It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
USERNAME:hedwards#Q&_^Q&Q#GROUP:4At this stage it's still a rumor, but if that's the case I definitely wouldn't be buying any software that requires the PSN, especially since I'd like to do a bit of homebrew on my console and I'm sure Sony considers that to be equally illegal to actual pirate materials.
avatar
I realize that, I also realize that first sale applies and once they sell it they don't get to keep controlling how the unit is used.

It saddens me that next generation it's going to be either whatever Nintendo is selling or no console at all. But then again, I do have onLive and by that point hopefully my ISP won't suck.
avatar
Navagon: Yes, like you say, they've killed LInux support. So I don't see what's so good about that. I can kind of understand the decision in light of the fact that they were selling the consoles at a loss. It meant that people buying the console as a cheap computer were causing Sony to lose money. But even so, it's no longer a selling point of the company and that's that.
I would prefer not to entirely focus on the negative though. It was available for years via PS2 and PS3. As bothersome as it was for some people to have it removed, it was there when none of the big three were even going that far. I'm just saying that as stupid as they are sometimes, they've also displayed some intelligence for periods of time.
Post edited February 02, 2011 by EndlessKnight
avatar
EndlessKnight: I'm just saying that as stupid as they are sometimes, they've also displayed some intelligence for periods of time.
Oh I'm not calling them stupid. Not at all. They're not behaving like Ubisoft or Fox or some other absurd company that seems to exist solely because its consumer base is even more stupid than they are. No, the people at Sony are clearly very intelligent in fact.

Removing Linux support was a wise move as it stopped them from selling consoles to people who weren't going to be buying any games. This means that the loss they make on each console they sell is that much easier to recoup.

No, the moves they make aren't stupid, just contemptible and customer-hating.
avatar
Navagon: Removing Linux support was a wise move as it stopped them from selling consoles to people who weren't going to be buying any games. This means that the loss they make on each console they sell is that much easier to recoup.

No, the moves they make aren't stupid, just contemptible and customer-hating.
They don't lose money on their consoles. That was true of the earlier PS3s, but by the time the PS3 Slim came out they were making a profit on every console they sell. Even if it is a meager profit. That's why they removed all those chips from the unit which effectively prevents them from playing PS and PS2 games on it.
@OP: Well I see it as a good thing in the long run, really, because it will mean that the inevitable moment of the shit hitting the fan is coming closer. When "always-online" DRM reaches consoles, it has unmistakeably reached the mainstream. And the only reason why they can still pull it off is because the technically less informed mainstream didn't have to make enough bad experiences yet. I doubt that the majority of console users have their consoles connected every time they want to play single-player games. Also it is unsure how global Internet connection stability will develop in the long-term. In short, people will notice, and once enough people notice, that will be that.
avatar
hedwards: They don't lose money on their consoles. That was true of the earlier PS3s, but by the time the PS3 Slim came out they were making a profit on every console they sell. Even if it is a meager profit. That's why they removed all those chips from the unit which effectively prevents them from playing PS and PS2 games on it.
All PS3 systems play PS1 games, but you're likely correct with your hypothesis of the removal of the PS2 hardware. (Emotion Chip, etc......) It was likely to reduce cost per system, and to get more people to purchase PS2 hardware in addition to the PS3. I would continue to hope that they add PS2 software emulated titles to the PSN store, but considering that they (and others) are into releasing updated HD versions, I doubt they will.
Post edited February 02, 2011 by EndlessKnight
avatar
hedwards: They don't lose money on their consoles. That was true of the earlier PS3s, but by the time the PS3 Slim came out they were making a profit on every console they sell. Even if it is a meager profit. That's why they removed all those chips from the unit which effectively prevents them from playing PS and PS2 games on it.
avatar
EndlessKnight: All PS3 systems play PS1 games, but you're likely correct with your hypothesis of the removal of the PS2 hardware. (Emotion Chip, etc......) It was likely to reduce cost per system, and to get more people to purchase PS2 hardware in addition to the PS3. I would continue to hope that they add PS2 software emulated titles to the PSN store, but considering that they (and others) are into releasing updated HD versions, I doubt they will.
I forgot what those chips were all for, and now that I think about it, those were only for the PS2 emulation.
avatar
hedwards: It's worse than that, there's a rumor going around that the next 3.56 firmware adds the ability of Sony to go in and monitor what's on your box and possibly report any pirated, backed up or any software which violates their rules. Whether or not it's actually pirated or otherwise illegal.

At this stage it's still a rumor, but if that's the case I definitely wouldn't be buying any software that requires the PSN, especially since I'd like to do a bit of homebrew on my console and I'm sure Sony considers that to be equally illegal to actual pirate materials.
Since we have the root keys you can easily get rid of this, you will simply be banned from PSN. This is actually fine by me as I bought my PS3 assuming I would never be able to take part as I'm using it as a toy to pretty much sign and run whatever I want for fun (note: not cracked games). I don't think it's fair to those who bought assuming they'd be able to run OtherOS and be part of PSN, but they got screwed a long time ago.
avatar
Anamon: @OP: Well I see it as a good thing in the long run, really, because it will mean that the inevitable moment of the shit hitting the fan is coming closer. When "always-online" DRM reaches consoles, it has unmistakeably reached the mainstream. And the only reason why they can still pull it off is because the technically less informed mainstream didn't have to make enough bad experiences yet. I doubt that the majority of console users have their consoles connected every time they want to play single-player games. Also it is unsure how global Internet connection stability will develop in the long-term. In short, people will notice, and once enough people notice, that will be that.
I agree in a sense, but at the same time I doubt people will care. I mean when it comes right down to it that's the problem, people don't give a shit. I've been reading comment sections and forums about this news story all day to get a sense of the reaction and while some people are mad there are just as many defenders, and worst of all the comment sections and forum threads are not that busy, most people don't care at all.

