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General discussionSecret Hitler #1: Legend of the Cows(1420 posts)(1420 posts)
(1420 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted May 14, 2018
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Lifthrasil:
Will we vote yes or no to this government?
Posted May 14, 2018
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greeklover: 1. We have to avoid a Hitler chancellor .
This is actually untrue. As if we are ever going to elect HItler as Chancellor now is probably the best moment for that. Even if he manages to pass F which he will be obligated to in order not lose the game he will both out himself and get himself term-locked which mean the fascists can't ever win by Chancelloring him. They'll have to go for the long game which is nearly impossible as that would mean we have to get hit twice in a row.


Welcome, ashwald!
Posted May 14, 2018
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Lifthrasil:
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greeklover: Will we vote yes or no to this government?
I would prefer not to discuss that openly this time. Let the fascists show their hand. If they want this government, let them vote yes. If they want to prevent it, let them vote no. They were too long able to coast along by waiting until the liberals have made the decision and then tag along. (Too many unanimous votes).

@ZFR: yes, you could be Hitler. Unlikely, but somewhat possible. You did make quite some waves, but not as much as Scene or RW.

Baseline for my chancellor would still be Brasas. You made an appeal to consider you and I am actually considering it, going back over everything that you wrote and that was written to you and you actually don't seem as scummy as I remembered. If one leaves out your link to RW. Unfortunately you are strongly linked to RW - and he appears scummy as hell. All that aggression following the 4-th liberal policy just screams "Fascist, frustrated because he is losing."
I know that RW is very aggressive from time to time. Both in games and out of it in the regular forum. So perhaps that is just his personality, but still, flipping out like that and then rage-quitting although the words directed at him were less harsh than those he used himself ... that's a bit much. Even for him. So either he's fascist or he suddenly turned into a very, very bad player. The big question is now, is RW a fascist who somehow bagged you and used you? Or are you two fascists together? I'm still in the process of forming a picture.

How about everyone who feels uncomfortable with the Brasas/Me/Greek triangle does the same? Go back over some posts try to form a coherent picture and make a wishlist. Whom should I take as Chancellor and why? Adalia and Scene stated that they would like to be Chancellor, which is obviously true for any player. But who else? I can't promise to follow your advice, but putting arguments for or against other candidates out there is good nonetheless. They say something about you too, after all.
Posted May 14, 2018
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greeklover: 1. We have to avoid a Hitler chancellor .
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dedoporno: This is actually untrue. As if we are ever going to elect HItler as Chancellor now is probably the best moment for that. Even if he manages to pass F which he will be obligated to in order not lose the game he will both out himself and get himself term-locked which mean the fascists can't ever win by Chancelloring him. They'll have to go for the long game which is nearly impossible as that would mean we have to get hit twice in a row.

Welcome, ashwald!
Of course, I meant if a 3rd F passes. I have said before if we are going to test someone, we can only do it now. Nobody reads my posts:(
Posted May 14, 2018
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greeklover: Of course, I meant if a 3rd F passes. I have said before if we are going to test someone, we can only do it now. Nobody reads my posts:(
Yes, I do. And you are right. The next government is the last one where we can test someone. After that the game is either over or we have to avoid a Hitler-Chancellor at all costs. Which is one of the reasons why I consider testing one other chancellors than Brasas. So, is there one of the untested players, where that would make sense?
Posted May 14, 2018
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dedoporno: This is actually untrue. As if we are ever going to elect HItler as Chancellor now is probably the best moment for that. Even if he manages to pass F which he will be obligated to in order not lose the game he will both out himself and get himself term-locked which mean the fascists can't ever win by Chancelloring him. They'll have to go for the long game which is nearly impossible as that would mean we have to get hit twice in a row.

