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I really like DA2 and I'm excited to play DA: Inquisition and I will preorder for shure.

I like the way Bioware was going with DA:2 - but it was clearly a rushed job. The recycled dungeons and the spawning enemies were really annoying. But Bioware made two really good DLC which can compete with the best Mass Effect DLC.
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javier0889: To be fair, I've seen a lot of Bioware fans bashing DA2 for being sub par. It clearly is inferior to DAO, but it suffered from the same fate that doomed Ultima 8. EA rushed a game which was like 50% completed. DA2 is a good action game, but everyone expected more DAO-like content and gameplay, which is sadly absent.
There are some themes and ideas present in DA2 that are interesting to me, but I don't think it's worth buying, especially considering that this game seems to be Origin only?
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Coelocanth: I'm not saying it was a great game, and I agree it was sub-par. Hell, I didn't even like it, but the reaction to the game's shortcomings was way over the top. The different points of criticism that many people brought up were fair in and of themselves, but the hyperbole and fits of rage were almost pathetic.

The game had some elements that showed promise, some interesting sections of story, and even a few characters that were enjoyable. But it definitely showed the lack of development time and the complete overhaul of the gameplay missed the mark, IMO. But I loved the first one.

Still, as I said, I thought the overall reaction was just way too much.
Yeah, I agree with your point of view. The reaction thing is clearly seen to this day in what is known at the "metacritic scandal" http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/dragon-age-ii
Both parties are overreacting. DA2 is no "Game of the Year" for sure, but it's not the worst game ever. It's just too bland. DAO wasn't the best RPG ever made either, but it had charm and tons of content for everyone.

Stil, the thing that makes me sad is that, to this day, DAO is the closest thing to "Baldur's Gate 3" that we will ever get.
combat on DA2 was awful, it wasn't tactical like in DA:O and it wasn't complete action either(not that it would help...) and you got this spawning waves of enemies moments like in serious sam, all the time!, the fuck was that?
They took away everything about items management and armory, weapons etc, same with companions, everything was simplified to 0...
Same places over and over again!

It was a rushed, simplified game that tried to appeal everyone but fail on almost every aspect.

I don't understand how can anyone still tries to defend that intent of a game it was a cash grabber nothing more..

Dragon age inquisitor is an skyrim wanna be but at least now they focus on 1 game only and they did try (it looks like that) some of the good things about origins, like the tactical combat.... it is a shame because origins sold very well and it was headed in the right direction.
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Alekce: Dragon Age Inquisition Gameplay Video Part 2 - Redcliffe Castle (full video)

Or if you don't want to sign in to youtube, you can also watch it on this Tumblr post.

Also here is a link to the review on the GameInformer of the DA: I demo Mike Futter played.

I am apparently the only one here incredibly excited about Dragon Age Inquisition and I would have preordered it if only I had enough money currently. Unfortunately, it will have to wait. :(
Oh, well more time to replay DA:O i DA2. :D

Also, I would like to jump in with a different view about Dragon Age 2, to add a little positivity about this game to the topic. :)

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Elmofongo: -snip-
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Alekce: First of, I would like to say that everything you listed as negative points about DA2, I loved, and it's their counterparts in DA:O that actually annoyed me. For instance, the voiced main protagonist, is absolutely wonderful to me, and even before I played DA2, I had been constantly annoyed that the main protagonist in DA:O wasn't voiced.

Second, I never though of elves in DA:O as elves until I installed a wonderful mod called Elf Update that transformed them to look closer to their DA2 appearance, they have always been to me oppressed mini humans that are for some weird reason called elves. Perhaps because when I think elf, I think something very exotic and elves in DA:O most certainly weren't exotic. Shallow? Perhaps. Just my personal opinion. That is why I did a happy dance when I saw the elves in DA2. Same thing for the Qunari, I prefer their DA2 versions. Generally, I prefer DA2 looks, for any and all characters, except Zevran and Alistair, but that was obviously because someone that has never seen their original DA:O models did the designing.

The dialogue wheel, menu wheel, new approval system, every and each one I preferred in DA2 over their counterparts in DA:O. Always hated that the only way to keep the companion in DA:O with you was to suck-up to them. I have friends that have a radically different viewpoints from me and yet we are still friends and we still hang out together. Could it have been done a little better? Of course, just as well as I can point out thousand other thing that I think could have been done better in DA:O (Thank god for mods).

