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Weclock: I personally would think that there would be quite a few games (ScummVM games included) that could work well on a console. Perhaps not titles like say Jagged Alliance, Dark Star One, or Freespace, but I would think any game that works with Dosbox or ScummVm should run fine on a console.
Why is this do you ask?
Because many run fine on PSP.
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Wishbone: So what you need to do is to go to the DOSBox and ScummVM forums and ask them to do PS3 ports of their software. They're the ones who can make it work. GOG certainly can't.

They can't. Console publishing requires well, a publisher. Free software is not something that is desired or even expected in this environment. They can make the software work (and indeed, they already did), but they can't deliver it.
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Weclock: You seem fairly opposed to this issue Wishbone, I don't really understand why.

I am. Aside from the technical difficulties which, IMHO makes the whole issue a moot point. But I have my own stake in this, and I won't pretend otherwise.
Consoles have been outfitted with more and more functions that previously, only PCs had. Modern consoles are online, they have multiplayer capability, etc. It seems that what the console people really want, is a dumbed-down single-hardware-and-software-platform PC.
Meanwhile, the PC gaming world is plagued by more and more developers going over to developing for consoles exclusively, while others develop for both consoles and PCs. This usually results in the PC version of a game being a shitty console port, which makes playing the game on a PC feel like trying to fight a war with two broken legs and a missing arm, while the menus makes you want to move your chair 3 meters away from the screen because everything is gigantic.
I know, I'm ranting again...
I fear the console-only world of gaming. No more RTSs, no more old-school adventure games, no more fast-paced FPSs, no more games that challenge your mind, your aim or your reflexes. Just an endless line of pointless and childish Mario games, shooters with auto-aiming, Guitar Hero X and Japanese pseudo-RPGs where all the characters look like futuristic northern Europeans on drugs, who frequent equally drugged-out fabulous hairdressers.
I have issues, you can tell ;-)
But back on topic. I don't think making old PC games run on consoles would bring about the aforementioned Console Apocalypse. I do however, think it is impractical, to the point of being completely unfeasible. At least on the PS3, due to the hardware architecture. I don't know anything about the architecture of the Wii, but the XBox360 is, AFAIK, very close to standard PC architecture, so it might be possible to work out something there.
I still don't think it'll ever happen. It would take a huge investment, with very little guarantee of ever getting it back.
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Weclock: I'm not particularly interested, all the older games that I really want to play on console (Doom, Duke Nukem 3d, and others) are already on console. :3
I'm just supporting his argument that it's possible. which, it most certainly is. Is it possible for it to be GOG.com offered? maybe if GOG.com could work out some sort of deal, but the prices would be more expensive I would think on console then they would on PC. Suddenly you've got microsoft dipping in, the original ip creators, possibly the emulator or virtualization software creators, and then your own piece of the pie.. that would lead to a high price imo.
I don't think it's worth it, if the game is good enough it will come on it's own to the console, thanks to the publisher/developer.

That's why I talked about all that licensing stuff in my initial post :) It wouldn't be worth it, if the overhead was too big, but I think using opensource software (like they already do on windows), the only additional party would be the platform provider (Sony/Microsoft), which should keep the overhead relatively low.
About the games being already available... yes, many are. But they're hard to find, in fact so hard that few people are aware that they still exist. Availability on the PlayStation Store or the corresponding XBox thingy would greatly improve visibility and would definitely generate additional sales.
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Wishbone: So what you need to do is to go to the DOSBox and ScummVM forums and ask them to do PS3 ports of their software. They're the ones who can make it work. GOG certainly can't.
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hansschmucker: They can't. Console publishing requires well, a publisher. Free software is not something that is desired or even expected in this environment. They can make the software work (and indeed, they already did), but they can't deliver it.