Welcome, ashwald!
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greeklover: Of course, I meant if a 3rd F passes. I have said before if we are going to test someone, we can only do it now. Nobody reads my posts:(
I kindof agree with you. If we want to test something now it's the time. Though if by some chance dedo is F and Brasas is Hitler, the current scene-brasas setup isn't a bad idea since they would be term-locked. Then Lift would have the hard choice of picking chancellor, in which case no offence but I'd rather avoid you too (since Hitler would play exactly like you do). But of course we might win in the next round and then all theories are for naught.
Posted May 14, 2018
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greeklover: Of course, I meant if a 3rd F passes. I have said before if we are going to test someone, we can only do it now. Nobody reads my posts:(
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Lifthrasil: Yes, I do. And you are right. The next government is the last one where we can test someone. After that the game is either over or we have to avoid a Hitler-Chancellor at all costs. Which is one of the reasons why I consider testing one other chancellors than Brasas. So, is there one of the untested players, where that would make sense?
In this case, we vote no to this government since scene nominated brasas.

After that, I want to believe that max one of kusu and blotunga is fascist, so just flip a coin or something. Or we can try scene.

I don't like the fact that Zfr played /positioned himself in a way that lets him advertise now that "he's the furthest possible from Hitler". He is experienced enough to give all the right answers and pass all the tests.
Posted May 15, 2018
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Brasas: I am less likely to be Hitler than anyone else. Not only by virtue of the investigation, but because I have not played "undercover" / typical Liberal.
If I didn't know better I'd say "heh" to that.


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Lifthrasil: I would prefer not to discuss that openly this time. Let the fascists show their hand. If they want this government, let them vote yes. If they want to prevent it, let them vote no. They were too long able to coast along by waiting until the liberals have made the decision and then tag along. (Too many unanimous votes).
.....

How about everyone who feels uncomfortable with the Brasas/Me/Greek triangle does the same? Go back over some posts try to form a coherent picture and make a wishlist. Whom should I take as Chancellor and why? Adalia and Scene stated that they would like to be Chancellor, which is obviously true for any player. But who else? I can't promise to follow your advice, but putting arguments for or against other candidates out there is good nonetheless. They say something about you too, after all.
Scene + Brasas is OK for me. I already said either one is fine for Chancellor in my book, so I don't see a reason why to skip over Scene as President, either. The only thing that I don't really like is that both of them would be term-locked so if worst is to happen and they draw 3F I'll be left without my only 100% trustworthy choice.

@Brasas, what are your thoughts about this gov?
Posted May 15, 2018
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Lifthrasil: @ZFR: yes, you could be Hitler. Unlikely, but somewhat possible.
Baseline for my chancellor would still be Brasas. You made an appeal to consider you and I am actually considering it,
Thanks. I actually asked to be named president after you but I'll welcome the chance to be chancellor too.
Posted May 15, 2018
My preferences for president / chancellor (in order from most desired to least);

adaliabooks
Lifthrasil
ZFR
ashwald
blotunga
kusumahendra
supplementscene
Brasas
dedoporno
greeklover
Posted May 15, 2018
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greeklover: Will we vote yes or no to this government?
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Lifthrasil: I would prefer not to discuss that openly this time. Let the fascists show their hand. If they want this government, let them vote yes. If they want to prevent it, let them vote no. They were too long able to coast along by waiting until the liberals have made the decision and then tag along. (Too many unanimous votes).

@ZFR: yes, you could be Hitler. Unlikely, but somewhat possible. You did make quite some waves, but not as much as Scene or RW.

Baseline for my chancellor would still be Brasas. You made an appeal to consider you and I am actually considering it, going back over everything that you wrote and that was written to you and you actually don't seem as scummy as I remembered. If one leaves out your link to RW. Unfortunately you are strongly linked to RW - and he appears scummy as hell. All that aggression following the 4-th liberal policy just screams "Fascist, frustrated because he is losing."
I know that RW is very aggressive from time to time. Both in games and out of it in the regular forum. So perhaps that is just his personality, but still, flipping out like that and then rage-quitting although the words directed at him were less harsh than those he used himself ... that's a bit much. Even for him. So either he's fascist or he suddenly turned into a very, very bad player. The big question is now, is RW a fascist who somehow bagged you and used you? Or are you two fascists together? I'm still in the process of forming a picture.