I also preferred the action/fighting in DA2, DA:O fighting always felt slow and clumsy to me, and I could never get the companions to do what I wanted. I personally started noticing the repeating areas in DA2 during the third playthough, and yet I still find myself rather playing another 3 DA2 playthoughs then replaying the Deep roads in DA:O. Every single time I have to replay Deep roads, I find myself lamenting the fact that there isn't a skip button to the Branka's speech. It's the most boring, most tedious part of the game for me. The Fade part in the Circle comes a close second.
Well you annoy me when you bring up negative points about DA:O. But let me organize this:

1. if you want voices fine, but please can I have the option to change voices, Though your character does not speak in dialoge you can chooese what kind of voice you want him to sound, wether wise or cocky. Saints Row did this aswell. But again my problem with Voiced Proaginist is obviously that dialoge options will take a hit, in Planescape and DA:O you had tones of Dialoge to choose from. DA2, just 3 options :P

2.I apperantly the Ears were not enough for you when it comes to elves? And the lack of Facial hair?

3.Why do you like the wheels?

4. I am sorry but sadly thats how you should put up with when it comes to the approval system, SPOILERS, in DA:O I had the choice of corrupting the Ashes of Andraste with the blood of a Dragon, of course Leliana outright hates me for doing this since she's a devout believer in the Religion of Andraste and the Maker. The new system of approval removes the element of concequences in your actions. In real life there is so much a person can take before absolutly hating someones guts and outrights leaves. Basically if you like DA2's approval system than in someways you like Meg from Family Guy's decision to keep letting her family shit on her so that they don't destroy themselves.

5. This is my breaking point. THE COMBAT IN DRAGON AGE: ORIGINS IS NOT SLOW, YOU ARE IMPATIENT!!!
And how in the hell is it clunky, do you not follow the same tactics as any of the D&D RPGs. Have a Tank attract enemies attenion by increasing you aggro while you DPSers (Damage Per Seconds) wipes them out and have a Healer stand by to aid. You can also mix and match. I have no idea why people just prefers Real time Actton in their RPGs that don't you want to try other things? As to Dragon Age 2's combat read the first part of my last post, but to summarize as in action RPG Dragon Age 2 fails in its combat system because it has this weird mixture of being action while somehow keeping some elements of Origins and failing at both. You want a real action RPG try Dragon's Dogma.

6. At first I hated the Fade, but I got used to it. I did had fun with playing around with Golem and Burining man forms. And at least the end of the Deep-Roads payed-off with the Broodmother bossfight and the whole thing with Caradain and the Anvil of the Void.
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Alekce: -snip-
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Elmofongo: Well you annoy me when you bring up negative points about DA:O. But let me organize this:

1. if you want voices fine, but please can I have the option to change voices, Though your character does not speak in dialoge you can chooese what kind of voice you want him to sound, wether wise or cocky. Saints Row did this aswell. But again my problem with Voiced Proaginist is obviously that dialoge options will take a hit, in Planescape and DA:O you had tones of Dialoge to choose from. DA2, just 3 options :P

2.I apperantly the Ears were not enough for you when it comes to elves? And the lack of Facial hair?

3.Why do you like the wheels?

4. I am sorry but sadly thats how you should put up with when it comes to the approval system, SPOILERS, in DA:O I had the choice of corrupting the Ashes of Andraste with the blood of a Dragon, of course Leliana outright hates me for doing this since she's a devout believer in the Religion of Andraste and the Maker. The new system of approval removes the element of concequences in your actions. In real life there is so much a person can take before absolutly hating someones guts and outrights leaves. Basically if you like DA2's approval system than in someways you like Meg from Family Guy's decision to keep letting her family shit on her so that they don't destroy themselves.

5. This is my breaking point. THE COMBAT IN DRAGON AGE: ORIGINS IS NOT SLOW, YOU ARE IMPATIENT!!!
And how in the hell is it clunky, do you not follow the same tactics as any of the D&D RPGs. Have a Tank attract enemies attenion by increasing you aggro while you DPSers (Damage Per Seconds) wipes them out and have a Healer stand by to aid. You can also mix and match. I have no idea why people just prefers Real time Actton in their RPGs that don't you want to try other things? As to Dragon Age 2's combat read the first part of my last post, but to summarize as in action RPG Dragon Age 2 fails in its combat system because it has this weird mixture of being action while somehow keeping some elements of Origins and failing at both. You want a real action RPG try Dragon's Dogma.