You misunderstand me. You have some way of getting software onto your PS3, yes? Or is the only access to the PS3 file system via the aforementioned online stores?
Well, ScummVM, for instance, is ported to the PS2, so it might be feasible to have it ported to the PS3 as well. I figure that the way to go about installing a ScummVM game on a PS3 would be this:
1. Download the PS3 port of ScummVM to your PC.
2. Download the ScummVM game you want to put on your PS3 (for example, Beneath A Steel Sky from GOG).
3. Install the game on your PC.
4. Copy the game files, and the ScummVM PS3 installer to a USB stick.
5. Plug the stick into your PS3 and copy/install onto your PS3 from there.
The PS3 has USB ports, and some newer models have memory card readers, so it should be possible.
This model is feasible, and much more likely than a commercial venture targeted specifically for the PS3.
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Weclock: You seem fairly opposed to this issue Wishbone, I don't really understand why.
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Wishbone: I am. Aside from the technical difficulties which, IMHO makes the whole issue a moot point. But I have my own stake in this, and I won't pretend otherwise.

The technical issues as far as DOS games are concerned are close to none. The PS3 is a different beast from a typical PC and it's true that the majority of its power, which lies in the GPU and the parallel floating point SPEs cannot be used very well for emulation. But even if you strip all that you end up with a normal 3Ghz PC, which is plenty for these purpose.
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Wishbone: Consoles have been outfitted with more and more functions that previously, only PCs had. Modern consoles are online, they have multiplayer capability, etc. It seems that what the console people really want, is a dumbed-down single-hardware-and-software-platform PC.

Exactly, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. Let's face it. Windows is proving every day that if you throw too many functions into one device, you end up with utter chaos. Heck, I'm a programmer and even I don't have the faintest idea how to get my Windows installation to work like I want. My graphics driver doesn't want to control my fan, my USB driver sometimes feels like harddrives are only worthy of USB 1.1 and my keyboard driver apparently thinks that the Function key was only put there as decoration. My GPU for some reason doesn't know that it can decode h.264 in hardware and the software decoder fails because another fan doesn't know that my CPU is getting hot. All of these are software issues (as verified across different OS), but neither me nor anybody else can pinpoint the root. The Windows/Linux experience is terrible and I avoid it like the plague for anything but work.
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Wishbone: Meanwhile, the PC gaming world is plagued by more and more developers going over to developing for consoles exclusively, while others develop for both consoles and PCs. This usually results in the PC version of a game being a shitty console port, which makes playing the game on a PC feel like trying to fight a war with two broken legs and a missing arm, while the menus makes you want to move your chair 3 meters away from the screen because everything is gigantic.
I know, I'm ranting again...
I fear the console-only world of gaming. No more RTSs, no more old-school adventure games, no more fast-paced FPSs, no more games that challenge your mind, your aim or your reflexes. Just an endless line of pointless and childish Mario games, shooters with auto-aiming, Guitar Hero X and Japanese pseudo-RPGs where all the characters look like futuristic northern Europeans on drugs, who frequent equally drugged-out fabulous hairdressers.
I have issues, you can tell ;-)

I'm pretty sure the current situation is temporary. Right now, developers are afraid to touch anything but "proven" console franchise, because of the apparently low sales of Xbox and PS3. The Wii has brought a bit of chaos and uncertainty, and it takes time for the developers to realize that the Wii doesn't really steel a lot of previous console gamers, but it more of an entry system for new gamers.
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Wishbone: But back on topic. I don't think making old PC games run on consoles would bring about the aforementioned Console Apocalypse. I do however, think it is impractical, to the point of being completely unfeasible. At least on the PS3, due to the hardware architecture. I don't know anything about the architecture of the Wii, but the XBox360 is, AFAIK, very close to standard PC architecture, so it might be possible to work out something there.
I still don't think it'll ever happen. It would take a huge investment, with very little guarantee of ever getting it back.

<-- See first part
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Wishbone: I am. Aside from the technical difficulties which, IMHO makes the whole issue a moot point. But I have my own stake in this, and I won't pretend otherwise.

but there aren't that many difficulties for scummvm or older PC games that have to run through virtualization or emulation on current PCs anyway.
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Wishbone: Consoles have been outfitted with more and more functions that previously, only PCs had. Modern consoles are online, they have multiplayer capability, etc. It seems that what the console people really want, is a dumbed-down single-hardware-and-software-platform PC.

