GameRager: When you make a multiplayer only mod then fine it should stay MP only but when you charge full price for it and call it a game IMO it should have some sort of SP aspect....heck even L4D has a better "sp" mode, complete with progressive map set and some storyline.
GameRager: As I told ovoon it's not true SP mode as you can pick random maps and classes and level up I think but that's it. L4D did it better imo, with various semi-linear level sets you could plow through which also had some bits of story in them as well in the character banter and such.

Navagon: That's the way it should be; single-player-focussed or multiplayer only. I'd rather time wasn't wasted on some tacked on SP or MP component that 99% of people won't be buying the game for.

GameRager: Games can have good SP and MP at the same time if pulled off right. And not everyone plays online you know. ;)

Navagon: I mostly stick to single player games. What I'm saying is that the best single player games I've played are ones dedicated to single player. Same with multiplayer. Tacked on SP or MP components just waste the developer's time that could have been spent tightening up what the game is really about.

GameRager: I didn't say they should be tacked on.......and if I recall correctly alot of older game had wonderful SP & MP compnents...like Doom(the original) and Duke3d.

Navagon: I remember making Doom maps with no problems back when I was 13 or so. Just fucking about with an editor. Could I make an id tech 5 map today? Er... no.

Things have moved on a bit since those simpler times. Games now require a hell of a lot more work. In the time it takes to create one id tech 5 map you could probably create five or six new Dooms using the old Doom engine. As in 5 or 6 whole games.

That's why they need to prioritise now.

GameRager: If it's that hard for them then I think they should priortize SP games. We have enough MP games already.

I still think they should be able to make a decent(not perfect but decent) SP/MP game if they put their minds to it and hired enough people.

Navagon: It's a matter of what sells. MP games typically don't last forever. Because people lose interest and move on to something new. When that starts to happen it happens en masse because there's no point in people sticking around playing a game with, at best, half empty servers. So there's always a market for new multiplayer games as people are always looking for something new.

As for the longevity of SP games, well, here we are on GOG.

klaymen: Many people prefer MP games and their voice has the same weight as yours. I'm not telling I am one of them, just saying. :)

/captain obvious

Tantrix: You do realize that it's the same Xmas update from last year? I didn't even need to reinstall KF since they just reused the same archivement from last year.

GameRager: Thing is SP/MP hybrid games could sell and keep people playing longer even than normal just by adding new dlc and such over time(some free and some paid) to keep interest peaked. At any rate the SP aspect will always attract new fans over the years who can get such older games to work.....and they can still sell after some time. As you just said GOG is proof of this.

Navagon: I'm not arguing against the longevity of SP games. Far from it. But unless the SP game has a stream of DLC produced for it then there's no real advantage for the publisher beyond creating a fan base for possible future titles. And you'd have to be damn sure about the success of your game to bank on that.

I know we both want more in the way of single player games. The only difference is that I see that from the publisher's perspective they're less viable. If they could make every game an MMO then they would.

GameRager: Just create new expansions for singleplayer based games and sell them at reasonable rates and the games could last longer and keep people playing the multiplayer longer and making them money. Just an idea. They could sell it like this: SP short expansion of missions (Like with the DN3D atomic edition extra episode) and when you buy those you get some MP maps for free as an incentive.

GameRager: Yes SP is mainly the same maps as well, but at least it has a story I can follow along with and goals I can meet at my own pace, minus the bloody morons who fill such servers.