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itchy01ca01: "Why no screaming from the balconies when a baby is murdered by a crazy mother, no cries of outrage or need for education when teenagers kill a neighbours pet, no shouting against the pot? "

But.. there are people who cry and scream over such stuff. They are just as important as any other person. Unfortunately, you can't fix the mental health of everyone, all at once. There is a stigma toward transgendered people in our society. That and that alone can be fixed, with education and simple tolerance of another persons opinion. Yes, that's right. Someone MIGHT be different from you. But, OH NO! YOU SAID EVERYONE IS THE SAME IN YOUR NEW WORLD ORDER! OH NO!!!!!!!!!
We're talking about making SURE people are ALLOWED to be different, not forced to be the same. So, who's the right one here? The corporate head-speak that wants you to all think the same, or the transgender people who are quite different from what most of us are used to?
Oh? Wait the NWO is right in this case? Well then!
:)
Who wants a cookie and milk whilst we sit down and talk- sit down and message each other. I know I do.

You are right people do cry out about the deaths of others on the whole, but they rarely call for a societal change whilst doing so.
You say we cannot fix the mental health of people all at once, that we should allow people to be different. If that is the case, why can people not choose to not like gays, bis, trans. If it is in their head this is wrong, why not let them just think wrong. After all you claim we need "simple tolerance of another persons opinion" that is their opinion.
Why say people should be allowed to be different, before saying that some people should be educated because of their particular difference are not acceptable to you. You claim the NWO education is the wrong way to go, but you want to educate people to think your way.

Finally people are the same. There are minor variations across the board in all directions, but I think I can tell a person from a door because of they fill a rather standard framework.

Well I have finished my cookie and milk, so I am off to do other things. I look forward hearing your opinion. Also the NWO at the beginning, it was a joke.


Oh! PS- The stigma you speak of goes both ways. Not all people like others, and again this is all over the board in all variations = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyF5b0IvvU0
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dtgreene:
It's sad and all, but do we really need to bring stuff like that on here?
As you said yourself, it's non-game related. And this is a forums for games.
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dtgreene: ...
Let me put a fresh perspective on this issue:

I am a software developper, and I take issue with transgendered people, because when I store people's gender, I can no longer make it an immutable boolean value.

How dare they complicate my life like that!

Scr*w all that religious crap, what about simplicity in software design? I'm surprised that argument doesn't crop up more often really :P.
Post edited August 14, 2015 by Magnitus
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Magnitus: I am a software developper, and I take issue with transgendered people, because when I store people's gender, I can no longer make it an immutable boolean value.
Doesn't seem like a transgender issue to me.
Boolean data types should have more than two values.
Plenty of premises are kinda true or mostly false.
The world isn't black and white, you know.

This is one of many logical social advances included in my upcoming language, Fortrans.
I just wish people would care as much when "normal" people gets brutally murdered. But no, only when gays, colored and other people with something special dies everyone cares.
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Magnitus: Scr*w all that religious crap, what about simplicity in software design? I'm surprised that argument doesn't crop up more often really :P.
Stop relying on booleans and switch to Enums. They're awesome.
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Ghostbreed: I just wish people would care as much when "normal" people gets brutally murdered. But no, only when gays, colored and other people with something special dies everyone cares.
Off the subject, of course. The point here is not that an individual has killed an individual. This is a thread because of prejudice-driven killings, with victims designated through existing sociocultural stigma (pushed to its absolute logic). It's a matter in itself, an aspect of the place of trans people in society (no redhead-because-redhead killings trend).

But the recurring little outrage about the visibility of (what is clumsily called) "hate crimes" is quite telling.
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Telika:
Long post ahead, possibly interesting for anyone who has had disagreements with SJWs (about any topic) and is interested in possible explanations of why consensus failed completely:

Since there have been a great number of clashes between SJWs and comparatively rational people on the internet in recent times, I've been trying to dig deeper and find out why one can't reason with a SJW and where their immunity to basic logic stems from - in detail. Why dig deeper? Because simply saying "they're dumb and gtfo" isn't satisfactory, I'd like to get to the bottom of it all.

