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Shadowstalker16: Chairman Pao has mutated Reddit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBmScggN-dc
Been trying to keep up with this...this is crazy. I've rarely ever used Reddit other than to look at cute animals ( no, I'm not joking >.>; ). I try not to get too much into Kotaku In Action but I don't even bother to log in for it.

I don't like more places removing all these places. Not because I use any of 'em but because I think they still have a right to exist ( my personal feelings on why I like and don't like them not to be included in this ).
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227: Can you prove this? That'd be huge. The only reason I haven't seen GG focus on the big-name studios and their corruption is because it's way harder to prove apart from the rare Jeff Gerstmann-esque blowups, it being one of those things everyone suspects but no one ever seems to have hard evidence of. I'd love to focus on that if you have anything to contribute in that regard, though.

Still, finding unethical journalists in any way we can is bound to weed out those who would take bribes like that, too. I doubt there are separate divisions of game journalists who receive sexual favors and monetary favors. They're probably all the same group of people.
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dick1982: i don't about you, but REAL journalists and old-media mostly believe accepting free games and party invites as "corruption". and that's an open secret (game reviewer accepting free stuff) for the longest time.

the supposedly evil old-media and and some of their journalists have spelled it out pretty clearly . professional gaming media and reviewers are fundamentally corrupted... and the GG reaction is overt and rabid.

if any old-media corp behaved like gaming media, they would at least be mocked endlessly like foxnews. but death threats? that's crazy.
Please make sense.
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Shadowstalker16: Chairman Pao has mutated Reddit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBmScggN-dc
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Arinielle: Been trying to keep up with this...this is crazy. I've rarely ever used Reddit other than to look at cute animals ( no, I'm not joking >.>; ). I try not to get too much into Kotaku In Action but I don't even bother to log in for it.

I don't like more places removing all these places. Not because I use any of 'em but because I think they still have a right to exist ( my personal feelings on why I like and don't like them not to be included in this ).
I don't agree with what you have to say but I'll defend you're right to say it..........oohhh favorable media angle, acceptance from hipsters, $$$ from people who want to deny who they are...........until you harass someone of course.
Post edited June 11, 2015 by Shadowstalker16
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dick1982: i don't about you, but REAL journalists and old-media mostly believe accepting free games and party invites as "corruption". and that's an open secret (game reviewer accepting free stuff) for the longest time.

the supposedly evil old-media and and some of their journalists have spelled it out pretty clearly . professional gaming media and reviewers are fundamentally corrupted... and the GG reaction is overt and rabid.

if any old-media corp behaved like gaming media, they would at least be mocked endlessly like foxnews. but death threats? that's crazy.
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Shadowstalker16: Please make sense.
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Arinielle: Been trying to keep up with this...this is crazy. I've rarely ever used Reddit other than to look at cute animals ( no, I'm not joking >.>; ). I try not to get too much into Kotaku In Action but I don't even bother to log in for it.

