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GR00T: Do these qualify?

Ys the vanished omens
Ys II: The Final Chapter
Undertale
Valkyria Chronicles
The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky
Tale of Wuxia
Sengoku Rance
The Last Remnant

They're all either reviewed or at least mentioned. That's only the ones I recognize as likely JRPG/non-WRPG candidates.
Hmm, pretty sure Dark Souls titles are in the book, and since when are those games WRPG? Also, Dragon's Dogma.
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dtgreene: Found the list from a Twitter post, and my one complaint is the complete lack of JRPG representation. JRPGs are CRPGs too! I note that many early JRPGs are integral to the history of CRPGs (in particular, the original Dragon Quest is interesting from a historical perspective, particularly how different it is from the rest of the series), and the best JRPGs are, without question, better than the worst WRPGs (and likely better than the worst WRPGs on the list).

Does the full book cover JRPGs (at least the most notable ones), or is the author one of those who doesn't think JRPGs are real RPGs? (Remember, the term WRPG exists if you want to specifically refer to that type of game.)

Also, does anyone have a link to a list of all the games covered in the book?

(Some other notable JRPGs; Final Fantasy (who originally copied its magic system from Wizardry), SaGa series (a series that does things differently, starting with influence from a non-D&D TRPG, and later evolving into something that straddles the line between JRPG and WRPG), and Undertale (if it counts, it is a rather unique game that has heavy JRPG influence, but does its own thing in many respects).

(I'm just annoyed at the many WRPG elitests out there, who think that WRPGs are the only true CRPGs; sure, WRPGs are great (at least the good ones; I am pretty sure that garbage WRPGs exist, but that can be said of any genre, including JRPGs), but they're not the only style out there.

(There's also issues with the RPGCodex forum not being a nice place, but that's another story, and hopefully not one that affects the content or quality of the book itself.)
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GR00T: Do these qualify?

Ys the vanished omens
Ys II: The Final Chapter
Undertale
Valkyria Chronicles
The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky
Tale of Wuxia
Sengoku Rance
The Last Remnant

They're all either reviewed or at least mentioned. That's only the ones I recognize as likely JRPG/non-WRPG candidates.
The first two games on the list, IMO, do not qualify as I don't see them as RPGs at all; they're action games that happen to borrow heavily from the RPG genre, but are still action games at their core.

The games you listed do qualify, but I would have liked to see games like the early Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy games (the first 3 should be sufficient, particularly since it is those early games where WRPGs and JRPGs were most similar; FF2 even has a keyword system for conversations).

Good to see Undertale on the hist, however.
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dtgreene: The first two games on the list, IMO, do not qualify as I don't see them as RPGs at all; they're action games that happen to borrow heavily from the RPG genre, but are still action games at their core.
Well, you kind of have to run with the author's definition. There are a number of games there that I personally wouldn't consider RPGs either, but there's a prologue of sorts that explains the thinking behind why they went with a broader definition of RPG.

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dtgreene: The games you listed do qualify, but I would have liked to see games like the early Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy games (the first 3 should be sufficient, particularly since it is those early games where WRPGs and JRPGs were most similar; FF2 even has a keyword system for conversations).

Good to see Undertale on the hist, however.
There are more than what I listed as well. Those were just the ones I saw and recognized at a fast glance in the Index. While I don't believe Dragon Quest is mentioned, the Final Fantasy series certainly is in some of the write-ups of other games. Regardless, though, there are a fair number of Japanese, Korean, and even a couple Chinese games that are in the list, if memory serves (whether you consider them RPGs is another issue).

But no one is going to be completely satisfied with the list, as everyone will have games they think should be there and some they think don't belong there at all.
Btw I don't consider battle for wesnoth an rpg, it's a strategy game. To put it in another way, if battle for wesnoth is an rpg, heroes of Might and Magic 3 is more of an rpg than it
Post edited February 09, 2018 by greeklover
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greeklover: Btw I don't consider battle for wesnoth an rpg, it's a strategy game. To put it in another way, if battle for wesnoth is an rpg, heroes of Might and Magic 3 is more of an rpg than it
Is it a strategy RPG?
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greeklover: Btw I don't consider battle for wesnoth an rpg, it's a strategy game. To put it in another way, if battle for wesnoth is an rpg, heroes of Might and Magic 3 is more of an rpg than it
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Mafwek: Is it a strategy RPG?
I wouldn't say that it has any rpg elements apart from upgrading units
Post edited February 09, 2018 by greeklover
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greeklover: I wouldn't say that itvhas rpg elements apart from upgrading units
Watched some gameplay on YouTube, and I would agree that Heroes have more RPG elements. Though if we go by this logic, Master of Magic and AoW are also RPG-s.

