossbones
* The SS bolts (two lightning-like runes used to decorate SS uniforms)
* The Wolfsangel
* The Runic alphabet
* The Sun Cross and the Celtic Cross
* The eagle (usually depicted atop a swastika though, like in the nazi party symbol, the Parteiadler)