I'm Christian. Some of you may have picked that up. I've been at least open about it.

Plenty of folks here are not Christian. Plenty are not believers of any stripe.

Please, friends, let's not ridicule each other. Or belittle each others' beliefs. Or generalize about all believers, all non-believers, etc.

I'm not asking everybody to agree. I don't agree with many of you, on many different subjects. I don't expect anybody to agree with me all the time. I don't even think I'm right all the time. I just don't know which things exactly I'm wrong about. ;)

I am asking for some tolerance and respect. This would include not blaming all religious for all problems in the world. Or blaming any one religion. Or assuming that you know and understand a person because of the religion they identify as.

Thanks.

Cheers.

Not so much about religion but i hope we can grow tolerance for eachother some more here.

I don't blame any one religion, I blame them all.

We don't give a damn about religious beliefs. Only about the political/social stances that they lead to. And one same religion can lead to absolutely any stance depending on the person. Even when they claim "the bible says this" or "god would want that", they always end up speaking of themselves, as their own interpretation of what "justice" and "love" would imply. People can be great or nasty, the fact that they do or don't formulate their ideas (and their rationale) in terms of "god's will" plays no role on that.

I say it again : Religion is a mere language. A grammar. We only care for what you say, not in which tongue you say it.

That would be the opposite of what I'm asking for.

Proud of you mate. GOG is far from immune regarding arguments over politics and religion, but posts like these can help create an atmosphere where bickering is kept to a minimum.

11 minutes in and a fight has broken out in the "Tolerance" thread.

Oh yeah, I have tons of hope for humanity. :P

I may be wrong also but basically what this thread amounts to is "please don't criticize religion" to which I would answer, "Why can't I?"

While it should be respected that you identify as Christian, other opinions than your own about religion deserve your respect as well ;)

I think humanity is as much a bunch of shits as you probably do. I'm certainly one.

But I have hope. For me and for everybody else, too.

And I don't think it's fighting to make a plea for tolerance. Or to insist on what tolerance is and what it isn't. Or to continue to plead for tolerance even if other people reiterate their intolerance, or say that it's hopeless.

I've thought about starting this thread for a while, and I'm prepared to continue it.

Cheers.

I had hoped we wouldn't need anyone to say this anymore at this point. Although, yeah, I guess it can't be said often enough.

An atheist would say "this is an assholery", a believer would say "this is a grave sin". The important thing is what they designate. When they agree on what is bad, the formulation they use has no importance.

In other words :

When an atheist is being nice, it is, unknowingly, "God who speaks through his heart" (or something). When a believer is being nice, it is, unknowingly, "his personal sensitivity and intellect being projected onto a god figure". These interpretations do not matter much. The important thing is being nice. You can always translate "what happens" in your own language.

When capital punishment, racism, homophobia, greed, or whatnot, is criticized by me or by a christian, we are basically saying the same things, for similar reasons - even if we interpret these reasons differently, and even if we present our arguments differently. It is not religion that determine the agreement, because religion is also used to justify the opposite stance. Religion is merely a way to represent and express things that an atheist (good or bad) would represent and express differently...

I have respect for people who aren't Christian. I have respect for people who think Christianity is untrue.

What I am asking for is a general tolerance for others. And tolerance does mean ceasing to blame religions, any one religion, atheism, humanism, whatever. Tolerance is important for civilized society.

So, yes, I am asking people to change what they are saying toward each other on this forum in the interest of tolerance and peace and civilization. I don't believe I am being disrespectful by doing so.