I don't like more places removing all these places. Not because I use any of 'em but because I think they still have a right to exist ( my personal feelings on why I like and don't like them not to be included in this ).
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Shadowstalker16: I don't agree with what you have to say but I'll defend you're right to say it..........oohhh favorable media angle, acceptance from hipsters, $$$ from people who want to deny who they are...........until you harass someone of course.
no, you explain yourself. stop throwing around buzzwords , speaking vaguely, feigning ignorance, and acting all high and and mighty and offended by EVERYTHING. wtf, paki. i wasn't even replying to you in the first place!!! don't tell me... that's your clone account?
Post edited June 11, 2015 by dick1982
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babark: By who? Certainly not the consensus. I didn't think Gone Home was the best thing ever in the universe, but I enjoyed it enough while I was playing it.
I just recently finished playing Qora, which seems to fit what you are saying very well. It could conceivable be labelled a "non-game" or whatever people use to denigrate this type of stuff, and I actually loved it. It took me about 2 hours to complete, the didn't really have any serious "challenge" to speak of (unless you're an achievement or multiple endings completionist). The entire game consisted of pressing either the forward key, the up key or the down key, and occasionally tapping the spacebar for whatever contextual interaction was on screen- there was no possibility to miss a jump or hit the wrong thing or such.
And it was great! Great music, great art, involving and humourous story, and I certainly enjoyed it, and enjoyed it in a way I know I wouldn't enjoy if I was watching a movie. I may not have bought it at full price, but then again, I never buy a game at full price anyhow.
Is somehow it worth less because it doesn't focus so heavily on mechanics? Should I care that developers (allegedly) don't like those sort of games? Is it less deserving of praise or notice? Is my liking it somehow proof that I want to ban games not like it? Who wants to ban games not like it? Nobody I've ever read or seen has ever said "Gone Home/Depression Quest/Qora is great, other types of games shouldn't exist!".
As long as it is clearly communicated what sort of game a game is, none of this should be any issue at all. I SO much more prefer games like this rather than games that pretend to be "REAL" games but turn out to be boring linear button-mashing (supposedly requiring skill) inbetween pre-built kill animations moving from cutscene to cutscene (Metal Gear Rising Revengeance comes to mind).
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Shadowstalker16: The way I see it, gone home requires more patience in state of mind to play through. If the player is not in the right mindset; ie wanting to skip the story and get the gameplay, gone home will fail to impress the player. For someone to enjoy it, IMO, there needs to be certain conditions that must be satisfied. They shouldn't be looking for a complex mechanical puzzle like Dark Souls or the like. Enjoying it proves you can immerse yourself easier basically, or that you can feel immersed without needing too much gameplay, and the game's writing is enough to do that. So people who are really used to being mechanically and narratively immersed and require both factors to be immersed won't feel immersed. So no right or wrong; just taste with this one. Some people may have the opposite. They may not feel immersed in the Souls-like narrative style because the narrative element is mostly hidden and can only be found through exploration. So mechanically and narrative are basically two parts of the whole game; and most people have particular tastes into how much they want of each. So its subjective is what I'm sayin :D
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amok: well, if enjoying what I like to enjoy and let other people enjoy what they like to enjoy, makes me not a gamer, then I would more than happily say I am not a gamer. I will then just play the games I like to play, be it Psychonauts, Duke Nukem or Gone Home... but if this is the "common consesnsus", then please do not also say games should have "much more tolerant spaces", because what you are describing is the opposite of this - intolerance towards things you do not like.

So I guess this gamer is dead, long live doing what I like and playing what I find fun :)
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Shadowstalker16: You do realize me saying that back then was a joke right? And you taking it seriously meant you have belief the proGG can support tolerance. So kudos for being a castle-gate more openminded than Vain.

Do you not see that antiGG has been shaming and hating from the start? Gamers are dead? Gaming=intolerance?? What kind of mainstream media slob would believe playing a game would cause someone to change their behavior to the delicious media fantasy of ''exclusion''? AntiGG and SJ in general suffers from HUGE intolerance complex. They don't just express their dissatisfaction on twitter, and get called intolerant. They try to remove the thing they don't tolerate. So yes, if AntiGG wants mechanically-focused gamers to stop insulting antigames, stop the stupid intolerance to any game which offends you [ie; them, not actually you].
when ever did I say anti-GG is tolerant?

edit- I keep saying GG and AGG is as bad as each other.
Post edited June 11, 2015 by amok
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Shadowstalker16: Please make sense.

I don't agree with what you have to say but I'll defend you're right to say it..........oohhh favorable media angle, acceptance from hipsters, $$$ from people who want to deny who they are...........until you harass someone of course.
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dick1982: no, you explain yourself. stop throwing around buzzwords , speaking vaguely, feigning ignorance, and acting all high and and mighty and offended by EVERYTHING. wtf, paki. i wasn't even replying to you in the first place!!! don't tell me... that's your clone account?
That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
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dick1982: no, you explain yourself. stop throwing around buzzwords , speaking vaguely, feigning ignorance, and acting all high and and mighty and offended by EVERYTHING. wtf, paki. i wasn't even replying to you in the first place!!! don't tell me... that's your clone account?
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Shadowstalker16: That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
well, for one thing I would like them to stop calling them anti-games :)
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Shadowstalker16: That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
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amok: well, for one thing I would like them to stop calling them anti-games :)
Yes; antigames are more a ridicule-bron way to describe them. To me they are ''experience focused'' games rather than mechanically focused ones.
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dick1982: no, you explain yourself. stop throwing around buzzwords , speaking vaguely, feigning ignorance, and acting all high and and mighty and offended by EVERYTHING. wtf, paki. i wasn't even replying to you in the first place!!! don't tell me... that's your clone account?
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Shadowstalker16: That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
no really. why am i not making any sense? am i typing in chineses or something? you clarify and elaborate on nothing and treat people like idiots. what kind of reaction do you expect?
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dick1982: i don't about you, but REAL journalists and old-media mostly believe accepting free games and party invites as "corruption". and that's an open secret (game reviewer accepting free stuff) for the longest time.
One of my standby examples of corruption in the industry, something so glaring and obvious that even some of the people who are aggressively anti-GG (John Walker in particular) got involved on the pro-consumer side, is the fiasco with Lauren Wainwright and Eurogamer involving the Dorito Pope, free stuff, and conflicts of interest. What a drama that ended up being.