6. At first I hated the Fade, but I got used to it. I did had fun with playing around with Golem and Burining man forms. And at least the end of the Deep-Roads payed-off with the Broodmother bossfight and the whole thing with Caradain and the Anvil of the Void.
Annoying you wasn't my intention. I was attempting to point out that just because somebody didn't like the game, somebody else may have liked it.
Also I apologize if it looked like I was bashing DAO, because I wasn't doing that. I do also love Dragon Age Origins, I just love it for different reasons then DA2. Example: I loved the Dalish and Redcliffe quests and I prefer having more race options than just human, the different prologues were wonderful. I am also more fond of the DA:O story then DA2.
Just because I liked some features of DA2 more then their DA:O counterparts, does not automatically made me hate DA:O.
I also thank god for DA2 mods. :D Without some of them, playing through would have been less enjoyable.

1. I have to disagree with the statement that DA2 had only 3 conversation options. That was the just right side of the wheel, counting the left side too, there was always at least 4 option, but from what I remember most often one had 5 option. Personally (that word is important), I found most options in DA:O redundant, but like I said that is my persnal opinion.

2. No, that wasn't exotic enough for me. :) Sorry.

3. Because it wasn't rare that in Origins I clicked a dialogue option thinking it will mean something, but it meant something else. For example I interpreted that sentence as a joke, but the game treated it as serious. Having signs that further explained what which option meant was very helpful. Also I simply visually prefer the wheel over a list.

4. I strongly disagree with the comparison in the last sentence.
Some companions can actually leave, but regardless of that you have to take into account that most of them don't have anywhere to go. Fenris has no one, Merill has no one, Carver and Bethany are stuck with you, Aveline if you aren't friendly is more there to keep an eye on you then anything else and so on.

5. I never claimed I wasn't impatient. :D That is indeed very true for any kind of combat for me. I have actually followed those rules but what I have to point out is that I don't like controlling companions directly and that was what I had to do. No matter how I set their tactics I could never get them to do what I want. That was what I meant. It is entirely possible I just suck at DA:O/tactical combat. :)
Not that DA2 combat was perfect or something like that. Far from it, but I still maintain that I prefer DA2 combat. That is a personal preference.

6. I just can't, having to replay Deep roads makes me want to play another game or cry from frustration, but that is why I always do it first or second and Dalish after so I am always motivated to get to the Dalish. For the Fade yes, I got used to it after the 7-8 playthough, not that boring as Deep roads.

EDIT: About the voices.... I found the voice option in DA:O utterly and completely meaningless. I prefer the character without battlecries if that is the only dialogue we will have, their random comments got annoying after the 3 playthrough.
Post edited July 11, 2014 by Alekce
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Elmofongo: Well you annoy me when you bring up negative points about DA:O. But let me organize this:

1. if you want voices fine, but please can I have the option to change voices, Though your character does not speak in dialoge you can chooese what kind of voice you want him to sound, wether wise or cocky. Saints Row did this aswell. But again my problem with Voiced Proaginist is obviously that dialoge options will take a hit, in Planescape and DA:O you had tones of Dialoge to choose from. DA2, just 3 options :P

2.I apperantly the Ears were not enough for you when it comes to elves? And the lack of Facial hair?

3.Why do you like the wheels?

4. I am sorry but sadly thats how you should put up with when it comes to the approval system, SPOILERS, in DA:O I had the choice of corrupting the Ashes of Andraste with the blood of a Dragon, of course Leliana outright hates me for doing this since she's a devout believer in the Religion of Andraste and the Maker. The new system of approval removes the element of concequences in your actions. In real life there is so much a person can take before absolutly hating someones guts and outrights leaves. Basically if you like DA2's approval system than in someways you like Meg from Family Guy's decision to keep letting her family shit on her so that they don't destroy themselves.

5. This is my breaking point. THE COMBAT IN DRAGON AGE: ORIGINS IS NOT SLOW, YOU ARE IMPATIENT!!!
And how in the hell is it clunky, do you not follow the same tactics as any of the D&D RPGs. Have a Tank attract enemies attenion by increasing you aggro while you DPSers (Damage Per Seconds) wipes them out and have a Healer stand by to aid. You can also mix and match. I have no idea why people just prefers Real time Actton in their RPGs that don't you want to try other things? As to Dragon Age 2's combat read the first part of my last post, but to summarize as in action RPG Dragon Age 2 fails in its combat system because it has this weird mixture of being action while somehow keeping some elements of Origins and failing at both. You want a real action RPG try Dragon's Dogma.

