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Gazoinks: epub is kind of the universal format (and is DRM-free). It doesn't work on Kindle, but I use the E-book manager software Calibre which converts it (and other stuff like CBR) automatically.

EDIT: And, as I said, actual e-readers already have e-ink.
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Immoli: epub sounds nice. Might need to check into ereaders again soon. You know if there are any good ereaders that support that format? One that would allow me to purchase from anywhere and just copy-paste the file onto the reader? Don't really want one that sync, especially after Amazon's removal of books people bought from their kindles.
Kobo books sells their books in the epub format and their eReaders support both DRM'd and DRM-Free books:
http://www.kobobooks.com/ereaders
AFAIK you can import DRM-Free epub files gotten from anywhere to your eReader even if they aren't part of your Kobo collection.

They also have apps for smartphones, tablets, and PC/Macs. I've used it on my phone to read books gotten from Kobo and others I downloaded from manybooks.net (DRM-Free). I like their app more than the Kindle app for Android (it even has achievements :P)
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orcishgamer: Sadly I don't even know who to root for, save the few authors who are genuinely against DRM.
Why root for either?
To them you're just a wallet, and neither is on your side, so why should you be on theirs?
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OmegaX: Blah.
Thanks, I'll have to check those out.
Btw, if anyone's looking for e-book sites, FeedBooks is my fav. In addition to the standard bestsellers and stuff, they have tons and tons of free public domain books as well as some cool self-published stuff. http://www.feedbooks.com/
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HereForTheBeer: Agree. Digital readers use a whole lot of not-so-great stuff in their manufacturing processes like, say, oil for the plastics and whatever not-so-pleasant stuff the battery is made from. And a whole lot of recycled paper goes into a typical book (less so with the glossy stuff, but those can be recycled into less fancy papers). And trees are a lot more renewable than plastic and the expensive metals needed for electronics.

And one can't ignore the transportation systems required, be it a truck going to the retail store or a digital download server farm sucking up a lot of power to run the cooling systems.

Basically, pick your poison, but don't do so based on some attempt to feel good about being 'green'.
I second the agreement, or something. Is that proper procedure? Anyway, I like renewable energy and all that but I can't stand it either when people parade digital around as being a savior. Chris Avellone did it one time when talking in an interview about how he loved that PC gaming has gotten rid of used games for the most part.

I'd like to see some numbers. IMO, digital for the most part just puts more of the cost on the consumer, which isn't necessarily bad. Instead of the producer paying the shipping, the consumer pays for their internet connection each month and pays more for a higher bandwidth if they purchase a lot of things digitally.

The reason I would like an e-reader is because it is appealing to me to have a library that can be referenced offline on this little square thingy. Especially one that uses e-ink so that the battery can last for weeks.
Post edited May 04, 2012 by KyleKatarn
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crazy_dave: ...
Music sold digitally was never DRMed.
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crazy_dave: ...
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kavazovangel: Music sold digitally was never DRMed.
What have you been smoking?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairPlay
Napster sold digital .wma files with DRM on them for a few years too.
Post edited May 04, 2012 by KyleKatarn
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Elmofongo: why would I want to carry 40 books with me when I am going somewhere instead 1 or 3? especially since books have a lot of pages which gives me alot of time to invest in one book
We obviously don't read the same kinds of books ;).

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KyleKatarn: Actually, power companies lobby quite hard as well. They don't mind renewables as long as they are the only ones allowed to sell it on the grid...
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Elmofongo: sadly we will not see solar,wind,or hydro becoming the norm in where we get energy because the oil compenies will lobby government to not let that happen
Actually, a big chunk of our electricity here is produced by a public company that uses dams to produce hydroelectricity.

Because of this, our energy bills are very low compared to other places.

It's our little pride and joy.

Granted, erecting the dam causes some environmental damage, but then it allows us to produce energy in a renewable manner without further damage.

Very few modes of energy creation can claim to do better.

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Immoli: I was interested in getting an e-book a few years back. Decided against it because of the DRM and the lack of a universal standard like MP3. Didn't like the idea of getting a kindle, buying kindle versions of e-books, and then being shit out of luck if in the future I got a nook or something. Not sure if the format issue is still there or not, but the DRM is.
Once those two problems are solved and an e-book comes out with e-ink or something better then I'll pick one up.
Doesn't Kindle read pdf though? That was a big selling point for me.

The screen size, not so much. Paying triple the price to have a decent sized screen, no thanks.

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Tarm: All would be well and good if people only read ebooks on a device purely created for that and it didn't need to be replaced until it broke.
But that's in a perfect world. People read ebooks on all sort of devices and people also replace those devices all the time.
Can't speak for other people, but I can speak for me.

I get a lot of mileage out of my hardware and only replace it when I must.