How about everyone who feels uncomfortable with the Brasas/Me/Greek triangle does the same? Go back over some posts try to form a coherent picture and make a wishlist. Whom should I take as Chancellor and why? Adalia and Scene stated that they would like to be Chancellor, which is obviously true for any player. But who else? I can't promise to follow your advice, but putting arguments for or against other candidates out there is good nonetheless. They say something about you too, after all.
Wait a moment. Where is the basis for fascist vote yes lib votes no comes from? I vote yes mostly because I think I can trust Brasas not tp fuck us up if he get FL cards
Posted May 15, 2018
CURRENT PROPOSED GOVERNMENT
President: Mr. Scene (supplementscene)
Chancellor: Big Brass (Brasas)

You know the drill. Bring out your votes!
Posted May 15, 2018
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dedoporno: @Brasas, what are your thoughts about this gov?
It comes down to opportunity cost.

I'm overall ok with it, and particularly being in the government makes it tempting.
However, Lift/Brasas seems to me a better option overall and becomes impossible if this goes through.
Then Lift/Greek would also be very strong.

So basically I'm uncertain how big of a risk / opportunity cost it is to vote Yes, versus going with conservative approach and voting it down just because there is better in the near future.

On the other side of the ledger of course is the potential that Lift is blowing something up my ass and has no intention of nominating me - so it's not like there are zero risks from my perspective to voting No.



Overall it hinges on my read of Greek/Lift/Scene - and I do have them all as Liberal.
- Greek I don't like how eager he seems, and how he seems to have these manic moments of excitement, and how he is practically jumping in Lift's pocket. Then I rem this is like his first game, and he did investigate Lift - so he's in same relative position there as you are to me - and I don't see you as in my pocket. So rationally he's likely eager towny and not a very lucky Hitler that got first dibs at the table.
- Scene I don't like how unfocused he is at times, and I'm almost sure there were swings in his prog which are awkward but god knows I don't want to ISO him. His actions in game speak stronger than that "tone" so I can't really pull myself into scum reading him. Maybe that's tunneling on the others... Gun to my head, I am more suspicious of Hitler Scene than of Greek or Lift, but it's a feeling from the gut and very intangible.
- Lift I don't like how neutral he has been overall and I disagree that trapping scum in votes is likely, or our best way forward. We have an advantage that I think calls for openess. He has also opened doors that I almost want to slap him for - like considering ZFR, really? But then Lift at least I have played with before and I can see that as him being himself. He does not tend to be dogmatic, is open minded. The neutrality also is very Lift at his normal meta IMO. And of course he did get investigated, has good track record in actions.

So I list these not as scum reads - I am reading all 3 of them as Liberal, and fairly strong at that, but more in the hope you can offer perspective on these or shake me off conf bias. I don't see anything super strong to influence the vote one way or the other, and see it more going back to the opportunity cost calculation which depends on the future govs composition.
Posted May 15, 2018
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kusumahendra: Wait a moment. Where is the basis for fascist vote yes lib votes no comes from?
Read before you complain. That's not what I wrote. I wrote:

If they want this government, let them vote yes. If they want to prevent it, let them vote no.
It is quite interesting that you read that as 'Fascists vote yes, Liberals vote no'

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kusumahendra: I vote yes mostly because I think I can trust Brasas not tp fuck us up if he get FL cards
Of course. As anyone does. The question is only: who is 'us' in your case and what does fucking up mean for you?

@Brasas: my point, why I suggested less openness is, the fascists know for sure whether this proposed government contains a fascist or not. Say it is Liberal-Liberal, then they have to prevent it. But if enough liberals signal beforehand that they are going to vote No, then the fascists can freely vote whatever they want without sticking out. Same in the case of the other way round: if the proposed government contains a Fascist, the fascists will want to vote Yes. Again, their best play would be to wait until they see whether they have to vote against the mainstream or not. If we don't discuss our votes, we force them to place the vote they really want, because they can't coast along anymore. Does that make sense? I think it does, but maybe I am expressing it badly.
Posted May 15, 2018
Im voting No. I wouldn't trust scene even with me as chancellor.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionSecret Hitler #1: Legend of the Cows(1420 posts)(1420 posts)
(1420 posts)