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General discussion (archive)A giveaway! with a twist(110 posts)(110 posts)
(110 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted February 23, 2012
There we go folks! Adambiser got it! (Although, not in a sentence structure lol, and probably the closest its ever gonna get.)

A solution to a problem is a necessity, But a solution is useless if it isn't functional.
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adambiser: Are we allowed to guess multiple times? If not, kindly ignore this

Door = solution, house = a problem, stairs = taking action based on the solution; thereby making the solution useful
Now, make your selection of a $5.99 game.
Post edited February 23, 2012 by Nroug7
Posted February 23, 2012
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Nroug7: A mixture of two substances if a solution, so if a door is a solution, what is the solution to and what needs to come after a solution?
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wpegg: Ok, you've got me interested now. Back to basics. If a door is a solution, and it is a mixture of two substances, it is an agreement. The solution is to the problem, that has not been stated. After the solution comes the implementation of the result.

This isn't the answer, but maybe someone can springboard from it.
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adambiser: Are we allowed to guess multiple times? If not, kindly ignore this

Door = solution, house = a problem, stairs = taking action based on the solution; thereby making the solution useful
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wpegg: I think our noble quizmaster is keen for someone to get that epiphany of knowledge and solve the puzzle (I always am in his position), so I think you're free to guess as much as you like.
Epiphany is for philosophers and people with too much free time. Good thing I count for one of those then. I'll give wpegg's topic a try. He said that the door wasn't literally a mixture of two chemicals, just that the door was a solution to something. If I'm going off your idea, the door would have to be opportunity, the solution to an unknown issue, which would be followed by stairs, which is progress, the end of the stairs would be the end result.


Edit: Crap, should have updated the page.
Post edited February 23, 2012 by QC
Posted February 23, 2012
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wpegg: Ok, you've got me interested now. Back to basics. If a door is a solution, and it is a mixture of two substances, it is an agreement. The solution is to the problem, that has not been stated. After the solution comes the implementation of the result.

This isn't the answer, but maybe someone can springboard from it.


I think our noble quizmaster is keen for someone to get that epiphany of knowledge and solve the puzzle (I always am in his position), so I think you're free to guess as much as you like.
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QC: Epiphany is for philosophers and people with too much free time. Good thing I count for one of those then. I'll give wpegg's topic a try. He said that the door wasn't literally a mixture of two chemicals, just that the door was a solution to something. If I'm going off your idea, the door would have to be opportunity, the solution to an unknown issue, which would be followed by stairs, which is progress, the end of the stairs would be the end result.


Edit: Crap, should have updated the page.
yeah sorry your a minute too late (should i say, about 7 minutes.)
Posted February 23, 2012
Congrats adambiser and thanks for the mind teaser Nroug7.
Posted February 23, 2012
I spent all that time trying to conceptualize wpegg's idea to something generic. Damn, now I have to go yell at strangers through the internet to make up for the lack of winning.
Posted February 23, 2012
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QC: I spent all that time trying to conceptualize wpegg's idea to something generic. Damn, now I have to go yell at strangers through the internet to make up for the lack of winning.
Don't worry, we will be doing this all again soon. And again after that.
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CowboyBebop: Congrats adambiser and thanks for the mind teaser Nroug7.
Same goes for you :D
Post edited February 23, 2012 by Nroug7
Posted February 23, 2012
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QC: I spent all that time trying to conceptualize wpegg's idea to something generic. Damn, now I have to go yell at strangers through the internet to make up for the lack of winning.
My idea was right! It was basically the answer, but in a wordy form (not bitter btw, I don't take the giveaways).
Posted February 23, 2012
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QC: I spent all that time trying to conceptualize wpegg's idea to something generic. Damn, now I have to go yell at strangers through the internet to make up for the lack of winning.
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wpegg: My idea was right! It was basically the answer, but in a wordy form (not bitter btw, I don't take the giveaways).
Yeah, but only progress is a two way road, you can progress forwards or backwards. its the only thing i kinda felt was off.
Posted February 23, 2012
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Nroug7: Yeah, but only progress is a two way road, you can progress forwards or backwards. its the only thing i kinda felt was off.
Fair enough, I seem to remember from other threads that you're new to coding. You'll learn that progress is a one way road, with a drunkard steering the ship desparately trying to avoid an iceberg. The idea of just changing direction is fantasy.

