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Toast_burner: So they had an employee that you don't like, therefore anything said on there should be avoided? Again how is that logical? Who worked for them is irrelevant to the content.

If boycotting anything that contains anything you disagree with or is written by a person you don't like, isn't creating a bubble/safe space, I don't know what is.
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Arinielle: Making excuses and not even knowing how journalism works.. sounds about right for ya, I guess.

Lots of articles written and posted and not even checked for accuracy. That's a failing on the site itself and how little journalists can or will be trusted. Their job is based on trust.
It's an opinion site. They are pretty much a written form version of TED that is exclusively about games. Most of the stuff they write is about business or design and is aimed at game developers.
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Arinielle: Making excuses and not even knowing how journalism works.. sounds about right for ya, I guess.

Lots of articles written and posted and not even checked for accuracy. That's a failing on the site itself and how little journalists can or will be trusted. Their job is based on trust.
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Toast_burner: It's an opinion site. They are pretty much a written form version of TED that is exclusively about games. Most of the stuff they write is about business or design and is aimed at game developers.
Opinion site when it matters and they're one of those same sites that claims they're journalists when it would better suit them to be called such. Can't have both.
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Toast_burner: It's an opinion site. They are pretty much a written form version of TED that is exclusively about games. Most of the stuff they write is about business or design and is aimed at game developers.
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Arinielle: Opinion site when it matters and they're one of those same sites that claims they're journalists when it would better suit them to be called such. Can't have both.
Why don't you just look at the site yourself? Yes they have news stories, but that doesn't mean everything they say is a news story. Like I said they are a game information site aimed at developers. So that involves everything from the latest tech (which would be news) to the social status of potential customers and how you should decide which group to aim for (business related opinion). So yes they can have it both, why can't they?

You're complaining about a site without even attempting to understand what the purpose of it is.
Post edited April 06, 2016 by Toast_burner
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Rusty_Gunn: 1) How would GOG know for certain that the "reviewer" doesn't have a copy, sure they may or may not have obtained here. there's other places where it's available.

2) the act of having this review "embargo" that you're suggesting IMHO would almost certainly be seen as being a very shady action that could cost GOG dearly.
Both could probably be solved if GOG barred reviews from non-owners for all day-1 releases rather than just the one game. Older games are another issue entirely since there's plenty of time to have bought and played through such a game in its entirety by the time it shows up, but for games released at the same time as Steam, it doesn't seem like too much to ask for people to only be able to review the game where they purchase it. At least, for a reasonable period of time.

That probably seems pretty skewed in favor of something like Siege of Dragonspear, but it would also keep those offended by a game from taking it out in a review, which could prove to be a valuable ward against the perpetually outraged. For example, I remember when Huniepop came here (not a day-1 release, but still) and the first few reviews were of the "get a life" variety. While that was just a few people, it'd help stave off that kind of thing if it were to happen on a larger scale, and to be honest, Dragonspear getting hit with a ton of 1-star reviews doesn't look to be a good result for anyone; everyone just suddenly seems really angry at the fictitious versions of "the other side" that exists in their heads, and I don't see how anyone could possibly stand to gain from that.
i barely ever read the revie
ws on gog (or somewhere else)

most often they are biased... filled with 1 star hatred negative "reviews" of just ranting about one MINOR problem that even possibly comes from the reviewer itself and his computer rather than just the game... other who dont give objective facts and/or are making up their opinion on early moments of the games...
damn i ever saw gogmixes of people pretentiously claim/label numerous games as shit/worthless/bad even when many of them already have a large enough base of happy satisfied gamers (including me most of time)

so, no, i dont really give a fuck about random reviews

now detailed and factual reviews by someone i can figure out the rough gamer profile and taste throughout previous writings in a way accurate enough to be able to sort out which parts of his tastes are similar to mine or against them so i canfigure out for myself how much i would like a game myself, wether he gave a bad review or a good one... that i'll consider reading and listening

problem is: on gog, there is no way to display a whole user profile page of each review already posted to manage to understand the person's tastes and history, nor there is a way to search for gogmix using keywords... damn, i cant even FIND BACK my own gogmixes for editing or updating if i ever LOST the textfile where i stored the link before...

gog does a very lousy job regarding users interaction and communauty functions and features. so as they are useless and bad at the actual point, i dont even need them to "polish" them with day one embargos or ownership checks (when you polish a turd well, you wont get much more than turd anyway)
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Arinielle: Keep reading. Below just that snippet is who has worked for them and what they did that wasn't right.

