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General discussion (archive)Compulsive min-maxing in RPG games(191 posts)(191 posts)
(191 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: I got into Phantasy star a while back. Though, Phantasy Star Universe kinda annoyed me
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orcishgamer: Let's just pretend PSU never happened, cool? Cool.
I agree. While we're at it. Can we pretend FF12 never happened too? Please!
Posted May 30, 2011
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orcishgamer: Let's just pretend PSU never happened, cool? Cool.
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Landeril: I agree. While we're at it. Can we pretend FF12 never happened too? Please!
The deal is stuck!
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FlintlockJazz: I'll admit that counting the ME games in with this is unfair however, despite your claim that it's an ARPG it's actual a RPG/Shooter according to the devs themselves and so isn't meant to be counted anyway, though the fact that you mixed that up with them just further proves that the genres need better definition to define them.
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Delixe: I use the full definition Action Role Playing Game when putting them together. It's a role playing game played in real-time action with real time decisions needed. The devs can say what they like about ME but in reality it's a ARPG because it has similarities to games in that genre like Jade Empire and to a lesser extent KOTOR. I remember when KOTOR was released lots of traditional CRPG fans talked about it as an ARPG in a derogatory way.

The only real RPG/Shooter in my eyes is Borderlands and I guess that deserves a new SRPG classification as a sub-genre of ARPG.
How is blasting an enemy at range with an assault weapon any different than killing them with a spell or arrow?
Post edited May 30, 2011 by orcishgamer
Posted May 30, 2011
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mystral: 1. It's not a role to me because your character being a fighter sayd next to nothing about who he is. Unless you think you can accurately predict what a lawyer's personality is just because he's a lawyer?
To me the plane choice comparison is valid, because like a class choice it'll affect your gameplay experience (what skills you have compared to others, how you'll behave in combat, etc...) but not anything else.

2. What does that have to do with anything?
I enjoy playing Diablo too, I never said I didn't. I just don't think it is an RPG or that it has any roleplaying elements.
As for the pnp combat stuff, I DO find rolling dice not all that interesting, but hack&slash combat is very different from pnp combat.

My second favourite genre after RPGs are strategy games like Civilization and I like them despite the fact that they don't have any story or roleplay elements either. I just don't expect every genre to play the same. If every game was the same, gaming would be pretty boring.

3. When did I say it was the truth? It IS my opinion, obviously, and I never said it was any better than anyone else's (though imo it's probably more though out than most people's but whatever).

@Landeril: even if my opinion was shared by most (and I'm not convinced it is) it doesn't make it any more valid. Most people once believed the Earth was flat, that didn't make it true.
1.No, I can't predict what it should be like...but then that's what roleplaying is all about...defining your own role for your chosen character. And as for the rest, well we'll just have to agree to disagree because imo you're very wrong.

2. And i've proven it has some roleplaying elements & the basis to form your own aspects for others and yet you act like it's nor an RPG because you think it isn't.

3. You TALK like it's fact and not opinion sometimes, is what I mean.
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: I agree. While we're at it. Can we pretend FF12 never happened too? Please!
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orcishgamer: The deal is stuck!
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Delixe: I use the full definition Action Role Playing Game when putting them together. It's a role playing game played in real-time action with real time decisions needed. The devs can say what they like about ME but in reality it's a ARPG because it has similarities to games in that genre like Jade Empire and to a lesser extent KOTOR. I remember when KOTOR was released lots of traditional CRPG fans talked about it as an ARPG in a derogatory way.

The only real RPG/Shooter in my eyes is Borderlands and I guess that deserves a new SRPG classification as a sub-genre of ARPG.
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orcishgamer: How is blasting an enemy at range with an assault weapon any different than killing them with a spell or arrow?
Good. Cuz that one kinda ruined FF for me. I had to go back and replay FF1 to even love the game anymore T^T
Posted May 30, 2011
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orcishgamer: How is blasting an enemy at range with an assault weapon any different than killing them with a spell or arrow?
That was my point. The combat system in ME is simply an evolution of the one used in KOTOR.
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: Good. Cuz that one kinda ruined FF for me. I had to go back and replay FF1 to even love the game anymore T^T
FF12 is awesome...:P
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: Good. Cuz that one kinda ruined FF for me. I had to go back and replay FF1 to even love the game anymore T^T
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GameRager: FF12 is awesome...:P
FF12 was among the worst ones I played. v.v I dislike the combat system.

