Sorry for not getting involved, very busy at work. I will try and get something up for real tonight.

Surely you mean not-town.

Tunnel vision on non-town player.

no. He DID turn out to be that as well, but it is only if baron had turned out to be scum that muttly would have been (basically) proven innocent. So for baron to not be mafia is bad for muttly's image.

and OH LAW Rob you did say that and I sort of quoted you as saying something else feel free to draw a little picture of me with the nose of a pig or something rational like that.

To point out though, his tunnel vision was also on a non-Mafia player too, which could be attributed to luck that he didn't hit a town player. I find it interesting you're so willing to defend him considering you fell under the same criteria that he used to start aiming at Baron.

Well, I'll be fair here, my decision to 'let Red live' wasn't much of a decision. I had no doubt in my mind that he'd be lynched after he claimed. There were no real doubts in my mind. I simply decided to try to put pressure on one of my major scum reads and see what popped up.

At this point, I think I got something out of doing it.

Ok. Right now I'm thinking Muttly as a prime suspect. I'll try to frame why.

The reveal of Baron's neutrality was basically the worst outcome in terms of proving Muttly's innocence or guilt. Yes, he found a suspicious player and ferreted him out. But I think Baron's non-Mafia status causes more distrust than reassurance.

Hypothetical situation: If Muttly is mafia, he knows who is and isn't scum, so prods at the first non-scum move that can be skewed as suspicious: Baron's move against Stuart. Baron bites and the whole argument blows out of proportion, dragging the rest of the guests into the debate.

The interesting thing is that ital jumped back on Stuart before Baron did, but Muttly was only interested to see Baron's reasoning and borderline ignores ital in his response.

So basically it comes down to whether or not I think Muttly is scum. If he is, ital is most certainly working with him. If he isn't, then I have no idea who to switch focus to. I guess it depends on how the next few posts play out.

So he is town because after 9 posts on Day 2 he took one of them and made, in your own words, "extremly weak case" out of nothing and stucked to it for the rest of day and it turned out to be case against neutral player who, according his own words, and he had no reason to lie after being lynched, tried to play on town side?

The longer this goes on the more I think there's a link between Muttly and itai. My theory yesterday of itai setting up the push on Stuart, then Muttly jumping on Baron straight after he joined itai's vote looks better by the moment.

I still cant get how Muttly completely ignored itai's voting on Stuart, yet managed to make a complete case against Baron, and argued endlessly about it for days. and now we have itai coming out and backing Muttly again.

vote Muttly - I still think he's scum, and if he flips as such, I think we have itai as a scumbuddy

Votecount:

2 - Muttly13 (Twilightbard, Robbeasy)

Not voting: Muttly, Pazzer, Stuart, Joesapphire, Peanutbrittle, Vitek, Itai.sharim

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is 1am GMT 5 February.

Okay, sorry for my absence. So I figure i will try and cover all the items against me in one try. If I miss one please let me know.

The "Itai" issue - As stated prior, he did not "do the same thing as Baron". He came right in and voted, yes, but he did not spend his time prior to hammering CB building up the "I want more info from the lynch" defense and then subsequently utterly ignore it.

The "Baron" issue - I do enjoy the folks saying Baron was not somehow a beneficial lynch were the very same who D2 said he would need to be lynched. And Vitek, I mean, come on dude. He said he was playing town so you just decide to buy it? Not only buy it, but continue to use it as some form of "proof" after he was confirmed survivor? He has an anti-town role and the means to achieve a win instantly. Youre objection based on he stated he wanted to play town is at best foolishly naive and at worst some weird victory condition for you.

The "TB Lynch a Lurker" issue - Okay. If you guys have a problem lynching lurkers, then so be it. I fail to see how that makes me scum. Any other number of people (including the player TB replaced) was fine lynching for lurking D1. And only TB has brought this up as an issue, a man conveniently not around for his opinions to be seen D1. Plus, I didnt vote for the man lynched as a lurker.

Anything else? I believe that about covers it. My opinions on scum coming shortly.

Precisely, because I don't think luck was involved here. And, I would like to emphasize that neutral player actually means Non-town.

Ahh to be mocked in his lifetime. The first sign of genius. Now, on to my actual post...

Oh, and I forgot TBs issue with me having an opinion on the NKs. I was neither the first or the only to make comments on either. Once again, I fail to see how this marks me as scum. Also the illusion hes trying to sell about me pushing it for confusions sake. I make one comment on each, hardly pushing.



My latest and greatest list...

Twilightbard - I found Orry to be somewhat suspect early in the game and I can see it continuing based on TBs thoughts on me. But of course I am biased.

Robbeasy - First, the swing vote on Baron made very little sense to me. Then using the fact Baron was not pure scum as a tool against me. I think it is very telling he did come up with the idea both Baron and I were scum. He choose two folks he possibly knew were not scum and tried to pit everyone against us both, seeing which would stick. And now Baron is gone, he claims Barons "innocence" to push on the remaining party, me.

Itai.sharim - Not any particular deep thoughts on him. He supporting me is nice, but hes doing it in such an obvious way its been a detraction instead of a boon. Possibly a ploy to push me along to "easy" lynch. I am bothered by his sometimes obvious questions to others just to appear to be involved.

Pazzer - Hard read. Didnt think much on his predecessor either.

Stuart - I still generally lean town if only due to his reaction to CrazyBear. Said it before and will do so again, I think that was a fight between some townies.

Joesapphire - Another tough one. Again he has at least somewhat seen the crux of various arguments from multiple people, so he seems to actually be thinking about things. but he is staying just far enough away from really pressing anything makes me suspect a little.

Peanutbrittle - Obviously had some strong feelings on Baron as well, most seemed to come from Baron spouting about how simple everyone was for not agreeing with him. Which I can understand from PBs point of view. I dont have a real solid read either way.

Vitek - My investigation is leaning town. Given his stated feelings on me, he isnt coming off nearly as aggressive when he could have on multiple occasions along with TB. Leads me to believe hes doesnt know for sure (as only scum would) so letting someone else take up the banner.

So if I had to pick guys out of a line-up as scum today or the day would end, I would go with TwilighBard and Robbeasy. I am somewhat doubtful however based on two things... First, I am aware that they have both voted me and I am biased, but remember that doesnt mean I am automatically wrong. Second, I find TB to be in crusader mode instead of investigator, which to me means he may just be an unwitting dupe to cover Robbs tracks. Which means since everyone was so upset I didnt vote Baron immediately before, I will oblige you all...

vote robbeasy

I'm struggling a bit with where to go next.

The question is, was Muttly's case believable regardless of the outcome. It started out as a weak comment / theory, but when combined with Red_Barons (over)reaction to it it kind of made sense. Was the fact that he found a neutral party pure luck or because Muttly saw something in Red_Baron's post that indicated he was scum? Or was it a case of scum trying to push a case on what he thought was town?

After finding bits of Red_Baron's posting to be suspicious myself I think it would be wrong of me to claim I find Muttly suspicious on the basis of his argument with Red_Baron. So it comes down to was the initial allegation sound? Possibly not but if viewed as an opener to put pressure on someone then possibly.

I need to think about this some more.

As I see it with such a small player base most players here can be regarded as experienced to some degree (I think I'm the only newbie here now(?)) so I fail to see how its noteworthy that experienced players are the NK victims.

Nah, I'm new too.