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It still has some form of DRM. If you want patches/MP, you need to register on Stardock site and dnl Impulse client for updates. Basically you NEED to dnl a third party aplication and register to the publisher's site. And that's a big NO for me. What's wrong with having a manual standalone patch and an in-game key for playing online? Why the **** i need to do all this mumbo-jumbo just to play the damn game?? This is why i hate DRMs, in all it's forms.
Post edited April 15, 2009 by DG
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Bodyless: retail stardock games usually have no drm. if you patch it or download it via impule it will come with goo (or an early version of it) and will need and online activiation. but you wont notice it since impulse will handle that automaticly since you are online at that time anyway.
Sins of solar empire had a few standalone patches. no idea if this is going to happen again.

You will never see a stand alone patch from SD ever again. Everything they do is through Impulse which is their DRM. They will never admit to it, but it is none-the-less.
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DG: It still has some form of DRM. If you want patches/MP, you need to register on Stardock site and dnl Impulse client for updates. Basically you NEED to dnl a third party aplication and register to the publisher's site. And that's a big NO for me. What's wrong with having a manual standalone patch and an in-game key for playing online? Why the **** i need to do all this mumbo-jumbo just to play the damn game?? This is why i hate DRMs, in all it's forms.

on the other hand, whats wrong with doing it through impulse?
Because:
1. I don't want to install any other programs just because the DRM guys want this. If tomorow all the devs/publishers will make their personal update programs, in order to patch their games, i will have crapload of third party software installed on my pc just for updates. It sucks and i don't want to support this kind of practices.
2. What if after 5 or 10 years i want to play Demigod, but i cannot update it with the last patch because i don't have a manual, standalone patch at hand? Maybe i don't have acces to the internet. Maybe Stardock/Impulse will go out of business.
These are kind of problems that make DRM (ANY form of it) such a hated thing. What's wrong with a site like GoG? They keep all their games updated and what you download is yours and you can install it where you want it and when you want it! Why wouldn't this work for modern games? If i wanna play a game illegaly, there will allways be cracks available for DRM games. The only downside is i won't be able to play online, but that's what cd keys are for (for legal purchases).
It should be so simple, but noooo...
Post edited April 15, 2009 by DG
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DG: Because:
1. I don't want to install any other programs just because the DRM guys want this. If tomorow all the devs/publishers will make their personal update programs, in order to patch their games, i will have crapload of third party software installed on my pc just for updates. It sucks and i don't want to support this kind of practices.
2. What if after 5 or 10 years i want to play Demigod, but i cannot update it with the last patch because i don't have a manual, standalone patch at hand? Maybe i don't have acces to the internet. Maybe Stardock/Impulse will go out of business.
These are kind of problems that make DRM (ANY form of it) such a hated thing. What's wrong with a site like GoG? They keep all their games updated and what you download is yours and you can install it where you want it and when you want it! Why wouldn't this work for modern games? If i wanna play a game illegaly, there will allways be cracks available for DRM games. The only downside is i won't be able to play online, but that's what cd keys are for (for legal purchases).
It should be so simple, but noooo...

Well, the positive side of a system like this is it prevents pirates from getting the updates. Or, that's the idea anyway. I'm not sure how effective it is. Impulse isn't a big deal to me..I doubt you'd ever have to have a "crapload" of software installed..one or two programs at most.
Your second point is valid, though..I'm going to email them about this.
They dont do standalone patches cause these patches may be used to patch a demo to a full verison of the game.
and atm impusle is still a less annyoing form of drm. you can play the unpatched version without it, you can archive the patched version and transfer it to another computer, it makes patching fast and easy and the patches they produce are worth it.
cd keys and clientside drm like diskchecks will in the long run require more work from the user. and are obsolete anyway. well except starfoce and securom but i dont know anyone who likes these.
Impulse is the sucscessor of stardock central which existed even before steam.
And i didnt saw any patches on gog yet. all games here are no longer getting new patches neither does gog produce any patches. they simply make the latest version work and upload them. you cannot compare that to a new game from a publisher/developer with its own store and client.
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DG: Because:
1. I don't want to install any other programs just because the DRM guys want this. If tomorow all the devs/publishers will make their personal update programs, in order to patch their games, i will have crapload of third party software installed on my pc just for updates. It sucks and i don't want to support this kind of practices.
2. What if after 5 or 10 years i want to play Demigod, but i cannot update it with the last patch because i don't have a manual, standalone patch at hand? Maybe i don't have acces to the internet. Maybe Stardock/Impulse will go out of business.
These are kind of problems that make DRM (ANY form of it) such a hated thing. What's wrong with a site like GoG? They keep all their games updated and what you download is yours and you can install it where you want it and when you want it! Why wouldn't this work for modern games? If i wanna play a game illegaly, there will allways be cracks available for DRM games. The only downside is i won't be able to play online, but that's what cd keys are for (for legal purchases).
It should be so simple, but noooo...