Though it was better then FF10
Posted May 30, 2011
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orcishgamer: How is blasting an enemy at range with an assault weapon any different than killing them with a spell or arrow?
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Delixe: That was my point. The combat system in ME is simply an evolution of the one used in KOTOR.
Fair enough, I just wondered why you thought it deserved its own label, being so similar.
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: Though it was better then FF10
Funny thing is FFX was the only one I liked. Probably because it was the closest Square ever came to making a CRPG :p
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orcishgamer: Fair enough, I just wondered why you thought it deserved its own label, being so similar.
I think KOTOR and JE are ARPG's. Just as much as The Witcher and Mass Effect. I think people don't like to include them as ARPG's simply because it makes ARPG's look good. Usually when you are talking to RPG fans they deride ARPG's as shallow and you can't really say that about KOTOR or JE. JE was extremely action heavy.
Post edited May 30, 2011 by Delixe
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: Though it was better then FF10
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Delixe: Funny thing is FFX was the only one I liked. Probably because it was the closest Square ever came to making a CRPG :p
Lol. Still not one of my favorites. :P
Posted May 30, 2011
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GameRager: FF12 is awesome...:P
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Landeril: FF12 was among the worst ones I played. v.v I dislike the combat system.

Though it was better then FF10
Realtime combat not for you then? :P
Posted May 30, 2011
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GameRager: Realtime combat not for you then? :P
FFX was turn based, well action phase based which is essentially turn based. That's why I liked it.
Posted May 30, 2011
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Landeril: FF12 was among the worst ones I played. v.v I dislike the combat system.

Though it was better then FF10
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GameRager: Realtime combat not for you then? :P
I can handle Real Time Combat(I play Baldurs Gate TotSC often these days and have beaten Star Ocean 3) I just dislike the gambit system. Rather be able to tell them what to do by pausing it, instead of it being all moving. I've lost characters because I couldn't put a spell out because they hit them while I was finding the stupid White Mage. v.v

Plus. The AI gets a little stupid at times.
Post edited May 30, 2011 by Landeril
Posted May 30, 2011
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GameRager: Realtime combat not for you then? :P
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Landeril: I can handle Real Time Combat(I play Baldurs Gate TotSC often these days and have beaten Star Ocean 3) I just dislike the gambit system. Rather be able to tell them what to do by pausing it, instead of it being all moving. I've lost characters because I couldn't put a spell out because they hit them while I was finding the stupid White Mage. v.v

Plus. The AI gets a little stupid at times.
I handled it just fine...your skills must be lacking. :P
Posted May 30, 2011
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Delixe: I use the full definition Action Role Playing Game when putting them together. It's a role playing game played in real-time action with real time decisions needed. The devs can say what they like about ME but in reality it's a ARPG because it has similarities to games in that genre like Jade Empire and to a lesser extent KOTOR. I remember when KOTOR was released lots of traditional CRPG fans talked about it as an ARPG in a derogatory way.

The only real RPG/Shooter in my eyes is Borderlands and I guess that deserves a new SRPG classification as a sub-genre of ARPG.
In which case that is too broad a category. Some people would definte Mass Effect as a shooter with light RPG elements, especially the sequel, and it having choices shouldn't make any difference since Diablo doesn't have any choice and yet it still classifies as an arpg too right? And being real-time isn't a requirement either, since you can have turn-based arpgs too.

To be clear I'm not arguing that they are not RPGs, just that the RPG definition needs dividing up to be clear what type of game a particular, well, game is. As I said, you know exactly what you're gonna get with an FPS, with terms like 'story-based' or 'squad-based' being added when required to refer to specific extra features. This is what the RPG genre needs, so that people know what kind of experience they are looking at.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)Compulsive min-maxing in RPG games(191 posts)(191 posts)
(191 posts)