I can't say this is really true, because the two most "hardcore" competitors in the console market, market beyond just games, online, and multiplayer, they also market blu-ray, streaming video content, and other movie issues.. as well as synchonization with computers to stream movies/video and audio/music to the console. In my opinion consoles are becoming more of a home entertainment system than just a video game playing machine.. even with online functionality and multiplayer..
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Wishbone: Meanwhile, the PC gaming world is plagued by more and more developers going over to developing for consoles exclusively, while others develop for both consoles and PCs. This usually results in the PC version of a game being a shitty console port, which makes playing the game on a PC feel like trying to fight a war with two broken legs and a missing arm, while the menus makes you want to move your chair 3 meters away from the screen because everything is gigantic.

yeah, I've played some bad console ports. some games on here.. like Second Sight.. while it's a great game, the user interface suffers because it was designed for a console.
but at the same time. However, as PC has lost some great developers to the consoles, there still are an endless supply of developers for PC. As literally anyone can make a game for the PC without any sort of licensing needed, other than maybe for 3d modelling programs and actual programming engines are needed.. indie titles are in a surplus. There are many rather great indie titles as well, for example, Cave Story, which is free to play and download. Then there are others like iFluid, which I haven't played so I don't really know how great it is, but it looks freakin' awesome. So I think that PC developers are really a renewable source.
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Wishbone: I fear the console-only world of gaming. No more RTSs, no more old-school adventure games, no more fast-paced FPSs, no more games that challenge your mind, your aim or your reflexes. Just an endless line of pointless and childish Mario games, shooters with auto-aiming, Guitar Hero X and Japanese pseudo-RPGs where all the characters look like futuristic northern Europeans on drugs, who frequent equally drugged-out fabulous hairdressers.

I believe these fears are unfounded, for reasons given above. There is an endless supply of developers for the PC. Whether that comes about as a mod, or as a standalone title, we will never see a console-only world. PC gaming is like Rock and Roll, it'll never die.
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Wishbone: But back on topic. I don't think making old PC games run on consoles would bring about the aforementioned Console Apocalypse. I do however, think it is impractical, to the point of being completely unfeasible. At least on the PS3, due to the hardware architecture. I don't know anything about the architecture of the Wii, but the XBox360 is, AFAIK, very close to standard PC architecture, so it might be possible to work out something there.

The Xbox 360 actually uses a PPC processor, shocking, I know. But anyway, if the PS3 processor technology is anything like the PSP, it's possible for development on PS3 as well.
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Wishbone: I still don't think it'll ever happen. It would take a huge investment, with very little guarantee of ever getting it back.

Perhaps this is true, but the sales figures for games that have been ported to the Xbox Live Arcade might be a promise of getting such an investment back. Duke Nukem 3D has been doing rather well, as well as Doom and alien hominid.. http://news.vgchartz.com/news.php?id=2533]sales figures for 10/11/08-11/15/08
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so I think not only is there a market, but I don't believe this will threaten PC gaming as long as it's limited to older titles.
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hansschmucker: They can't. Console publishing requires well, a publisher. Free software is not something that is desired or even expected in this environment. They can make the software work (and indeed, they already did), but they can't deliver it.
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Wishbone: You misunderstand me. You have some way of getting software onto your PS3, yes? Or is the only access to the PS3 file system via the aforementioned online stores?
Well, ScummVM, for instance, is ported to the PS2, so it might be feasible to have it ported to the PS3 as well. I figure that the way to go about installing a ScummVM game on a PS3 would be this:
1. Download the PS3 port of ScummVM to your PC.
2. Download the ScummVM game you want to put on your PS3 (for example, Beneath A Steel Sky from GOG).
3. Install the game on your PC.
4. Copy the game files, and the ScummVM PS3 installer to a USB stick.
5. Plug the stick into your PS3 and copy/install onto your PS3 from there.
The PS3 has USB ports, and some newer models have memory card readers, so it should be possible.
This model is feasible, and much more likely than a commercial venture targeted specifically for the PS3.

