Hmph. I don't suggest what I ain't willing to work on Mate. I already have the balances pretty much done. The rest would have to be done with Stoic in PM.

If you have permission from the character then yes. And yes, Milkman was the one with the 25. The 2 veteran wanderers each have a 10.
Yeah, summoning is a MIGHTY pain! I feel like the Summon Scurry skill for the Ranger is balanced, but I'm afraid to delve too much down that dark path... where I probably won't escape. lol
We can definitely discuss this.

I wasn't suggesting they wouldn't work or were bad, personally I think they are cool. I just though they are hard to balance. Well, Stoic has the final say anyways.

The Conjurer would be hard. But his pets wouldn't be much stronger then him or a Warrior Level 2 at most.

I agree with you, it's a huge concern. Imagine the nightmare of having an unbalanced Conjurer. We do have a conjuration already (Scurry) and the Shaman will not doubt get 1 or 2 but we have to be careful that it doesn't get out of control.

Aye.

Maybe each subclass should be able to evolve into one of the two another subclasses, creating another tree. Would be pretty hard to come up with the proper names for them, but would be very interesting. For example Ranger could evolve into Marksman or a Beast Master, or remain Ranger and be able to choose skills from both subclasses but with a penalty.

We've been talking about that

Fexen, you are spot on, that was exactly how I was seeing it. Also, that's exactly the two classes I had for the Ranger.

I don't really like the subclass weapon modifiers, and would prefer to get rid of them. Instead, I would like to have weapon proficiencies, depending on your class. (Obviously the Ranger will have better proficiency with bows and whatnot, Mage proficiencies probably won't be nearly as good as the Warrior's, etc.)

How does everyone feel about that?

So does that mean that only certain subclasses would have weapon modifiers or that each base class would get all of the modifiers?

No classes would have weapon modifiers.

Instead, you could invest points in weapon proficiency (which effectively will be weapon modifiers.)

The types of modifiers you could have would end up being class based. For example, a Mage could probably not gain sword proficiency (barring a Warrior/Mage dual class of some kind if that happens) and a Berserker probably wouldn't be able to gain proficiency with slings. Naturally, no Mage will ever be as good with a quarterstaff as a Berserker is with a sword or an axe, so proficiency points would have different values depending on what class you are.

For example, let's take Warrior and Mage.

Let's say Warrior can gain proficiency with axes. For each "use" invested, he might gain +3 damage and -5% opponent chance to block.

Whereas, a Mage might gain +2 damage for each "use" invested, and no block modifier. Just an example.

I would say ranged weapons would get less bonuses than other too, but not necessarily (have other changes in mind to deal with overpowered missiles)

That sounds pretty cool. I'm good with that.

Submitted for your approval: the potential grand finale of character class trees... which occurs at level 5. The final list will contain a whopping THIRTY NINE (39) character classes!

If you see a type of class that you feel is excluded and you would like to see in the game, let me know. Honestly, there's not too much further that I can go down this road without having everything spiral out of control. So at the end of the day, there may be some things you want that I will never be able to provide. But I hope that the final character specializations at level 5 will provide you with at least a healthy dose of customization that will keep things interesting.

Of course, there are always other ways that will be available as well - weapon selections/modifications/proficiencies, passive abilities, new spells/skills (while maintaining the same classes), spell/skill boosters at higher levels, combinations at higher levels and more.

This will all lead up to what, in my opinion, will be an amazing finale... the story is all written up in some ways, but the results, outcomes and possibilities will be HIGHLY influenced by you, the players. (of course we can still continue after that if we want.)

Anyway, here's my current thinking on the end of the character class tree:


Shaman

-> Elementalist (Focused on Elemental Magic)
-> Conjurer (Focused on Conjuration)
-> Mystic (Focused on Divination, small bits of both of the above)

Sage

-> Illusionist (Focused on Illusion)
-> Alchemist (Focused on Potion Making. Note: NOT just healing potions)
-> Enchanter (Focused on Enchantments)

Cleric

-> Necromancer (Curses, hexes and abominations)
-> Priest (Blessings, healing and removing disease)
-> Druid (Summons natural entities for various purposes)

Mage

-> Mage (All about versatility: access to a large, mixed group of new Mage spells)
-> Spellsword (Access to 2 max uses of ALL level 1 Warrior skills and IMMEDIATE access to 20 STAT points.)
-> Shadowmage (Access to 4 max uses of ALL level 1 Rogue skills.)
-> Wizard of the Wild (Gains only 1 new spell, entirely devoted to a familiar of his choice.)

Ranger

-> Beastmaster (Summoning-oriented Ranger)
-> Marskman (Missile-oriented Ranger)
-> Stalker (Melee-oriented Ranger)

Knight

-> White Knight (Access to a horse. Healing/blessing, leadership, shield skill.)
-> Black Knight (Access to a horse. Curses/poison, offensive skills.)
-> Red Knight (Access to a horse. Mixed offensive and defensive skills.)

Berserker

-> Barbarian of the North (Several skills devoted to a wolf companion.)
-> Barbarian of the South (Survivalist, resistances, combat skills)
-> Battlemaster (The most brutal fighter in Vue)

Warrior

-> Warrior (All about versatility: access to a large, mixed group of new Warrior skills)
-> Arcane Warrior (Access to 5 max uses of ALL level 1 Mage spells.)
-> Commando (Access to 4 max uses of ALL level 1 Rogue skills.)
-> Marine (Unique character, excels both at land and at sea, tactics, combat, stealth, improvisation and utility.)

Spy

-> Infiltrator (Focused on stealth)
-> Information Broker (Focused on tactics, attains knowledge useful both inside and outside of combat.)
-> Smuggler (Treasure. Treasure. Did someone say treasure? Someone's party is about to get rich.)

Assassin

-> Sniper (Missile-oriented)
-> Shadowrunner (Melee-oriented)
-> Saboteur (Tactical, support oriented)

Trickster

-> Arsonist (FIRE!)
-> Trapmaster (Powerful and interesting traps.)
-> Liecrafter (Deceptive capabilities. Misdirection.)

Rogue

-> Rogue (All about versatility: access to a large, mixed group of new Rogue skills)
-> Planeswalker (Access to 5 max uses of ALL level 1 Mage spells.)
-> Pirate (Treasure + technology + seafaring capabilities = win.)
-> Bard (On their face, Bard skills are not quite as useful as others. But wait! The Bard is a rogue, isn't he? Nothing is quite as it seems. This is an absurdly unique class that requires less skill point investment, allowing you to use those skill points in other places, while still providing tremendous amounts of utility. It is mostly a support-oriented class.)