Here is a great quote from Eurogamer's comments section:
Without an Internet connection you cannot buy this game. This is getting pissy over nothing. Did I expect more? No. We tant and moan about everything like it actually matters a whole load.
avatar
EndlessKnight: All PS3 systems play PS1 games, but you're likely correct with your hypothesis of the removal of the PS2 hardware. (Emotion Chip, etc......) It was likely to reduce cost per system, and to get more people to purchase PS2 hardware in addition to the PS3. I would continue to hope that they add PS2 software emulated titles to the PSN store, but considering that they (and others) are into releasing updated HD versions, I doubt they will.
Now I'm not 100% certain about this, but from what I remember, the earliest runs of PS3s came with the Emotion Engine chip for almost 100% backwards compatibility to PS2 games, which however was later dropped. What I'm sure about is that in Europe, no version ever had the chip, so if you wanted to play PS2 games on your PS3 you had to get an imported console. As for the PS1 games, it's possible that those with the EE chip also carried over the PS2's backwards compatibility for PS1 games, but current models definitely can't play them. The PS1 games they sell at the PlayStation Store are emulated.

avatar
StingingVelvet: I agree in a sense, but at the same time I doubt people will care. I mean when it comes right down to it that's the problem, people don't give a shit. I've been reading comment sections and forums about this news story all day to get a sense of the reaction and while some people are mad there are just as many defenders, and worst of all the comment sections and forum threads are not that busy, most people don't care at all.
Come to think of it that's somewhat understandable for games sold at an online store in the first place, also people buying games online are a lot less likely to be disconnected when they play. Add that with console games usually you don't have the problem of not being able to play on-the-go if they require a connection, because you can't play them on-the-go anyway. So I guess PSN, Xbox Marketplace & Co. won't be where the straw breaks after all. But just wait for people to realise that their supposed game collections of the last 5 years inevitably start to evaporate soon. And how does the used games market still work anyway? I see a lot of those activation-based or even account-bound games offered on online auction sites. Unless you're really informed about this stuff, you don't know that 90% of what you buy there, you will never be able to play. This is going to blow up big time one day, and not just in the industry, but in the courts.
avatar
Anamon: The PS1 games they sell at the PlayStation Store are emulated.
Well yes, that's pretty much a given, just as it is with the PSP. In any case, my PS1 discs work fine on my original 60GB PS3, and all the sites I've looked at, including the PS3 page at Wikipedia, state that they work on all PS3 models, original or slim models. I can always try one on my friend's PS3 slim, but it might be a few weeks till I visit him.

avatar
Anamon: But just wait for people to realise that their supposed game collections of the last 5 years inevitably start to evaporate soon. And how does the used games market still work anyway? I see a lot of those activation-based or even account-bound games offered on online auction sites. Unless you're really informed about this stuff, you don't know that 90% of what you buy there, you will never be able to play. This is going to blow up big time one day, and not just in the industry, but in the courts.
More than likely, they will be able to use those downloaded games on the next system as well. Take for instance the upcoming PSP2 and current PSP downloadables. It is also not unheard of for companies that are shutting down, to remove copy protection. It wouldn't be impossible to release a firmware patch to make it happen. Still, I wouldn't bank on it myself, and I agree that depending where you get your digital downloads, it can be a bit of a gamble in the long-term.
Post edited February 02, 2011 by EndlessKnight
Well, that's one reason for being happy BCR2 won't come to the PC.;/
avatar
hedwards: That's why they removed all those chips from the unit which effectively prevents them from playing PS and PS2 games on it.
It's mostly down to the sharp reduction in blu-ray drive manufacturing costs, I believe. Or was it removing the shininess (a move which is probably still making Steve Jobs' head spin)? But yes, removing backwards compatibility was definitely a part of that.
We PC users can fuck this shit with piracy or cracks. Sony, where is your god now? :-P
Post edited February 03, 2011 by KingofGnG
avatar
hedwards: That's why they removed all those chips from the unit which effectively prevents them from playing PS and PS2 games on it.
avatar
Navagon: It's mostly down to the sharp reduction in blu-ray drive manufacturing costs, I believe. Or was it removing the shininess (a move which is probably still making Steve Jobs' head spin)? But yes, removing backwards compatibility was definitely a part of that.
Yeah, that's probably a big part of it. I probably overstated that a bit. I should've phrased that better. I forgot what else they were doing. Presumably a lot of the other components are cheaper now as well, such as the HDD.

One thing I do like about the PS3 is how easy the HDD is to replace if need be.