I liked the riddle, but it was very open ended, were you expecting someone to get it before your heavier clues?
Posted February 23, 2012
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Nroug7: Yeah, but only progress is a two way road, you can progress forwards or backwards. its the only thing i kinda felt was off.
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wpegg: Fair enough, I seem to remember from other threads that you're new to coding. You'll learn that progress is a one way road, with a drunkard steering the ship desparately trying to avoid an iceberg. The idea of just changing direction is fantasy.

I liked the riddle, but it was very open ended, were you expecting someone to get it before your heavier clues?
Implementation does not quite mean functionality either IMHO, though i guess its up in the air for discussion.

Progress moving backwards: See Star wars galaxies. Adding new content and changing stuff does not simply mean progress. (I think that particular drunken sailor had a loss of direction)

And leaving the riddle open was a very deliberate act, In saying that however, i was surprised at how close some of the first answers came.
Post edited February 23, 2012 by Nroug7
Posted February 23, 2012
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Nroug7: There we go folks! Adambiser got it! (Although, not in a sentence structure lol, and probably the closest its ever gonna get.)
Wow, thanks! That was tough, there is no way I would have guessed that without your hints. If your other riddles are more difficult, just wow....

I will choose a game soon. Thanks again, Nroug7.
Posted February 24, 2012
To be honest, I found the contest more frustrating than fun in the end, and the intended "solution" rather underwhelming. Why are solutions "vital"? Why are solutions "pointless" if not applied (there are many other factors involved)? Personally, I think that GoJays' explanation in post #4, or DavidNielsen's in post #17, are actually both a better fit to the "riddle" than the one that was apparently intended.

Also, it's a bit frustrating to be led on garden paths for days - the first "hints" obfuscated the solution rather than making it easier to guess, so in the end the contest was about being online (and still interested) when the final hint was dropped.

Anyway. Congrats to the winner, and thanks to the host for giving away free games. That's independent from (and more important than) the two paragraphs above. :) I'm just trying to explain why I feel a bit like having been taken for a ride. (I also may be a bit grumpy right now, I just got woken up by a police squad raiding my neighbor's apartment, and they weren't particularly subtle ...).
Post edited February 24, 2012 by Psyringe
Posted February 24, 2012
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Psyringe: Why are solutions "vital"? Why are solutions "pointless" if not applied (there are many other factors involved)?
This, indeed. Solution could be needed or used but it can not be vital nor especially pointless. I do not quite understand this way of thinking. Solution is not always vital, because some problems can be bypassed "right away" so no solution is needed then. Solution never can be pointless - solution can be not used, but every solution has some point. Also some solutions are so simple that it is enough to "open door" - no need for the "stairs" to follow.
Anyway, gz to the winner.
Post edited February 24, 2012 by Lexor
Posted February 24, 2012
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Psyringe: Why are solutions "vital"? Why are solutions "pointless" if not applied (there are many other factors involved)?
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Lexor: This, indeed. Solution could be needed or used but it can not be vital nor especially pointless. I do not quite understand this way of thinking. Solution is not always vital, because some problems can be bypassed "right away" so no solution is needed then. Solution never can be pointless - solution can be not used, but every solution has some point. Also some solutions are so simple that it is enough to "open door" - no need for the "stairs" to follow.
Anyway, gz to the winner.
I could not imagine opening my front door and falling flat on my face to the ground.

Also, a solution as an open door without stairs is not a solution at all. That's like saying "It's okay for developers to give us a DRM Riddled game and not finish the product."

As to how vital a solution is, that is probably disputable, but for all intents and purposes, leaving a problem as it is does not benefit anyone... perhaps i should of put "For success" or something like that in there, which is a mistake on my end.
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Psyringe: To be honest, I found the contest more frustrating than fun in the end, and the intended "solution" rather underwhelming. Why are solutions "vital"? Why are solutions "pointless" if not applied (there are many other factors involved)? Personally, I think that GoJays' explanation in post #4, or DavidNielsen's in post #17, are actually both a better fit to the "riddle" than the one that was apparently intended.