6. At first I hated the Fade, but I got used to it. I did had fun with playing around with Golem and Burining man forms. And at least the end of the Deep-Roads payed-off with the Broodmother bossfight and the whole thing with Caradain and the Anvil of the Void.
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Alekce: Annoying you wasn't my intention. I was attempting to point out that just because somebody didn't like the game, somebody else may have liked it.
Also I apologize if it looked like I was bashing DAO, because I wasn't doing that. I do also love Dragon Age Origins, I just love it for different reasons then DA2. Example: I loved the Dalish and Redcliffe quests and I prefer having more race options than just human, the different prologues were wonderful. I am also more fond of the DA:O story then DA2.
Just because I liked some features of DA2 more then their DA:O counterparts, does not automatically make me hate DA:O.
I also thank god for DA2 mods. :D Without some playing through would have been less enjoyable.

1. I have to disagree with the statement that DA2 had only 3 conversation options. That was the just right side of the wheel, counting the left side too, there was always at least 4 option, but from what I remember most often one had 5 option. Personally (that word is important), I found most options in DA:O redundant, but like I said that is my persnal opinion.

2. No, that wasn't exotic enough for me. :) Sorry.

3. Because it wasn't rare that in Origins I clicked a dialogue option thinking it will mean something, but it meant something else. For example I interpreted that sentence as a joke, but the game treated it as serious. Having signs that further explained what which option meant was very helpful. Also I simply visually prefer the wheel over a list.

4. I strongly disagree with the comparison in the last sentence.
Some companions can actually leave, but regardless of that you have to take into account that most of them don't have anywhere to go. Fenris has no one, Merill has no one, Carver and Bethany are stuck with you, Aveline if you aren't friendly is more there to keep an eye on you then anything else and so on.

5. I never claimed I wasn't impatient. :D That is indeed very true for any kind of combat for me. I have actually followed those rules but what I have to point out is that I don't like controlling companions directly and that was what I had to do. No matter how I set their tactics I could never get them to do what I want. That was what I meant. It is entirely possible I just suck at DA:O/tactical combat. :)
Not that DA2 combat was perfect or something like that. Far from it, but I still maintain that I prefer DA2 combat. That is a personal preference.

6. I just can't, having to replay Deep roads makes me want to play another game or cry from frustration, but that is why I always do it first or second and Dalish after so I am always motivated to get to the Dalish. For the Fade yes, I got used to it after the 7-8 playthough, not that boring as Deep roads.

EDIT: About the voices.... I found the voice option in DA:O utterly and completely meaningless. I prefer the character without battlecries if that is the only dialogue we will have, their random comments got annoying after the 3 playthrough.
Firstly do you play DA:O on PC, because the console version is quite sucky, the game is made for PC. first. Here is some tips with the Tactics in DA:O.

1. Do not bother with the Tactics system. You can do anything you want manually. For example just click on your attacking mage wether its morrigan or yourself. And press the spell of your choosing. Thats whole point of the ability to pause the battle and queue you attacks. Running low on Health, Pause so you can heal before your destroyed. And thats not cheating enemies hurt a lot faster so its expected.

2. Though it has been a staple in RPG combat since its inception, DA:O mostly borrows the party philosiphy of MMORPGs these day, mostly Warcraft, but you have control of all 4 party members. The pattern is as follows. Tanks (Warrior with Shiled and Weapon skill) are self-explanitory, they have High Health and Defense and have an high Aggro (Aggresiveness) to attract enemies thus foucsing solely on him. DPSers are the Damage dealers, they tend to be weaker in defense but makes up for it in Offense. They come in 3 forms. Melee DPS favoring Dual Weapons or Two Handed Weapons or Ranged that uses a Bow/Crossbow and A Mage dealing deadly magic attacks. Healer/Buffer is obvious.
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Alekce: -snip-
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Elmofongo: Firstly do you play DA:O on PC, because the console version is quite sucky, the game is made for PC. first. Here is some tips with the Tactics in DA:O.

1. Do not bother with the Tactics system. You can do anything you want manually. For example just click on your attacking mage wether its morrigan or yourself. And press the spell of your choosing. Thats whole point of the ability to pause the battle and queue you attacks. Running low on Health, Pause so you can heal before your destroyed. And thats not cheating enemies hurt a lot faster so its expected.