Edit:
Okay, read the review, advance class system and campaigns seems to be main reasons for considering them RPG.
Post edited February 09, 2018 by Mafwek
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Mafwek: Okay, read the review, advance class system and campaigns seems to be main reasons for considering them RPG.
That seems silly; what about RPGs without class systems? (Dragon Wars and Final Fantasy 2 come to mind, but there are many others.)
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dtgreene: That seems silly; what about RPGs without class systems? (Dragon Wars and Final Fantasy 2 come to mind, but there are many others.)
No more silly than calling Ys action games with strong RPG elements...
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mannefriedrich: crpgbook.wordpress.com/2018/02/05/update-19-crpg-book-released

Direct link:
crpgbook.files.wordpress.com/2018/02/crpg_book_1-0-1.pdf
That's really a great read... and so many memories!!!

Heaps of ta to all people involved!
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dtgreene: IMO, do not qualify as I don't see them as RPGs at all
You know... that the problem with you. You have your own definition of the genre, like someone who only calls "blue" a certain shade of blue and insists that all other shades are called "prussian", "royal", "cambridge", "capri"... whatever... and you alone define what's the "true blue". But really it's the other way around. RPGs are blue, and blue is many shades...

Please simple read the book... the very first chapters should be very enlightening: They show that RPG has always been a very loosely defined genre, and even went realtime/ARPG as soon as the hardware could handle it.
Read it last year, so before the release (a few titles were missing).
It become my guide in whole-life plan of crpg-rediscovery adventure.
Wonderful work.

[...]

It has been an overwhelming week! In less than 5 days the CRPG Book got over 100k downloads and it has been a blast to see everyone enjoying it.

Several volunteers appeared to help with proofreading and I’m trying to come up with a good system for this. I’ve also “patched” the book to version 1.0.2, fixing a bunch of typos, grammar mistakes and adding three contributors whose name had been left out.

A lot of people want an ePub version. This is hard to do with such complex layout, but I’ve exported it as well as I could. Please get in touch if you know how to do this better.

ePub Version

Also, some groups are now translating the book to Spanish, German, Russian and Chinese! Besides the translations, a lot of people wanted to print a copy for personal use, make “abridged” versions, or simply check the files to see how the project was made.

So here’s a link to the full InDesign project.

The CRPG Book uses a CC BY-NC 4.0 Creative Commons license, meaning you can use it however you wish – as long as you credit the authors and don’t use it for monetary gain.

Finally, I received a few offers to publish a hardcover version! The idea is to turn it into a charity fundraiser, so I’ll keep everyone updated as things progress.

But for now, I’ll rest a bit. Thanks everyone for an unforgettable week!
crpgbook.wordpress.com/2018/02/10/update-20-thanks-epub-project-files

Hello everyone, I got a few news to share today.

First, I’ve updated the book to version 1.0.4, fixing more typos, fixing issues, updating some reviews (Barkley 2 still had a 2016 release date!) and adding an article about the unreleased RPG Citadel of the Black Sun on page 509.

Second, some people have been making their own physical version of the book:

crpgbook.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/books.jpg

That’s awesome, but it won’t be needed anymore, as I now signed a deal for a limited print of the book – fully proofread and in hardcover! Of course, since this is a non-profit project, we’ll use it as a charity fundraiser! More info on this soon!

However, as part of the hardcover book deal I agreed not to release any more files while the book is being produced & sold. So 1.0.4 will be the last version for a while and I’ll be removing the files in this blog – starting tomorrow! Grab them while you can!

Once the contract ends, things return to normal and I’ll be able to freely share this new & improved version with all of you. I think that’s a fair trade.
Post edited March 01, 2018 by mannefriedrich
Downloading... again :)

Also a suggestion, I would prefer only one entry for games + dlcs. For example I don't want to see Neverwinter Nights 2 and a few pages later the dlc. Why not put them all in one big entry?
Post edited February 10, 2018 by Zadalon
it's too bad that it stops at 2014. I would have enjoyed the reviews of the 2040-2050 era...