Thinking... thinking.... I honestly can't remember if I compiled ScummVM... I know I compiled ZSNES and a couple of other programs/games, but I'm not sure I tried ScummVM. Anyway, it's definately been done, it's just a major pain to do it. And isn't GoG all about comfort?
The process is a bit differnet:
1. Download Linux to USB
2. Install Linux from USB to HDD
3. Download ScummVM sources.
4. Download dependencies.
5. Compile
6. Copy data files to USB
7. Copy data files to PS3
6. Run.
i stopped reading halfway through these posts because it seems like a lot of people are getting close to flaming, i'm just going to put my opinion and be done with it. i don't think that gog would ever get in an agreement with microsoft or sony because in order to do that they would probably have to sell themselves to that company, they are only in beta after all.
anyway, as for computer games on your console, i don't think that is such a bad idea. as writing in the original post sure there isn't as much freedom and also a lot of computer games require a mouse or keyboard to be played but i don't think that would be such a big deal. They are already releasing keyboards that are compatible with the consoles, would it be that much harder to release a mouse as well, the wii wouldn't be as big of a deal because of the motion sensor click formula but a mouse would still be a nice alternative.
back on topic, if old computer games ever did get released on the consoles, it would probably be straight through microsofts xbox live, sony's playstation network, or wii's virtual console and the only way you could transport those rights over to your console is if gog made an agreement with those companies which like i said before probably won't happen until gog is a little bit bigger, a.k.a. out of beta or they are bought up by one of the companies, leaving the other two consoles to suffer and possibly cutting us off on the computer end as well.
sorry this was such a long post.
I like long posts :)
Anway, a few small corrections:
1. Publishing to consoles has become a whole lot simpler than it used to be. You don't have to be a part of Sony or Microsoft, you just have to order a developer kit (which is already available to GoG, because of the witcher) and a portion of your sale goes to the platform provider. Of course, your bound by their terms of service, but as smaller companies are entering the console market, these terms have become a lot more liberal.
2. You don't need a special mouse or keyboard for any console. Just plug in your plain old USB keyboard/mouse and it'll work.
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hansschmucker: I like long posts :)
Anway, a few small corrections:
1. Publishing to consoles has become a whole lot simpler than it used to be. You don't have to be a part of Sony or Microsoft, you just have to order a developer kit (which is already available to GoG, because of the witcher) and a portion of your sale goes to the platform provider. Of course, your bound by their terms of service, but as smaller companies are entering the console market, these terms have become a lot more liberal.
2. You don't need a special mouse or keyboard for any console. Just plug in your plain old USB keyboard/mouse and it'll work.

ahh yes in my ramblings i forgot some things, thank you kindly my good man/woman.
edit: i use both because you can never be to sure.
Post edited December 29, 2008 by AlternateTrigger
No problem :)
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hansschmucker: 3. Download ScummVM sources.
4. Download dependencies.
5. Compile

I somehow don't think that porting ScummVM to the PS3 is as easy as loading up the sourcecode of the Linux port, and pressing a big red button labelled "Compile for PS3". Okay, you're talking about the PS3 Linux version, but apparently, that has its own problems, doesn't it?
But hey, if it works, then yes, that's exactly what I had in mind. And of course, this whole process is only necessary the first time. For each subsequent ScummVM game, all you need to do is copy the files to your PS3, and Bob's your uncle.
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hansschmucker: 6. Copy data files to USB
7. Copy data files to PS3
6. Run.

Now you're counting backwards ;-)
Lol, yeah, I inserted two points.
Actually, you pretty much just press the big red button. As the PS3 is based on the PPC platform, you really just have to compile (./configure && make) and that's it. It won't be as fast as it could be if it was specifically optimized for the Cell processor, but it'll work.
The problem with Linux on the PS3 is that it's not integrated with the rest of the system. You need to repartition (which involves deleting all your data) and boot into it (which isn't as easy as it sounds, because there's no way to actually boot back into the main GameOS without jumping through a few hoops). Then there are the controls and so on. It's really no alternative to an integrated version running inside the GameOS.
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hansschmucker: It's really no alternative to an integrated version running inside the GameOS.

And good luck to you compiling ScummVM for that. Oh, I'm sure it's possible. In fact, given the ridiculous number of platforms supported already, someone is probably already working on it. You might go to the ScummVM forums and inquire.
Grrr... read my previous post. Grrr..