Incidentally, I do believe that review copies and party/event invitations need to stop in the industry. Apart from a picture of game journalists and PR people I remember being posted on a pro-GG board several months back, however, there hasn't really been anything shocking enough to get that conversation started. Yet, at least. It's definitely something I'd love to stress if given the opportunity.

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dick1982: the supposedly evil old-media and and some of their journalists have spelled it out pretty clearly . professional gaming media and reviewers are fundamentally corrupted... and the GG reaction is overt and rabid.

if any old-media corp behaved like gaming media, they would at least be mocked endlessly like foxnews. but death threats? that's crazy.
You make it sound like GG is all death threats all the time. That may be what's reported by the gaming media, but it's simply not true. There have only been a handful of death threats comparable to the number coming from the "other side," though of course those go unreported by the games journalists since it doesn't tie into their narrative, and much of this harassment has been shown to be either third party trolls (GNAA), faked harassment (an anti-GG individual using twitter accounts set up to retweet anything he posted on his site in order to fabricate a flood of death threats against Wu), or just fringe nutjobs (who exist on every side of every issue and manage to always be horrible),

Someone posted something a few pages back with numbers apparently showing that GG is about ethics in journalism. That might be worth a look if you haven't already. I didn't check it myself, admittedly, but I've certainly seen far more journalism stuff than the brand of ugliness that some would have you believe permeates GG to the core.
Post edited June 11, 2015 by 227
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Shadowstalker16: That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
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dick1982: no really. why am i not making any sense? am i typing in chineses or something? you clarify and elaborate on nothing and treat people like idiots. what kind of reaction do you expect?
Still calling Indians 'paki' is NOT cool bro, even if you were doing it ironically...
Post edited June 11, 2015 by Fever_Discordia
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227: You make it sound like GG is all death threats all the time. That may be what's reported by the gaming media, but it's simply not true. There have only been a handful of death threats comparable to the number coming from the "other side," though of course those go unreported by the games journalists since it doesn't tie into their narrative, and much of this harassment has been shown to be either third party trolls (GNAA), faked harassment (an anti-GG individual using twitter accounts set up to retweet anything he posted on his site in order to fabricate a flood of death threats against Wu), or just fringe nutjobs (who exist on every side of every issue and manage to always be horrible),

Someone posted something a few pages back with numbers apparently showing that GG is about ethics in journalism. That might be worth a look if you haven't already. I didn't check it myself, admittedly, but I've certainly seen far more journalism stuff than the brand of ugliness that some would have you believe permeates GG to the core.
that's nice to know. but after all those hatred threads, i can't help be become more cynical.

i would rather TRY to stay out of this whole mess. it's not like any of these people involved(SJWs, GG, anti-GG, brofisting gamers,whatever) have lobbying powers in governments, or actually debating more important "social" issues like you know... basic human and labour rights?
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dick1982: no really. why am i not making any sense? am i typing in chineses or something? you clarify and elaborate on nothing and treat people like idiots. what kind of reaction do you expect?
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Fever_Discordia: Still calling Indians 'paki' is NOT cool bro, even if you were doing it ironically...
fine fine. but you're getting too touchy. pakis do actually live in india and vice versa(indians living in pakistan).