I'm not even part of a group that's trying to call for safe spaces everywhere because people disagree with me. Might wanna try that again.
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Toast_burner: So they had an employee that you don't like, therefore anything said on there should be avoided? Again how is that logical? Who worked for them is irrelevant to the content.

If boycotting anything that contains anything you disagree with or is written by a person you don't like, isn't creating a bubble/safe space, I don't know what is.
No one said it needed to be boycotted. Who boycotts what is their own decision. That employee has regularly violated written down journalistic ethics and the editors did nothing about it. As you said, its mostly an opinion site, but there is a difference in not going to a restaurant that serves food you don't like and not going to one where the cook spits in your food.
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Shadowstalker16: So you're saying you know objectively what the character of Tracer is and what she ''about''
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Vainamoinen: I'm saying the developers do, and I'm saying that THEIR knowledge is being questioned, but certainly not by me.
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Vainamoinen: .

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Shadowstalker16: Aren't you calling your enemy ''nazi'' also feeding into your enemy concept?
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Vainamoinen: "Calling"? My "enemy"? Not sure what you're talking about.

But for the last time, please do evaluate what "SJW" means and especially the way the term is persistently used in this thread.

The SJW is a dehumanized, fascist enemy concept. It is a figure who attempts to achieve broad social change by voicing her invalid opinion in an exaggerated, stupid and hysteric way even though the ostensibly supported or protected group of people would not even like or profit from the social change in question. The SJW never possesses an overview of the topic at hand and argues for goals that are not important to her. She always demands censorship from the state as well as from the creatives. She is secretly organized in groups of people that think exactly alike. Ultimately, the SJW are creating a dystopian form of neo-communism that would destroy all our traditions and values. Their involvement especially destroys our art, and the art they themselves create is worthless and degenerate.

That is, right from beginning to end, the nazi concept of the "Underling" or "Untermensch", whatever political direction those who use the term may follow. So I can say that the concept is nazist, not the people who use it. Of course, the Daily Stormer loves the "SJW" label as well, i.e. it shouldn't come as a surprise that literal Nazis especially employ the nazist enemy concept.
Well then you should have said the proper definition of what you were saying first. All this time I didn't understand this reference at all. Anyway, learned a new concept so thanks for explaining it.
As you may know, most people in GG aren't using SJW as a method of dismissing criticism. Neither do people consider the term in a definition of what you said. All most people say about ''SJWs'' is that they hate all art and that they are ideologues and censors and of course the eternal ''no fun allowed''.

I don't think GG is arguing for the removed pose to be put in as much as they are whining about its removal; which is completely reasonable. And no, GG doesn't have any ops where they're pushing their own interpretation of Tracer to justify the pose. The only person who seems to have pushed their interpretation is that ''concerned parent'' retard.
Post edited April 06, 2016 by Shadowstalker16
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Reaper9988: Ahh well I didn't really follow the Siege of Dragonspear stuff, but is Mizhena an actual transgender, or just a guy that drank a potion to become a female '?(Or vice versa)

The second makes sense the first doesn't. Why would you actually try to Transfer to the sex you want to be, never really getting there, while you could just get some spell on you and become a fully functional being of the other sex ?
(Unless there is some economic xxplanation.)
If it is the second why in the world would you tell anyone about it ? For all accounts you are female at this point.

I can't remember Edwin in BG, but Elmister sex changed because it was required by Mystra as far as I remember.
He never was transsexual he was just a female with the mind of Elminster at that Point.

This and this amber chicks interview really make me want to stay away from the game as it reeks of agenda.

More importantly though, the chick said beamdog didn't like the writing of the first bg, anyone know if they did change anything in the dialogues ?
I bought the ed Editions but if they changed the scripts it might be time to look for a refund, after all the old editions work fine.
There's a temporary spell, but it's not permanent and you have to find a mage willing to cast it on you. So that's not a real solution. There is a permanent item, but it's extremely rare.


I don't think they've changed the script of the original. But let's be real - BG was good but it had some problems. It's not perfect. Criticizing it is perfectly legitimate.

All that the writer said was basically 'Writing everyone the same is boring and feels forced to me, so I like to write different kinds of characters to keep things like real life'. That's not an agenda, that's an artist thinking about her art. This is an artist doing a good job. Nobody is making anyone like it, but it's perfectly normal for a writer to write things she feels better reflect reality.