My desktop is close to a decade old. My laptop is already 3 years old (main reason I got it is because I needed to be mobile). My MP3 player is almost 5 years old (bless Microsoft for making the Zune... very durable). My cell phone is an old piece of junk that is close to a decade old (but more importantly, it's functional).

Some people get off on hardware which I find strange (afterall, what really matters to the end user is the software), but to each his own.

I can't say I really approve and hopefully, this sort of attitude will be rectified in the future (especially once China, India & al. fully enter the hardware marketplace).

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Tarm: I wasn't only talking about ebooks either. More and more stuff get digitalised all the time. Music, various services, movies and other things. We're living in a digitalised revolution after all.
If you only saw how much space all that stuff takes in my home (hint: many, many shelves), there would be no doubt in your mind that the digital revolution is for the better.

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Tarm: Cutting down a tree and making books of it isn't as bad as damming a river to make a new power plant for example. The paper can be recycled and a new tree planted while the environment on the river is damaged for a very long time.
If only the trees grew fast enough to supply the demand. They don't.

Hydroelectric dams are better in the long term and also, non-electronic books use up more energy as you'll discover once peak oil hits us (and the costs of transportation skyrockets).
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SimonG: I think I killed a mid sized fortest with all the obsolete law collections I threw away over the years..
This is how I feel about technical books, they're huge, 98% of them are good for 2 years at most, often way less, it's an extreme waste to have a printed version of most. The printed version is even less convenient to use, because it's typically so bulky.
I do have a few ebooks and I read them on my phone. I got a non descript universal ereader app that read various formats and I use Calibre to strip out any DRM right when I get it. It is nice to be able to carry a collection of books in my front pocket. When I'm waiting at the doctors office, or riding the bus or standing in line at the DMV I can pass the time with some light (or not so light) reading. The only thing I'm missing is the ability to rent books, I have a hard time paying for an ebook that I don't even know if I'll like. If I could I would start my own Ebook library service. Think Hulu+Crackle+Netflix+GOG+Steam+Gamers Gate all thown into a blender and strained out into a nice lean Ebook service that lets you browse, read, check out or buy ebooks. I don't know about you but I'd use it.

(Man I could do a lot of things if I had some money)
Yeah I tried to make a thread about this earlier on (like 14 hours ago) but the forums kept borking for me.

Anyhoo, I made a video like the page suggested. :http://youtu.be/PyQP6kqekJU
DRM is baaaaaaaad.
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orcishgamer: The ebook world seems to be toying with the idea of ditching DRM as a way to break Amazon.com's stranglehold on the ebook world. This is one case where the publisher's and authors believe their interests actually lie in line with ours. Ironic that it took someone else beating them handily and bossing them around for awhile to realize it, but yeah...
But, they can already do that by using B&N, Kobo and the various other stores that use the industry standard epub format complete with DRM by Adobe.

Not that I'm complaining, DRM free is good. But it seems odd to me that what they're doing is going DRM free when they could just file an antitrust lawsuit against Amazon for only supporting a DRM form that's unique to their devices and making it work by way of the heft of their vertical integration. Amazon is already being investigated for it IIRC. And if not is quite close to a formal investigation.

B&N has already shown some balls by demanding to see the patents that Android allegedly infringes upon without paying for the privilege.
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Elmofongo: WARNING ME RANTING!:

This is why I read books on paper and cover litirally I cannot believe people bought ebooks for the sake of conviniance and because of that the Borders in the mall I go to closed down because of f#ckin DRM ridden ebooks that bought "BECAUSE IT'S CONVIENIANT. I DON'T WANNA GO TO A STORE AND WAIT IN LINE AND PUT BOOKS ON MY SHELF"

RANT OVER!

........I apolegize to anyone I offended, I just despise ebooks with a passion
I can relate. It is sad. That being said, I have nothing against digital books. You ever seen that movie The Ninth Gate? My living room looks like something similar atm...
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orcishgamer: The ebook world seems to be toying with the idea of ditching DRM as a way to break Amazon.com's stranglehold on the ebook world. This is one case where the publisher's and authors believe their interests actually lie in line with ours. Ironic that it took someone else beating them handily and bossing them around for awhile to realize it, but yeah...
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hedwards: But, they can already do that by using B&N, Kobo and the various other stores that use the industry standard epub format complete with DRM by Adobe.

Not that I'm complaining, DRM free is good. But it seems odd to me that what they're doing is going DRM free when they could just file an antitrust lawsuit against Amazon for only supporting a DRM form that's unique to their devices and making it work by way of the heft of their vertical integration. Amazon is already being investigated for it IIRC. And if not is quite close to a formal investigation.

B&N has already shown some balls by demanding to see the patents that Android allegedly infringes upon without paying for the privilege.
They don't win by handing B&N the same browbeating monopoly that Amazon.com currently has, they win by making sure there can be no monopoly.