I see your point; there are people who love achievements aren't there?
I suggest a compromise between our two extremes then: The option to turn them off.

I'd have no problem with such an option.

I am mostly of the same opinion regarding achievements. That TR one does sound really strange. Sometimes they can lead you to try or discover new things in a game though too.

After playing games without Galaxy achievements, I prefer them a lot more over ones with them.

If there's any devpubs that are hesitant to publish here because they're worried about needing achievements, they shouldn't be pressured to. A DRM-free version comparable to the Steam version will suffice.

There's nothing stopping the pro-achievement people from manually going through achievements lists to check off if they really want to. And let's not forget they're worthless because Cheat Engine exists.

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EDIT: documentation about importing:

docs.gog.com/sdk-steam-import/
docs.gog.com/achievements/#adding-achievements-imported-from-steam

I guess it isn't hard to do as long as they've did it beforehand in Steamworks, but it still doesn't change the enjoyment of games with or without it.

On Steam, you could use the achievement manager. On GOG, not sure. And another method, you could just rebuy the game on a different platform or play it when it's given away for free. I played Styx: Shards of Darkness almost 2 years ago, got all the non-annoying achievements, and since it's given away on GOG I'll do it again!

I really don't care about achievements one way or the other, as long as they don't break the immersion. If the game has achievements in the background for those who care about such stuff - well, good for them. But being plagued by pop-ups while playing a game is very annoying. There is a reason all browsers have pop-up blockers. I don't know why anyone would want pop-ups in their games instead.

One "funny" (?) thing I noticed a few months ago in regard to achievements on Steam:

I usually buy games when they're on sale (with a certain percentage off).
That's usually the case, a few years after release.
After the purchase, it can, once again, take months (if not years) until I actually start and play the game.

A few months ago, I played a game for the first time, that I had already purchased several years ago.
And after a few hours, when I stopped playing again, my eyes got caught by the achievements that I had reached so far.

One of them was "You have completed the first chapter/level/whatever (25% of all players have reached this achievement)".

And that's something, I find really interesting.
A game, that sold pretty well, maybe not an AAA title, but AA at least,...and several years after release only a quarter of all owners have reached the end of the first chapter/level/whatever...

To try and put some perspective to this: that end can be reached around 20 to 30 minutes into the game.

I think that tells quite a lot about our "buy, buy some more, buy everything" society".

If you don't mind, what's the title of the game? I'm curious, and also there are other factors that could influence this. Like for example, the horror co-op Phasmophobia has a very low achievement % because it was added like only a few weeks ago, while the game's release and climb to fame were around the first pandemic Halloween, October 2020.

Or maybe like Fallout 4, I heard using mods disables achievements, and people who don't bother with those won't need to install the achievement enabler mod or play vanilla. And yes you're absolutely right, there are people who only buys games to follow the hype, then abandon it just as quick.

Absolutely. Back then, Valve described their services to their business clients with the following words:

3. Valuable Platform-Dependent Features
Customers won't want to pirate a game that's connected to 20 million gamers and a feature-rich platform. Features like Steam Achievements, Anti-Cheat, Auto-Updating, and Steam Cloud simply dont exist outside of Steam.
Furthermore, constantly updating your game with upgrades and content leaves the pirates in the dust they are relegated to a featureless game with no community of players.

I retrieved this via the internet time machine, typos and all, but the direct link doesn't work sadly.
Back in 2011 to at least 2013, it was the address http://steampowered.com/steamworks/publishingservices.php

I don't particularly like achievements for completing a specific portion of the story in a game, but achievements for doing cool stuff actually do make me feel like I achieved something.
Like maybe utilising combos or even milestones.

Honestly, this kinda works for me lol. Other than the obvious safety, ease of access, and morally doing the right thing, these features play the part in making me buy or replay games. I've lost lots of game data before when my memory cards broke, and knowing its in the Cloud gives me a bit of peace of mind. And some games I just wanna replay on different stores if it has achievements lol.

I know GOG's all about DRM free, but having access to those features as well as a DRM free installer makes it better. I'm still gonna use those features whenever I can though.

I don't really have any strong feelings about achivments, either for or against. like all other features, you have bad examples and good examples, all depending on how well they are designed.

just want to say that one thing missing here, is that achivments can be a very good (and non-intrusive) way for developers to getner metrics abouot their game, especially progression based achivments. they can see where people drop off, where they struggle, and so on.

I don't particularly care for achievements, but I certainly don't mind their inclusion either.

I also think some games are a better fit than others for such things. For example, rogue-likes/lites are built on the idea of replaying the game multiple times in a relatively short loop, with randomized access to the overall content. Including achievements to have an idea of how much you have seen of the content, and track what you unlocked (if there are unlockables, as it often happens) and/or give hints to hard to find secrets probably isn't a bad approach.

It's much worse if the game is very long and narrative focused, as then you are chasing chores, more often than not.