Jaime: Completely serious this time, the Infinity Engine is still far and away the best engine for a a tactical RPG I've ever seen. I don't know how convenient it is for developers, creating the beautiful, hand-drawn backdrops might take a lot of time, for example, but for me as a player, the depth it offers, while still allowing for easy, complete control of the battlefield, is unparalleled. Dragon Age, the spiritual successor of Baldur's Gate, for instance, falls short in both regards.

Gersen: I agree with others that 20$ for the original fully patched game (I already have that on GoG version) with an extra adventure (but a "combat oriented one") and a bunch of new chars it asking a little too much.

Gersen: I don't know why but I was sure this was supposed to have improved/higher resolution graphics, but it's probably who read or understand incorrectly...

I agree with others that 20$ for the original fully patched game (I already have that on GoG version) with an extra adventure (but a "combat oriented one") and a bunch of new chars it asking a little too much.

If at least it was DRM-free I would have got it anyway to show my "support" but at is it now I will wait for it to be eventually released on GoG. (not to mention that the first one is not my favorite of the two)

rampancy: I don't think that it's any accident that there's a lot of tactical and strategic depth in the Infinity Engine games, since the engine itself was originally written and intended for RTS games.

Jaime: Completely serious this time, the Infinity Engine is still far and away the best engine for a a tactical RPG I've ever seen. I don't know how convenient it is for developers, creating the beautiful, hand-drawn backdrops might take a lot of time, for example, but for me as a player, the depth it offers, while still allowing for easy, complete control of the battlefield, is unparalleled. Dragon Age, the spiritual successor of Baldur's Gate, for instance, falls short in both regards.

And it's not just about the fights, either.

Random example:

There's a quest in BG1 that has you rob a museum of a valuable artifact. You're supposed to do this with the help of an NPC during nighttime, if I remember correctly, but it's actually possible to enter the building alone, during the day, when all the guards are around. These actually have a realistic line of sight, and maybe even can hear, which makes stealing the artifact difficult. The way I completed the quest was by casting a blindness spell on a few guards, which doesn't turn them hostile and allowed me to sneak to and steal the object in question. I'm sure there were many other fun ways to do the quest, all not directly envisioned by the developers.

My point is, I like a good challenge, I like depth, and I love it when games let me figure out stuff and tackle problems on my own, in unique ways. If someone, at some time, comes up with a RPG engine that's as complex and flexible as the Infinity Engine, then great, but at the moment there's simply nothing else like it.

orcishgamer: All of which could be done in a modern engine... All that stuff you're saying you like has little to do with the engine and more to do with the toolset on top of it. I'll eat my hat if you couldn't whip the same thing up in TorchED or TorchED2 (when it's out). If you wanted a retro look you'll need an engine with a retro look that you can achieve (you can probably do it in TorchED but it'd be a serious bitch worth of work).

Jaime: Yeah, like I said, if someone comes up with such a thing, great. I'd buy it in a heartbeat. But since everything I've played that came out after Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale has been so markedly inferior in terms of tactical depth, (and part of that, I would wager, is the strict turn-based structure working behind the scenes of the Infinity Engine), I'm not exactly holding my breath.

orcishgamer: Not that I've played it either, but I did pick it up during the sale as it appears turn based (with hexes!!!!!), but have you played Fray yet? I wonder if that's something you might be looking for.

Azarr: There's more than that.

ycl260779: I agree, I too think DA is better than BG. At least the first one, anyway.

cw8: No way, it's definitely not nostalgia or anything, while I like DAO and see it as a worthy spiritual successor and I've played BG2 5 times(D&D hardcore rules) over the years and DAO twice (hard and nightmare), there's no way Dragon Age is better than BG2 for almost all reasons: art, location, story, companions, villain (Jon Irenicus and Sarevok), gameplay, number of spells and abilites, variety of monsters, challenge, number of classes, replayability, combat difficulty etc.