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1. An RPG where the enemies scale to your level.

or

2. An RPG that lacks a leveling system.

?
These are not the only two alternatives. I prefer a system that

levels most enemies within an upper and lower bound relative to the pc's level.
phases types of enemies in and out of the game at appropriate levels. E.g. no more rats after level 5
also has some fixed-level enemies here and there.

I also enjoyed the mechanic from Fallout 3 where an enemy/area was locked once you had encountered it. So, if you were level 3 and stumbled into a level 6 building of baddies, they would remain level 6, even after you ran away and returned having risen to level 12.

But I do prefer some system of leveling over a completely staticly leveled world.
Post edited December 26, 2015 by misteryo
Given only the choice between the two I'd prefer scaling enemies. Although I suppose in practical terms it probably does amount to the same thing I like the feeling of achievement gained from leveling up. Without levels and character growth I think you lose a lot of what makes an RPG (though I'm sure that statement will start an argument on what is or isn't an RPG)
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misteryo: These are not the only two alternatives. I prefer a system that

levels most enemies within an upper and lower bound relative to the pc's level.
phases types of enemies in and out of the game at appropriate levels. E.g. no more rats after level 5
also has some fixed-level enemies here and there.

I also enjoyed the mechanic from Fallout 3 where an enemy/area was locked once you had encountered it. So, if you were level 3 and stumbled into a level 6 building of baddies, they would remain level 6, even after you ran away and returned having risen to level 12.

But I do prefer some system of leveling over a completely staticly leveled world.
I'll just add my vote for this. I've got nothing else to add.
Personally, I avoid both of those. Character progress is vital part of CRPGs. Without it game turns into some kind of Adventure or Action.
Depends on the leveling system.
There is not much difference between the two, if the enemies scale, you might as well not level.
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tinyE: Depends on the leveling system.
Agree.

Guild Wars 2 (despite its faults) was a good example of how, even though enemies scale up (or rather, the character scales down to the zone) some of the perks of leveling can still be maintained - wider toolkit, better gear, certain buffs, etc.

You could have enemies scale up in health/dmg but still not "fully scale" equal to the challenge of what an actual mob of X level would present.

I think the chief reason why scaling was frustrating in Oblivion is that the level system itself was poorly designed.
Post edited December 26, 2015 by bler144
On of the alternatives, defintely 2.
Level scaling taken to the extreme can make leveling up your own characters meaningless, or even undesireable.

You can have good systems without having levels, especially in games that use skills-increase-by-use systems.

In any case area scaling is a much better option than level scaling, especially in open games, making exploration more interesting.
indeed, Guild Wars 2 does a good job on that. challenge yet you still benefit from your progression

i don't like "every" enemy scaling everywhere and "very tight" to player.

i rather like what was in neverwinter nights (1st) for example, and sacred 2. Means most enemy or encounter have a set scaling range but it is not always keeping up tight with the player if it seriously outlevel the area/encounter/enemies. They will be at their best, their highest. so will your character, yet "their" best may still be not enough for your best (as much as their lowest may still be too much for your early current self)

also i'm currently undusting kingdom of amalur for a replay. interesting system: overall areas have fixed level encounters and fauna for exploring and sidequesting, yet major quests (factions, main story) do scale to you
An RPG with fixed level enemies, one of them are easy to kill at low levels and others are near-impossible even on the higher level. Also a great map and exploration, such as some sandboxes. With dangerous zones full of high level enemies that you need to avoid until you level up enough. ^_^
Given the choices, I'd go with static enemy levels, as often within games where the enemies level scales to yours, there will sooner or later be a point where leveling up will inevitably become undesirable / no longer benefits the player.

Even more so in RPGs that allow you to play as a non-combat focused character.

And let's be honest, who doesn't like to once in a while roflstomp lvl5 mobs with a lvl 50 Character. (Yes, I'm a horrible person... )
Post edited December 26, 2015 by Habanerose
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Habanerose: Given the choices, I'd go with static enemy levels, as often within games where the enemies level scales to yours, there will sooner or later be a point where leveling up will inevitably become undesirable / no longer benefits the player.

Even more so in RPGs that allow you to play as a non-combat focused character.

And let's be honest, who doesn't like to once in a while roflstomp lvl5 mobs with a lvl 50 Character. (Yes, I'm a horrible person... )
In most modern games with scaling difficulty (and skill trees) you generally ROFLSTOMP guys near the end anyway because you have a zillion skills versus early on where you're unarmed and killing rats in someone's cellar
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dtgreene: 1. An RPG where the enemies scale to your level.

or

2. An RPG that lacks a leveling system.

?
I think I would go with Option 2. Then again it might depend on the type of game we're talking about. For example with Diablo 2, where you have the skill trees. If you're saving points for many levels waiting to unlock a specific skill or to avoid placing points in certain skills, you will go some time before you really unlock your power.
Of those two choices, #2 far over #1.
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bler144: Guild Wars 2 (despite its faults) was a good example of how...
Sorry, I have to say GW2 is only a good example of how not to do a game. Especially one coming off the heels of GW1, a game that was superior in every meaningful way than its so-called successor.
Post edited December 26, 2015 by mqstout