incidentally i was once berated by own brother for using the term "indian indians"(indian expats from india, who are not born and educated in singapoor).
Post edited June 11, 2015 by dick1982
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dick1982: no really. why am i not making any sense? am i typing in chineses or something? you clarify and elaborate on nothing and treat people like idiots. what kind of reaction do you expect?
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Fever_Discordia: Still calling Indians 'paki' is NOT cool bro, even if you were doing it ironically...
I think that is regionalism. not racism as far as I know., still bad and limited though.
Post edited June 11, 2015 by Shadowstalker16
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227: You make it sound like GG is all death threats all the time. That may be what's reported by the gaming media, but it's simply not true. There have only been a handful of death threats comparable to the number coming from the "other side," though of course those go unreported by the games journalists since it doesn't tie into their narrative, and much of this harassment has been shown to be either third party trolls (GNAA), faked harassment (an anti-GG individual using twitter accounts set up to retweet anything he posted on his site in order to fabricate a flood of death threats against Wu), or just fringe nutjobs (who exist on every side of every issue and manage to always be horrible),

Someone posted something a few pages back with numbers apparently showing that GG is about ethics in journalism. That might be worth a look if you haven't already. I didn't check it myself, admittedly, but I've certainly seen far more journalism stuff than the brand of ugliness that some would have you believe permeates GG to the core.
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dick1982: that's nice to know. but after all those hatred threads, i can't help be become more cynical.

i would rather TRY to stay out of this whole mess. it's not like any of these people involved(SJWs, GG, anti-GG, brofisting gamers,whatever) have lobbying powers in governments, or actually debating more important "social" issues like you know... basic human and labour rights?
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Fever_Discordia: Still calling Indians 'paki' is NOT cool bro, even if you were doing it ironically...
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dick1982: fine fine. but you're getting too touchy. pakis do actually live in india and vice versa(indians living in pakistan).

incidentally i was once berated by own brother for using the term "indian indians"(indian expats from india, who are not born and educated in singapoor).
LOL no, calling Pakistanis 'paki' isn't cool either!
*shrugs* maybe I'm judging Malaysia by British standards and to you calling a Pakistani a 'paki' is no different to calling a British person a 'Brit' but I assure you that 'paki' is a term of racial abuse on par with the 'n' word where I come from and... you're posting on an international forum, in English so.... maybe you should be more sensitive to that or you might be mistaken for a racist
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dick1982: that's nice to know. but after all those hatred threads, i can't help be become more cynical.
Threads about the game, Hatred, or threads involving people hating each other? Haven't followed the game if that's what you're talking about, so I don't know what's happening with it.

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dick1982: i would rather TRY to stay out of this whole mess. it's not like any of these people involved(SJWs, GG, anti-GG, brofisting gamers,whatever) have lobbying powers in governments, or actually debating more important "social" issues like you know... basic human and labour rights?
True, but government isn't the only means of change, and there being more pressing issues doesn't make journalistic integrity any less an issue. In fact, it could be argued that there being worse issues out there reinforces the need for unbiased journalism that accurately portrays topics because a piece that mischaracterizes a problem for the sake of playing politics could snowball (as media tends to pick up stories from other media) into an entirely new problem. Less a problem in gaming journalism, mind you, but there's been some overlap where mainstream media has picked up the GG story and shown inadequacies of their own.

But there's really no need to get involved either way if you don't want to. I don't think anyone'd blame you for not getting involved given how tense the whole thing sometimes gets.
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Shadowstalker16: That escalated quickly. Who exactly are you even talking about? Chill your nips and talk rationally.

@amok : but its seems to me that you're wanting to stop #GG complaining about antigames and say nothing about their vendetta against anything that offends them.
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dick1982: no really. why am i not making any sense? am i typing in chineses or something? you clarify and elaborate on nothing and treat people like idiots. what kind of reaction do you expect?
You say old media has pointed out that games journalism is corrupt. You say they have been doing that for a long time. No proof linked, no incident to refer to.

You say the old media has pointed something out. clearly. Yet its not apparent if you refer to them referring to games journos or gamergate. You say the old media is supposedly evil.

You say that if an old media outlet behaved like game journos, they would be insulted. Like FoxNews is. But you apparently lack the ability to find all the critiques of mainstream news outlets EVERYWHERE. But then you mention death threats, relating to want exactly?