I know, I'm not religious. I was just thinking that, given the bible is often accused of suggesting the world is only 6K years old, Noah could well have been throwing a shrimp on the barbie before thinking "Strueth, looks like quite a wave. I'm gonna build me a board like the world has never seen". Later thinking "I know, surfing with animals! There's a movie in that".

Did they say which religion and which variant holy book of that religion they are sourcing it against?

On the plus side, another chance for the Aramaic dubbers to find work!

I wasn't thinking that deep. Honestly I was just trying to make a silly nonsensical comment and didn't expect anyone to call me on it. :P

I wasn't calling you on it. I just suggested that "Noah" was in fact "catching a wave". I think you take me too seriously.

i have so many things i could say here that have that have a 4%chance of starting educated dialog, 80% chance of starting a flame war and 16% chance to be ignored

This thread still going strong huh? I have to say that I am looking forward to the day that I don't see the word 'atheists' or 'agnostics' along the threads on the first page of the General Discussion, or the first 5 pages for that matter...

Lol, well actually by posting this I'm sending it right back to the top 8P

Hey god said to end it yesterday but no one paid it any attention.

Actually, I write God with upper case G despite being an atheist, agnostic or whatever group I belong to. Well I try to anyway. Mostly out of respect to christians than anything else.

That certainly is commendable and I suppose also how it ought to be. After all, the idea is to have a civilized discussion and that cannot occur without mutual respect, eg. google "Richard Dawkins father George Coyne interview"
This, however, is an internet forum :)

Please stop trying to turn tables on me. I'm actually agnostic remember? You are the one that asserts you have proved god must exist, and we are debating the truth of one of your premises.

I noticed you didn't actually say whether the paradox is logical or not. I would be interested in more detail why such a paradox can obviously exist, but a self-emergent universe is prima facie impossible to you. Please elaborate more?

PS: As far as I can see all you offered that was not tautological was this strawman: "The idea of a universe where anything and everything can and does pop into and out of existence uncaused has no relation whatsoever to the universe in which we live." Do you need me clarify why it's a strawman?

PS: I missed where you told me you believe one of your beliefs is false. Considering your verbosity and meandering replies I trust you'll understand - but if you point that out again specifically I'd appreciate it.

I do write god with a capital: Hendrix.

Hah! Brilliant!!

Me too in fact... Vangelis, cause why? A certain sci-fi film comes to mind...

Talk about coming full circle. Vangelis was the brainchild of Aphrodite's Child and "666" is one of the greatest records ever; even the super bizarre stuff. And here we are back to religion!

I take pride in being respectufl before I call everybody a cunt :-P