I'm sorry but, get over yourself and adjust a little bit. There is absolutley nothing wrong with protecting your work. How you do it, on the other hand is the bigger question.
Post edited April 15, 2009 by Hammerfall
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DG: Because:
1. I don't want to install any other programs just because the DRM guys want this. If tomorow all the devs/publishers will make their personal update programs, in order to patch their games, i will have crapload of third party software installed on my pc just for updates. It sucks and i don't want to support this kind of practices.
2. What if after 5 or 10 years i want to play Demigod, but i cannot update it with the last patch because i don't have a manual, standalone patch at hand? Maybe i don't have acces to the internet. Maybe Stardock/Impulse will go out of business.
These are kind of problems that make DRM (ANY form of it) such a hated thing. What's wrong with a site like GoG? They keep all their games updated and what you download is yours and you can install it where you want it and when you want it! Why wouldn't this work for modern games? If i wanna play a game illegaly, there will allways be cracks available for DRM games. The only downside is i won't be able to play online, but that's what cd keys are for (for legal purchases).
It should be so simple, but noooo...
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chautemoc: Well, the positive side of a system like this is it prevents pirates from getting the updates. Or, that's the idea anyway. I'm not sure how effective it is. Impulse isn't a big deal to me..I doubt you'd ever have to have a "crapload" of software installed..one or two programs at most.
Your second point is valid, though..I'm going to email them about this.

I really dislike programs that stay in residence in your memory unless you do something about it, put icons in your web browsers and quick start bar and start program menu and on your desktop, and slow your start-up to a crawl by immediately trying to connect, along with every other program, to the internet and transfer useless or private information to the company's home planet or just check what's going on there. I've had new programs sometimes fail to negotiate properly with other programs trying to do the same thing and drastically slow down or even hang the computer entirely shortly after start-up. I find the extra things game makers add to slow down my computer and clutter up its memory and its disk space aggravating at best, and I feel it is borderline unethical. You are buying a game, not giving out an unlimited key to access your system, put crapware and advertising on it, and do stuff unrelated to playing a game.
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chautemoc: Well, the positive side of a system like this is it prevents pirates from getting the updates. Or, that's the idea anyway. I'm not sure how effective it is. Impulse isn't a big deal to me..I doubt you'd ever have to have a "crapload" of software installed..one or two programs at most.
Your second point is valid, though..I'm going to email them about this.
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Blarg: I really dislike programs that stay in residence in your memory unless you do something about it, put icons in your web browsers and quick start bar and start program menu and on your desktop, and slow your start-up to a crawl by immediately trying to connect, along with every other program, to the internet and transfer useless or private information to the company's home planet or just check what's going on there. I've had new programs sometimes fail to negotiate properly with other programs trying to do the same thing and drastically slow down or even hang the computer entirely shortly after start-up. I find the extra things game makers add to slow down my computer and clutter up its memory and its disk space aggravating at best, and I feel it is borderline unethical. You are buying a game, not giving out an unlimited key to access your system, put crapware and advertising on it, and do stuff unrelated to playing a game.

Maybe your computer sucks?
I find Steam annoying that way..Impulse not really, though I haven't given it much use. Either way, you only have to use it for updates and for some games, to install (this will happen less often once Goo becomes more prominent, and I believe this is the goal).
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chautemoc: Well, the positive side of a system like this is it prevents pirates from getting the updates. Or, that's the idea anyway. I'm not sure how effective it is. .

That's the thing, it's not. Look at updates of Steam only games. When an update rolls out, the pirates crack it and put it online. Or look at GTA 4 patches: GTA 4 has a TON of DRM: Games for Windows, Securom and the Rockstar club application. And with all these protection, they still crack the updates and make them available to the pirated copies.
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Hammerfall: There is absolutley nothing wrong with protecting your work

It is, because it's futile, as i explained above, and it's a pain in the ass for the legal user.
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Bodyless: and atm impusle is still a less annyoing form of drm. you can play the unpatched version without it, you can archive the patched version and transfer it to another computer, it makes patching fast and easy and the patches they produce are worth it.