Here, this article talks about it better than I can: http://www.craveonline.com/entertainment/973517-debunking-absurdity-transphobic-baldurs-gate-controversy


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DadouXIII: This whole thing has gone completely out of control...
Referencing GG, stupid unfunny memes, obviously shoehorned SJ concepts, all of that in a BG game. What were Beamdog thinking...
You do realize that Dungeons & Dragons, as well as the original IE games, were pretty progressive for their time, right? Half-breeds, cross-dressing, gender-changing items, gay characters, etc were all a huge controversy when D&D got started. BD is just continuing that tradition.

http://www.craveonline.com/entertainment/973847-forgotten-realms-creator-ed-greenwood-saddened-baldurs-gate-controversy
Post edited April 06, 2016 by Gilozard
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DadouXIII: This whole thing has gone completely out of control...
Referencing GG, stupid unfunny memes, obviously shoehorned SJ concepts, all of that in a BG game. What were Beamdog thinking...
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Gilozard: You do realize that Dungeons & Dragons, as well as the original IE games, were pretty progressive for their time, right? Half-breeds, cross-dressing, gender-changing items, gay characters, etc were all a huge controversy when D&D got started. BD is just continuing that tradition.

http://www.craveonline.com/entertainment/973847-forgotten-realms-creator-ed-greenwood-saddened-baldurs-gate-controversy
That has nothing to do with what I said but ok.
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Gilozard: You do realize that Dungeons & Dragons, as well as the original IE games, were pretty progressive for their time, right? Half-breeds, cross-dressing, gender-changing items, gay characters, etc were all a huge controversy when D&D got started. BD is just continuing that tradition.

http://www.craveonline.com/entertainment/973847-forgotten-realms-creator-ed-greenwood-saddened-baldurs-gate-controversy
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DadouXIII: That has nothing to do with what I said but ok.
You: Politics, social issues and memes are totally out of place in BG!
Me: Actually, discussing political and social issues and having memes are very traditional for both D&D and BG.
You: Whatever.

Clearer now?
Guys I'd like to take a post to remind you the media has successfully twisted and ignored by exclusion and strawmanning the facts surrounding the Baldur's Gate incident and have convinced most people that its only about ''angry transphobic gamers(or gamergators) reviewbombing a game for having a trans cahracter''.
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DadouXIII: That has nothing to do with what I said but ok.
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Gilozard: You: Politics, social issues and memes are totally out of place in BG!
Me: Actually, discussing political and social issues and having memes are very traditional for both D&D and BG.
You: Whatever.

Clearer now?
Well yeah, but you seem to include ogres crossdressing and sex changing potions of fantasy with real life transgender issues.
Post edited April 06, 2016 by Shadowstalker16
low rated
I'd heard about this fuss and wondered what it was all about. Good article, thanks for the link :)

Hope you're having fun continuing to chat with these guys...
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Vainamoinen: The SJW is a dehumanized, fascist enemy concept....
Say they guy that regularly use "gaters" exactly the same way, how wonderful hypocrisy....
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htown1980: I'd heard about this fuss and wondered what it was all about. Good article, thanks for the link :)

Hope you're having fun continuing to chat with these guys...
Things have changed. The fighting on the forum sucked out (most) of the fighting in this thread. And most topics will lower your rep and not just this one.
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DadouXIII: That has nothing to do with what I said but ok.
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Gilozard: You: Politics, social issues and memes are totally out of place in BG!
Me: Actually, discussing political and social issues and having memes are very traditional for both D&D and BG.
You: Whatever.

Clearer now?
That's a very nice strawman mate, and I must say, you did an admirable job in tearing it down.

There were no such things as internet memes around the time the BG saga was written, and discussing political and social issues exists in every medium ever. But there is a clear difference between political / social discussion and cramming tokens / badly designed characters for the sake of it, and then flipping off the community for not liking it.
Seriously ? this is beyond silly, even a triple face-palm is not enough anymore (I had to check to make sure that it wasn't a Onion like site making this news :) ).

Some peoples really don't know what to find to be offended by, it's just a cream that remove age spots or sun related spots, not some sort of toxic cream that some peoples used to whiten their skin.

What's next complain about anti-age cream, and insult those doing commercial for them, because they are promoting ageism ?