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paladin181: My argument is, even without consoles, it wouldn't much matter because then you'd still have to cater to mid tier machines.
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Hickory: You still miss the point. I'm talking about innovation not mediocrity. It's why Cyberpunk 2077 will be built for medium end systems, right? /sarcasm.
And what could they innovate so much better if not for console peasants?
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Hickory: You still miss the point. I'm talking about innovation not mediocrity. It's why Cyberpunk 2077 will be built for medium end systems, right? /sarcasm.
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paladin181: And what could they innovate so much better if not for console peasants?
Innovation does not require a 'peasant' influence -- innovation thrives in an elitist environment. But when there are only 'peasants', that's when innovation dies.
To celebrate the 20th anniversary of the NES Mini, Nintendo will release the NES Maxi.
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tinyE: To celebrate the 20th anniversary of the NES Mini, Nintendo will release the NES Maxi.
I was really expecting a Princess Peach decorated liquid absorption pad...
Post edited August 20, 2019 by paladin181
it will be just as borin'
just with more pixels an' more hoops to jump thru

hmmm... nop.

it will be more niche
it will be more expensive
it will be seen as uber elitist
streamin'—teh overall concept of 'rentin''—will have complete lee taken over, re: convenience, in teh majority of forms (movies, tv, games, music)
most people wont care. for right an' for wrong

those that do care will be painted as old-fashioned. an'/or purist

it will be (even) more insular
nay, fanatical
Will we still get 8 bit Indie platformers?

In all seriousness though, I think video games will die as a mainstream hobby, or at least games as we know them. The mobile game mindset has already invaded most major games with microtransactions and such, and while it's a boon for the publishers right now, the fad will die. The average consumers becomes more and more aware of the tricks through the news, governments around the world are trying to restrict not just games but the internet more and more as they become more scared of the unchecked internet society that's developed, etc. etc.

But that might be exactly what PC Gaming needs! So who knows, considering 20 years ago was 1999 which was exactly when my family got their first computer... It's not that different. Games look nicer, internet's faster, we got YouTube, but I am still using a keyboard and mouse that even has the same layout as it did back then. Don't have CDs and DVDs for games anymore (unfortunately), my monitor got wider, resolutions are higher, and building/upgrading PCs got easier, but.... Yeah, still the same deal. There have barely been any game innovations since then too. Deus Ex came out 19 years ago which made the RPG-FPS more popular, open-world games have gotten bigger and more boring, but other than that, not much on that front either.

So in terms of the PC itself, nothing will change. The game market sure will though, this is a sinking ship.
Post edited August 20, 2019 by Karterii1993
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ChristophWr: So how do you think pc gaming is like in 20 years or gaming in general.Since pc will always be the superior platform against anything im pretty sure we are on photorealistic level where you can’t even tell if its real or not.Maybe you can upgrade consoles too who knows which can give you the full pc gaming experience.So what are your thoughts about the future?
First off, I think those naysaying that all games will be streaming only or the majority will be(or that most games will be like fortnite/etc) are fearmongering. I think a good number of games will follow whatever trend is popular at the time and that others will be made to get the money from those who want other types and styles of games....same as now. I also think streaming only will only work in areas with fast internet so it'll be limited and not take off as some think.

As for VR/photorealism.....8K will likely be the limit, what with data storage needs for higher resolutions being too high for current or even next gen storage to hold more than a few games at once, and the human eye cannot discern much difference(most people) beyond that point anyways....and VR will likely be a fad as not many can afford 300-500 dollar headsets and there are so few good games.

I also think the propaganda being pushed will eventually grate on enough people that games WITHOUT a pushed message will become the next niche and wanted product by some people.
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DadJoke007: The only thing I'm sure of is that we'll still be waiting for Half-Life 3.
We will likely get it someday(though whether it will be a continuation of the last episodes or something else/a reboot is anyone's guess).....and many will complain it took too long, is mediocre, etc.
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Leroux: If by then PC gaming as we know it still exists, gamers will reminisce fondly and with nostalgia over the good old days 20 years ago when games were still games and all good, not as dumbed down and shitty as in recent times. They will rant that everything was better back then and mock the youth for never having heard of such great classics as Anthem, Fallout 76, Mass Effect: Andromeda, or Wolfenstein: Youngblood. In newer games they will miss all that cool hardcore stuff from back then, like checkpoints, one-slot autosaves, lootboxes, microtransactions, horse armor DLCs, etc. Fortunately, some indie developers will step up and re-introduce all of it in retro-games that will make you feel just as cozily uncomfortable and happily frustrated as you were back in 2019!
FWIW I loved Mass Effect Andromeda for some aspects(not all...the facial models are a bit jarring esp. for some characters).
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paladin181: Not everyone owns a top end PC. Most gaming PCs on the market can't keep up with current gen consoles because people upgrade their PCs less frequently. They don't nerf solely for the console crowd, they do it for the largest part of the PC gaming market: the middle of the road hardware crowd.
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Hickory: The money is in the console market because that's what people choose, simplicity. Current gen consoles are infinitely inferior to current gen PCS. Fact. Where are publishers and developers going to focus their products? Where the money is. The fact that people don't update their PCs as often is because of the diversity and complexity of the hardware. As stated, people want simplicity so innovation is stifled.
1. Consoles are not THAT inferior to everyone's PC hadrware.