2. Though it has been a staple in RPG combat since its inception, DA:O mostly borrows the party philosiphy of MMORPGs these day, mostly Warcraft, but you have control of all 4 party members. The pattern is as follows. Tanks (Warrior with Shiled and Weapon skill) are self-explanitory, they have High Health and Defense and have an high Aggro (Aggresiveness) to attract enemies thus foucsing solely on him. DPSers are the Damage dealers, they tend to be weaker in defense but makes up for it in Offense. They come in 3 forms. Melee DPS favoring Dual Weapons or Two Handed Weapons or Ranged that uses a Bow/Crossbow and A Mage dealing deadly magic attacks. Healer/Buffer is obvious.
I play on PC. :)

About 1. and 2., as I have said I don't want to do it manually but I am playing like that because I mostly have no choice (some mods help, "Advanced Tactics", I love you). That is what annoys me. What is the point of the tactical system when it is useless? The tactical system also wasn't spectacular in DA2 but for some reason it worked better for me, as in I didn't need to micromanage the battles. Possible because they were shorter on average? Hm.
People should NOT be supporting BioWare. Nowadays BioWare games are actually "hooks" to entice fans to install/use Origin and pay for DLCs at full prices. This is BioWare's business model: you pay the full price for the main game, or maybe you pay $7, 10 or $12 for it when it's on sale. However, you would have to pay another $80 to $120 for all the story DLCs to get the "full/complete experience" of the game. (BioWare DLCs are NEVER discounted, even years and years after they came out.)

Moreover, BioWare no longer releases "Game of the Year", "Complete" or "Gold/Platinum" edition of their games that would include all DLCs and expansions. BioWare wants people to pay for the DLCs, individually, at full prices.

Then there is the "BioWare points" scam. You cannot directly pay for BioWare DLCS with a currency, (i.e., dollar, euro, whatever.) You'd have to buy "BioWare points", and then use those points to pay for DLCs. BioWare points are packaged in incrementals to make customers always pay more than they actually need.

An example: let say you want a couple of Mass Effect 2 or 3 DLCs, which should cost 650 BioWare points (about $5 to $7). However, BioWare does not sell 650 points; but they sell 800 points for $10. So you end up paying more ($10) when the stuff you want would actually cost $5 to $7. You have 50 points leftover, which can only be used to buy BioWare stuff - except the 50 points are not enough to buy anything. So BioWare can sell you more points. BioWare points are calculated, structured and packaged in ways to always make people pay more than necessary. That is the soft scam BioWare is running.

I do not agree with their business model, so I'd pass this game...and all future BioWare games. It's a pity, but I have too many games in my Steam and GOG libraries with which I can't keep up, so I won't miss them. I just wish people would STOP supporting BioWare's business model - and show that decision to BioWare with their wallets.
Post edited July 11, 2014 by ktchong
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javier0889: DAO is the closest thing to "Baldur's Gate 3" that we will ever get.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Eternity
http://eternity.obsidian.net
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity
Post edited July 11, 2014 by SeduceMePlz
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javier0889: DAO is the closest thing to "Baldur's Gate 3" that we will ever get.
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SeduceMePlz: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Eternity
http://eternity.obsidian.net
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity
I'm well aware of this project, but I don't think it will be BG-like even when the press is marketing it as that. I do remmeber hearing/reading the guy behind the "Enhanced Editions" of BG being "interested" in developing BG3 as a long term goal.
kinda not impressed so far , its either game engine or just looks bland nowhere close to the hype levels witcher 3 videos bring
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SeduceMePlz: Pillars of Eternity
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javier0889: I'm well aware of this project, but I don't think it will be BG-like even when the press is marketing it as that.
I'm curious why you think that. I've followed the project updates, and so far it seems much more similar to BG than DA:O.

(I like DA:O despite its flaws but hate DA2 and have no interest in Inquistion.)
Post edited July 12, 2014 by SeduceMePlz
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javier0889: I'm well aware of this project, but I don't think it will be BG-like even when the press is marketing it as that.
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SeduceMePlz: I'm curious why you think that. I've followed the project updates, and so far it seems much more similar to BG than DA:O.

(I like DA:O despite its flaws but hate DA2 and have no interest in Inquistion.)
In the last weeks, the gaming press has been talking about PoE as "a return to the BG-like rpgs", and while it is isometric, I believe Obsidian's design notions will make it quite different to BG. That was a Bioware game, after all, and Obsidian is practically Black Isle. If anything, I'd say it will be more like Icewind Dale.
btw are we going to get a closure for dragon age 2 or its just abandoned ?
No matter how awesome the game play video is, not going to buy this game until I'm sure, it's not as bad as Dragon Age 2.