It dawned upon me that there isn't much sense in simply addressing and correcting all the statements point by point as I would do in a regular debate because that would at the very most be fighting symptoms of the problem, not the root cause and is only creating an infinite loop, kinda like in computer programming. It would indeed be like trying to prove one isn't a camel, in Groundhog Day style. Every day the same, again and again - it would get boring quickly.

So I tried to figure out what that root cause could be. A couple weeks ago, I mentioned that I suspected you of being afflicted by narcissist personality disorder but it was more of an intuitive hunch without in-depth analysis, I didn't really know that much about the disorder. Almost nothing, to be precise. This psychology stuff is admittedly only a side interest of mine but it's quite a fascinating field of study. Learning more as I go!

Just had an epiphany while reading through your long post above and then comparing it to the following article:
http://thenarcissisticlife.com/the-narcissist-out-of-control/

In your last post, one can find an uncanny amount of parallels with that article, almost a perfect fit to the situation at hand.

A while ago, brasas said he "loves us both" and hates to see you and me argue, a statement we can't verify but lets take it at face value as there is no evidence to the contrary. Unwittingly, brasas' declaration of affection was taken by you as the biggest insult possible because if you hate me, and someone holds you and me in the same regard, well...you get the idea.
As a result, brasas must now be "punished" for failing to comply to your control. By comparing yourself to "the Jews" and me to "Hitler" in your post, you've drawn out a map that is so clear cut that even a dummy can follow it and has to do so or morally fail (or so you believe).

It's not just about control though, as stated in the article:

"The narcissist’s obsessive desire for control is actually not about control for control’s sake; it is essentially a defense against the risk of receiving a “narcissistic injury” (a blow to the ego or self-esteem). "

In order to avoid the aforementioned narcissistic injury, narcissists have a strong urge to control others. You have openly admitted that you want to see people with opinions such as mine publicly shunned, banned even. Without ever asking me what exactly my positions are and why I think the way I think, all that didn't matter.
I used to think it's about politics but from this new angle I can see that it might very well be about compulsive control as explained in this excerpt:

"He sees other people in his environment – at home, at work, friends, relatives and neighbors – as extensions of himself. He sees himself at the center of the world- the controller, an idol to be adored and admired; in his mind this makes it acceptable for him to control and abuse others. He continually tries to rearrange the ‘others’ in his life to look toward only him and admire him. An expert in knowing best how things should turn out and how people should behave, the narcissist tries to control them."

This explains why you find it OK to use a barrage of insult words without realizing the near comical effect it has. I did laugh at your post at first but now that I analyze this from a new angle, I'm trying to be a little less goofy about things (not completely ungoofy though - I reserve the right to basic goofiness) and I understand why you appear to be oblivious about the tone of your posts and see no moral wrongdoing in it, no matter how crude the language. The strong rage is explained by the author of the article as "narcisstic rage" resulting from loss of control:

"If he loses control of others he will fail to find Narcissistic Supply sources, just like a drug addict that can’t find any drugs. This precipitates a narcissistic crisis. The narcissist becomes more desperate and more compulsive in looking for his drug. The more he fails, the more he is hurt and expresses his emotional turmoil by acting out (not uncommonly with ‘narcissistic rage’)."

Could also explain why you started on me in the Switzerland birthday thread as well as here, without me poking fun at you first.

Ok, so what is the constructive conclusion of all this psychobabble? I do realize that I sometimes have the subtlety of someone stepping into a dog food tray and saying "oops mesa step into dog food, o-ho!" when I put things and people on the spot like that.
Someone recently said that this lack of tact on my part might be Asperger's so I took a few online tests, they turned out negative though so I can't use that as an excuse (damn). I'm just a little straightforward, to a point where you inadvertently must think that I'm absolutely messing with you. I'm really interested in figuring out the truth though, non-trolling pinkyswear.

The problem is that I have absolutely no idea about how to fix narcissism - that is above my paygrade. I can only brainstorm (despite having no brain as you said) and point you in a possible direction, you still have to get the help yourself.
Why the interest in your welfare you might ask? Well, you used to be more fun 1+ years ago. Haven't seen you explode back then like in recent times, that is a new development of the past couple months. You can be like the old you again.
I'm fully aware of how absurd this post will be taken by you. Don't shoot the messenger and don't forget, you can't poison others without poisoning yourself. The damage to yourself will accumulate over time, please take that into account.