2. They have to make it less bleeding edge when making new consoles to make them affordable....if they used high end parts no one could afford one, or only the richest could.

3. Innovation is fine......when the pendulum swings back then they will complain and those who like PC innovation will be more happy. That's how it goes.
Post edited August 20, 2019 by GameRager
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Hickory: You still miss the point. I'm talking about innovation not mediocrity. It's why Cyberpunk 2077 will be built for medium end systems, right? /sarcasm.
Cyberpunk will be built to sell to as many systems as possible....they are not going to cut out huge swaths of the market just to "innovate"(which seems to mean better graphics and such I guess) and sell to only high end users.

Heck, only a few devs here and there make bleeding edge games to sell to high end systems for whatever reason....most do as I said to make more money.
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Enebias: I'm unsure if humanity will still be around in 20 years, let alone PC gaming!
Humans shouldn’t exist anyway gg
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Damon18: Sadlly the wave of gaming is moving in another direction: I believe you won't own a physical console anymore.
All gaming will be on streaming, and this won't happen in 20 years, but it's already starting now with Google Stadia and the other players of the market I'm afraid will adopt the same philosophy:

Why invest A LOT of money to design, prototype, test and pay lot of engineers to produce a new console, when you can have almost illimited power/resources for your users from the cloud platforms like AWS/Google/Azure?

Furthermore you can tell to your users the gaming they started at home, can be resumed on the train with your laptop and in the office in the toilet with your smartphone..
This is what the martket is starting to offer and the new generations are baited from this

PC will stille be used as working platform, but the market of graphic cards could risk to collapse if you just need a browser to play a 4k game with 7.1 surround audio

Even if I can't say for sure if this will happen, this is what I'm seeing where the game market is moving.
So as 1980 kiddo I'll stuck more to my nostalgic atari 2600/NES and all the other consoles I've

Alternate ending:
I don't know if this will happen soon in your timeline but it'll happen for sure sooner or later, or my name is not John Titor...
Does anyone have an IBM 5100 to lend me? ( :D )
Na media is pushing it because of clicks and because it’s new.There will always be a need for local hardware and the best gaming experience will always be on a gaming pc what is logical so no cloud gaming will maybe another option for casuals but could fail too
Post edited August 20, 2019 by ChristophWr
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Hickory: You still miss the point. I'm talking about innovation not mediocrity. It's why Cyberpunk 2077 will be built for medium end systems, right? /sarcasm.
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GameRager: Cyberpunk will be built to sell to as many systems as possible....they are not going to cut out huge swaths of the market just to "innovate"(which seems to mean better graphics and such I guess) and sell to only high end users.

Heck, only a few devs here and there make bleeding edge games to sell to high end systems for whatever reason....most do as I said to make more money.
Of course it will be built to accommodate as large an audience as possible, but that does not rule out innovation. Just ask the people who won't be able to use the ray-tracing aspect of Cyberpunk.
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Fairfox: it will be just as borin'
just with more pixels an' more hoops to jump thru

hmmm... nop.

it will be more niche
it will be more expensive
it will be seen as uber elitist
streamin'—teh overall concept of 'rentin''—will have complete lee taken over, re: convenience, in teh majority of forms (movies, tv, games, music)
most people wont care. for right an' for wrong

those that do care will be painted as old-fashioned. an'/or purist

it will be (even) more insular
nay, fanatical
Good joke
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BStone: I think the totalitarian State and big corps want to get rid of the PC altogether. The end of ownership.

Like with DRM games today, you will not be able to own a computer. Instead you'll be issues a kiosk (hardware DRM-ed, software DRM-ed), you'll be issued an ID tied to that kiosk enabling you to log into THEIR network, and all "your" games/programs will be located on their servers. Everything you do will be monitored, and if you fall out of line for a moment you can be banned.

That's the direction things are going and why I haven't bothered with a computer upgrade in over 10yrs. A PC is supposed to be a tool. Like a drill-press or a milling machine, you use it to create what you want and need in your life. You don't have to "log on" to it, or call a number to get permission for it to turn on. Or like a record-player: You buy records for it and you play them, your records shoudln't be owned by the producer who only let's listen to them via an internet connection on an account.

