Yeah that's the story I got once there were enough people to speak to who'd played through it with enough attention to actually look for variations. It makes me wonder if they'll be able to successfully sell any DLC for it. I mean, maybe they could make some horse armor DLC and sell that, dunno, presumably people buy Dog Potions for Fable 3.

The real question is how a developer like Bioware could be pressured to release a game like this. Do they feel proud? Do they feel shame? Do they laugh at us while they snort coke and bang prostitutes? I really don't know. And doesn't this concern anyone waiting for ME3? Because I am concerned. I never had much hope for Old Republic so I'll be filled with "meh" should it turn out like this.

I believe you said at one point that this would be an okay effort from some other developers. And perhaps it is okay compared to Gothic 4 or something, but that's like saying, "Hey Heinlen, I thought your book was ass, but then I read this so-so trash fantasy novel and it's better than that, so good job!" No, if I read Heinlen, I expect it to be good.

I suspect we'd all forgive them if the whole thing didn't feel like a cash in, but that's what it does feel like, am I wrong?

Like I said earlier in the thread i'm starting to think Bioware weren't put under any pressure to release this game. I'm sure EA said that releasing DA2 and ME3 close to one another would be a bad move but I think that's as far as it goes. Judging from the interviews with Mike Laidlaw this is exactly the product they wanted to make. When the lead level designer comes out and says he didn't think having ONE cave would be an issue you realize there is something seriously wrong with the Dragon Age team. Exactly what were all those level designers doing? Making sure Kirkwall was exactly the right shade of Brown?

I still stand by the fact DA2 is a decent game and if it had been a stand alone product it wouldn't be coming under all this hate. The fact is though that this is a sequel to Dragon Age a game that despite winning awards and praise Laidlaw calls deeply flawed. Fans and critics alike agree Dragon Age 2 is not an improvement to Dragon Age at all it all depends on if Laidlaw realizes that or if he is going to stick to his guns and push further into the mainstream with Dragon Age 3.

As for the DLC The Dragon Age team already have a shitty reputation with DLC which is only made worse by the fact ME2's was so good. I can't imagine anyone will buy any DLC for DA2 unless it's fully reviewed first. I bought enough Bioware points for ME2's Arrival as I know that's going to be good but those will be the last I buy by the looks of it.

This reminds me of the days when Bioware and Pandemic were together. One studio churning out quality and the other churning out mostly generic rubbish. Only now the good and the bad are both under the Bioware name.

That's the problem though, my Halo buddy, he is the mainstream, he didn't like the demo and given what he said about it the full meal deal would turn him off too. And while he, by himself, is merely an anecdote, I haven't heard about any non-RPG players that suddenly converted, have you? It doesn't sound like they pushed into the mainstream at all, it just sounds like they pushed into the "mediocre-stream", which is sad, there's few enough shops that will push out a high budget RPG these days.

Or Ion Storm, one team pushing out Deus Ex under Spector and the other shitting out Daikatana under Romero.

Actually a friend I recommended Origins to and loved it is a pure console gamer and she never played Baldur's Gate or KOTOR. She absolutely hated DA2 after rushing out and pre-ordering it. Judging by the sales figures it seems sales are only strong based on pre-orders. They didn't succeed in impressing the CoD crowd and at the same time alienated people who liked the original so if Bioware allow Laidlaw to continue this car crash then DA3 is going to be a total wreck.
Kudos! Much better analogy :D

I'm not sure if any of the true devs will hear us here. Over at the bioware social forum, many are picking the good and bad about it. If you really want to get heard and turn things around. One needs to voice there and directly at the devs via email or PM.

I've played the computer D&D series from the gold box days to NWN2. I've been debating on weather or not to get DA:O for the Mac or PS3 just to see how Bioware did on this game. Will install the demo so I can see how will DA2 look and run. Granted this is going to be very hard because I'll be using Parallels 6 on my Mac for this.

But the bottom line I want to say is this. WoTC have ruined what D&D should be. And if these other companies keep following how WoTC are doing, there will be no more good D&D games. This goes for Bioware on their game. Keep going this route of making rushed FPS games and lose even more users when FPS fall flat and when the dust settles there is no story to continue on. This is my feeling based on you all reports on the game. I shall found out soon enough or I hope so soon.

Ossian Studios will have The Shadow Sun coming out this late spring for the iOS. That means for iPods and iPads to have a RPG that might be as close to D&D as we are going to get.

Solo

I wouldn't worry too much about ME3. Different teams and, as Delixe noted, the DLC for ME2 was very good as well.

I have to admit I'm concerned about any potential sequels in the DA series. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that all these positive spins they're putting on DA2 reviews are just PR since the game has only just been released. I'll be watching closely months down the road to see what is being said about DA3 (assuming there will be one) and what they start saying about what needs to be improved/changed from DA2. If it still looks bleak, then DA3 will be the first BioWare game since I discovered BioWare that won't be a guaranteed instabuy. And it may be the first one I'll pass on completely. That's a sad thing.

The major reason I thought DA:O sucked was because I got it on console. I know you have a Mac, but the PC version is soooooo much better.

Side note: I know a lot of old pen and paper guys hate the new AD&D, but seriously, it's 4E is actually closer to original AD&D than 3.5 was (which seems to be many folks holy grail). If you could automate many of the rules in 3.5 it would be tolerable, but taking half the day to fight a party of 8 kobolds kind of spoils the whole thing for me.
Porting from iOS to Android isn't that hard from what I hear. Unless its using Rage3D (or whatever Carmack's new baby is) it shouldn't be an issue.

That doesn't help me either.

Well, Android emulators are free if you don't need a touch screen to play. If the game is intended to be played with a touchscreen you're probably going to need one. I don't think Fruit Ninja would be all that fun with a mouse and keyboard.

For those interested, I just read the review from the French magazine (Joystick) which started some micro controversy some months by mentioning that they felt that the game was seriously "consolized".

Well the review is not a surprise : 13 out of 20

Their conclusion: + A well thought plot
+ A real graphical style
+ A good interface

- Immersion is difficult
- Companion management is painful
- Too many incoherence

Basically the tone of their review is : "even with all the changes it could have been a good game but sadly it isn't".

Further proof that Laidlaw has lost it. Link.

this is establishing a solid foundation that keeps a lot, in fact almost everything I want to keep about Origins, but still has tons of room to grow and, frankly, a more viable future for the franchise.

So essentially he is saying that Origins was rubbish and had no future in it's existing form. He is also saying that all the stuff he liked from Origins exists in DA2. The rest of the stuff that he didn't like was pruned and will never return.

This would be the same Origins that sold over 5 million copies, won countless critic awards and a loyal fanbase.

Somebody needs to punch him in the face to shut him up.

The least he could do is share whatever he's be smoking cause it looks like it's some powerful shit.

This is sad, has this guy even worked for anyone but Bioware? Perhaps he wants to get a future for it similar to Sonic The Hedgehog's future, I know I anticipate each, new Sonic game's attempt to milk a dead character for more money.

Also, this gem is worth posting, "Laidlaw goes on to say that the strong reactions, whether negative or positive, point toward the fact that people care about Dragon Age, which is what BioWare wants."

They soon won't if you keep spitting in their faces. Just saying, Laidlaw.

He's too close, can't see the forest for the trees, and probably doesn't want to admit that he botched such a huge selling franchise. Was this guy even in charge of DA:O? I know he worked on the team, but it doesn't sound like it.

Bioware should defnitely hire a plumber, i'm willing to bet there's lyrium in the water pipes over at Bioware HQ and lyrium does weird things to a man's mind, just ask any Templar you know.