Also, it's a bit frustrating to be led on garden paths for days - the first "hints" obfuscated the solution rather than making it easier to guess, so in the end the contest was about being online (and still interested) when the final hint was dropped.

Anyway. Congrats to the winner, and thanks to the host for giving away free games. That's independent from (and more important than) the two paragraphs above. :) I'm just trying to explain why I feel a bit like having been taken for a ride. (I also may be a bit grumpy right now, I just got woken up by a police squad raiding my neighbor's apartment, and they weren't particularly subtle ...).
I am also certainly most sorry about the online aspect, however, i wanted to get a move on so i could create a new thread for people to try to figure out.
Post edited February 24, 2012 by Nroug7
Posted February 24, 2012
Now, first of all, thanks for creating the puzzle and congratulations to the winner.
Normally I would bow out with this phrase but seeing the comments of the author of this thread I would like to give some feedback that might help him with the future puzzles.
1. Analogy. Your puzzle was basically a "solve this by analogy" type of thing. This means that basing on the way you paraphrased something others should guess what you had in mind. While it is an interesting concept and you worked well on it, there are certainly some things missing.
The answer was: A solution to a problem is a necessity, But a solution is useless if it isn't functional.
The paraphrase was: A door to a house is vital, however, if one does not build stairs then the door is pointless. In order for the door to be useful, stairs must follow.
While it is a nice way of re-saying the clue it is not 100% accurate. First of all, when reading the paraphrase one would certainly concern "house" as something that integrates ("includes") the two other thing - "stairs" and "door" (it is not obvious at all the stairs were supposed to be outside not inside - not a single person itt except the author understood that).
Now as you all know the problem does NOT include the solution, because if it would than there would be no problems with that problem. :P And surely the problem itself does not care whether it has a solution or not. It is necessary for those WHO solve to solve the problem.
I read the paraphrase as "there is a whole, which includes two consecutive things, each of which is included into it". Thus I no way could decipher the message based on the paraphrase.
Again obviously the word "functional" is not consecutive to the "solution" - "taking actions based on the solution" is, however.
The way I would re-do this puzzle off the top of my head would be this:
Solution: It is vitally important to solve the problem. But solving a problem is useless unless actions are taken based on that solution.
Paraphrase: Finding a key to the chest is utterly important. But the key is useless if one doesn't use it for unlocking.
I know this is VERY obvious, but I just give it as an example of how such thing could be done.
What we had, however, was both very general and not very accurate thus leaving people roam in all possible directions ( I was not the one, who posted about sex, but I 100% agree with that person).

All the abovementioned, however, would be a non-isse if there would be good CLUES.

2. Clues. Now, I definitely have to say the clues were not helpful in any way to the contestors.
"Someone was on the right track" - yeah there were 20 people, each going in different direction and so any one could be right. Does nothing.
Mixture of two substances - who said it is one word? Milk+coffee - two substances and they mix. Again not really something you could start your logical thinking from.
Those were the only two clues that I saw before the final derby started (I was asleep at that moment so I didn't even see it). There were other posts by the author, but I personally didn't see clues in those.
Now, what I would suggest instead would be giving clues concerning general puzzle meaning instead of separate words.
E.g. - this puzzle is NOT about physical particular objects (this still leaves a WIDE field for guessing, but at least no one would have ot repeat "teeth-stomach" combination 3 times).

If you have doubts about it here are some possible guesses (non-particular physical objects):
Requirements to desing are essential, they are useless, however, unless serve as basis for a design concept.
Terms for a theory are essential, they are useless, however, unless they are used to formulate logical implications used in turn to describe something.
....
I could do this all day.

Anyway, thanks again for being so generous and entertaining people on the GOG forum, and I hope what I wrote doesn't sound rude - I didn't mean it that way. Hopefully, it would also help everyone in the future!
Cheers!
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)A giveaway! with a twist(110 posts)(110 posts)
(110 posts)