Yes, but that computer, where you transfer your game, must have the Impulse client and must be online the first time when you install it there, from the arhive. Or maybe i'm wrong about this, i never tried it, just read about it.
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Bodyless: cd keys and clientside drm like diskchecks will in the long run require more work from the user.

Cd keys work very well for online play. You can't play a game online without a valid cd-key. Think of Blizzard games, for example. As for SP games, any form of DRM (be it ancient, like cd checks and cd key, or modern like Securom, Impulse Goo, etc) is defeatable. That's why is futile to try to protect you games with DRM, imo...
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Bodyless: And i didnt saw any patches on gog yet. all games here are no longer getting new patches neither does gog produce any patches.

Look more carefully at the description: All games on GoG are patched with the latest available patch. The same thing can be done with modern games. For example Gamersgate: when Braid was patched, it was automatically patched server side. Of course it's easier to release a manual patch, since you don't have to dnl again the whole game, but i prefer it to the Impulse and Steam's solution.
Think about it. Imagine ten years from now, when games like Demigod would be just like some of the good old games around here: their devs don't exists any more, the publishers have been bought by others or dissapeared, etc. In that case, where would you get your updates from? Where will get the last patch?
Post edited April 15, 2009 by DG
You can backup your latest version from Impulse I think. But installing it needs Impulse or not I dont know it. I just imagine I didnt use Impulse.
Post edited April 15, 2009 by acare84
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acare84: You can backup your latest version from Impulse I think. But installing it needs Impulse or not I dont know it. I just imagine I didnt use Impulse.

http://forums.stardock.com/336339
http://www.impulsedriven.com/support/activation_info.aspx
Basically you will need Impulse installed and you will have to reactivate whenever you restore from backup.
In a nutshell you will be completely dependent on Impulse being around in order to install/restore your games. Notice I didn't say "play", as according to the About page you can play offline once the game is installed.
I originally bought Sins of a Solar Empire retail before I realized that it would eventually be tied to a digital distribution service in order to receive patches. :|
Edit:
Off-topic from the last thing you said, but I thought this was interesting:
http://forums.demigodthegame.com/346061/page/1/#2137434
It's not DRM, but the phone-home aspect of that is a little shocking. I imagine for people playing off-line it would be a real pain to have that sort of lag on startup.
Edit #2:
http://forums.demigodthegame.com/346061/page/1/#2137579
It would appear that they actually are having the game phone home on purpose. Shady ...
Post edited April 15, 2009 by deoren
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acare84: You can backup your latest version from Impulse I think. But installing it needs Impulse or not I dont know it. I just imagine I didnt use Impulse.
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deoren: http://forums.stardock.com/336339
http://www.impulsedriven.com/support/activation_info.aspx
Basically you will need Impulse installed and you will have to reactive whenever you restore from backup.

Actually both you an acare84 are right.
If you use Impulse "official" backup then yes you need Impulse to reactivate your backup when you restore it, BUT if you simply copy the game install folder and copy it to another computer then you don't need either Impulse or to reactivate your games online, you can play the copy on any computer without any problems.
That works, until now, for all Stardock games and for game with no 3rd party DRM like Braid and some others....
I said until now because it no longer works for Demigod so I don't know if it will continue to work for the other games like SoSE.
Post edited April 15, 2009 by Gersen
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deoren: http://forums.stardock.com/336339
http://www.impulsedriven.com/support/activation_info.aspx
Basically you will need Impulse installed and you will have to reactive whenever you restore from backup.
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Gersen: Actually both you an acare84 are right.
If you use Impulse "official" backup then yes you need Impulse to reactivate your backup when you restore it, BUT if you simply copy the game install folder and copy it to another computer then you don't need either Impulse or to reactivate your games online, you can play the copy on any computer without any problems.
That works, until now, for all Stardock games and for game with no 3rd party DRM like Braid and some others....
I said until now because it no longer works for Demigod so I don't know if it will continue to work for the other games like SoSE.

Well that sucks. I noticed that and was going to buy SoaSE:Entrenchment for that reason, but now I'm having second thoughts as I really wanted to be able to make backups of my games (real backups, not the kind that require phone-home permissions to work).
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deoren: Well that sucks. I noticed that and was going to buy SoaSE:Entrenchment for that reason, but now I'm having second thoughts as I really wanted to be able to make backups of my games (real backups, not the kind that require phone-home permissions to work).

I asked on Impulse forum if the Demigod "feature" was going to appear on older games as well or if those are going to remains DRM-free...
I will post an update here if I get an answer...
Post edited April 15, 2009 by Gersen