If I keep my mouth shut about politics, you would surely agree to behave. But I can't promise you that, besides it wouldn't help if we all collectively avoid setting off your triggers. A much better way is for you to introspect and ask yourself why you're -really- exploding this much and instead of blaming the unruly awalterj turdguru (I made up that one!) and his conspiratory shitminions, why not try to look at things more abstracted from names and specific people and find out how you can change to not be so easily irritable in the future.
Post edited August 15, 2015 by awalterj
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Telika:
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awalterj: Long post ahead, possibly interesting
oh i bet.
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Telika: snip
Thanks for proving my point.

For someone that once told me in PM you're not so keen towards psychological interpretations of phenomena, and rather more sociological ones, I think your tendency to take things to a personal level is enough on its own to show who is wearing huge blinders here. You continue to strawmen me among others, ignoring basic logical and philosophical distinctions pointed to you directly. Instead you choose (prefer?) to attribute disagreements to character in the most uncharitable way possible.

Basically, either our cultural sense of normality excuses individual behavior or it doesn't Telika. I've always said it does NOT, and a lot of my objections to systems you defend (the socialist welfare state - in a nutshell) are based on those systems undermining individual responsibility. Maybe that's "ultraconservative" (it isn't) but at least it's consistent.

You on the other hand seem to jump between pointing to impersonal cultural systems when you're interested in pushing political ideas or pointing to the persons when you are interested in pushing them out of the way. This fundamental incoherency in your position re: who is responsible for evil - impersonal society or individual agents? is why I hardly retain anything logical / rational from your rants. You're intelligenct and articulate yet the rants are so clearly coming from an emotional place that what I perceive and remember is your hatred and your fear.

It makes me sad above anything else. But I can't save you from hatred and I have no idea how to stop being your boogeyman without surrendering myself. Which I won't do, obviously - not for you.
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Oh dear. It's happened again!

http://www.therainbowhub.com/kandis-capri-may-be-latest-trans-woman-slain/

And of course, another one reported (it presumably happened last October):

http://www.therainbowhub.com/elisha-walker-is-third-trans-woman-reported-dead-today/

It's just been happening way too much lately.

Seriously, this needs to stop.
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dtgreene: It's just been happening way too much lately.
Hasn't it been happening just as much in the past, only reporting on trans-people has gotten more fashionable now? :P

Also:
"Update: A source, Elizabeth Marie Rivera, has told The Rainbow Hub that Kandis Capri was slain during her attempt to intervene in a domestic dispute."

In other words, any killing of a trans-person is currently reported as a hate-crime by default.
Post edited August 15, 2015 by F4LL0UT
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F4LL0UT: Also:
"Update: A source, Elizabeth Marie Rivera, has told The Rainbow Hub that Kandis Capri was slain during her attempt to intervene in a domestic dispute."

In other words, any killing of a trans-person is currently reported as a hate-crime by default.
The thing is, this happens because so often it *is* a hate crime.

It's similar to how, when a suicide of a transgender person is reported, it is considered to be related to being transgender. Consider Rachel Bryk (emulator developer), whose suicide was attributed to cyber-bullying, but it turns out that she was in pain due to medical conditions. Of course, in this case, the cause of suicide is most likely a combination of those factors.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/04/28/killed-myself-sorry-transgender-game-developer-jumps-off-bridge-after-online-abuse/

(The headline is slightly misleading; she was an emulator devoloper, not a game devoloper. The skills needed are quite different. Also, before anyone asks, there are transgender game devolopers (more than you would expect, actually).).

The same can be said of murders of trans women of color: It could be a combination of factors, racism and transphobia being two of them, but in Kandis Capri's case, so could her decision to intervene in the dispute.

Things are never as simple as people make them out to be, but that doesn't change the fact that yet another trans woman was murdered.
Not to be rude or anything, but do you seriously sit and browse through the internet just to find articles about trans people getting killed?
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Telika: Retain what you want, what you can, or what is most convenient, from my posts,
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Brasas: Thanks for proving my point.
Not disappointed.