And I don't think games are getting any better either. They are becoming "Hollywood": Same churned out crap + politically-correct social-manipulation. The last two modern games I thought looked interesting (but never played them) were Portal 2 and the Arma series.
Yeah maybe some want the end of ownership but hardcore gamers know what is good and if their audience is against they will give us our games like we want them
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ChristophWr: So how do you think pc gaming is like in 20 years or gaming in general.Since pc will always be the superior platform against anything im pretty sure we are on photorealistic level where you can’t even tell if its real or not.Maybe you can upgrade consoles too who knows which can give you the full pc gaming experience.So what are your thoughts about the future?
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GameRager: First off, I think those naysaying that all games will be streaming only or the majority will be(or that most games will be like fortnite/etc) are fearmongering. I think a good number of games will follow whatever trend is popular at the time and that others will be made to get the money from those who want other types and styles of games....same as now. I also think streaming only will only work in areas with fast internet so it'll be limited and not take off as some think.

As for VR/photorealism.....8K will likely be the limit, what with data storage needs for higher resolutions being too high for current or even next gen storage to hold more than a few games at once, and the human eye cannot discern much difference(most people) beyond that point anyways....and VR will likely be a fad as not many can afford 300-500 dollar headsets and there are so few good games.

I also think the propaganda being pushed will eventually grate on enough people that games WITHOUT a pushed message will become the next niche and wanted product by some people.
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DadJoke007: The only thing I'm sure of is that we'll still be waiting for Half-Life 3.
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GameRager: We will likely get it someday(though whether it will be a continuation of the last episodes or something else/a reboot is anyone's guess).....and many will complain it took too long, is mediocre, etc.
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Leroux: If by then PC gaming as we know it still exists, gamers will reminisce fondly and with nostalgia over the good old days 20 years ago when games were still games and all good, not as dumbed down and shitty as in recent times. They will rant that everything was better back then and mock the youth for never having heard of such great classics as Anthem, Fallout 76, Mass Effect: Andromeda, or Wolfenstein: Youngblood. In newer games they will miss all that cool hardcore stuff from back then, like checkpoints, one-slot autosaves, lootboxes, microtransactions, horse armor DLCs, etc. Fortunately, some indie developers will step up and re-introduce all of it in retro-games that will make you feel just as cozily uncomfortable and happily frustrated as you were back in 2019!
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GameRager: FWIW I loved Mass Effect Andromeda for some aspects(not all...the facial models are a bit jarring esp. for some characters).
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Hickory: The money is in the console market because that's what people choose, simplicity. Current gen consoles are infinitely inferior to current gen PCS. Fact. Where are publishers and developers going to focus their products? Where the money is. The fact that people don't update their PCs as often is because of the diversity and complexity of the hardware. As stated, people want simplicity so innovation is stifled.
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GameRager: 1. Consoles are not THAT inferior to everyone's PC hadrware.

2. They have to make it less bleeding edge when making new consoles to make them affordable....if they used high end parts no one could afford one, or only the richest could.

3. Innovation is fine......when the pendulum swings back then they will complain and those who like PC innovation will be more happy. That's how it goes.
It’s like netflix some buy it some using other things and pc gaming will always be superior against streaming with proper hardware of course....streaming got to many downsides
Post edited August 20, 2019 by ChristophWr
The concept for renting games will never exist you have to buy them to stream them....After some time cloud gaming will disappear because someone will come with a better concept but local gaming will always be around
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GameRager: Cyberpunk will be built to sell to as many systems as possible....they are not going to cut out huge swaths of the market just to "innovate"(which seems to mean better graphics and such I guess) and sell to only high end users.

Heck, only a few devs here and there make bleeding edge games to sell to high end systems for whatever reason....most do as I said to make more money.
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Hickory: Of course it will be built to accommodate as large an audience as possible, but that does not rule out innovation. Just ask the people who won't be able to use the ray-tracing aspect of Cyberpunk.
So then they can play a version with less bells and whistles, but as long as they can do so and others can enjoy the extra stuff then both can be happy and innovation can still happen. Take all the games which had optional shadows/colored lighting/etc in years past as examples.

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ChristophWr: It’s like netflix some buy it some using other things and pc gaming will always be superior against streaming with proper hardware of course....streaming got to many downsides
To be fair everything has it's downside....even life/love/etc.

As for streaming.....let people who want it have it(if they even have the internet to be able to play and enjoy it) and the others can enjoy what they want. :)

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ChristophWr: The concept for renting games will never exist you have to buy them to stream them....After some time cloud gaming will disappear because someone will come with a better concept but local gaming will always be around
ALL games are rented if you think about it...even if rented is taken figuratively. Hardware that supports one's games eventually breaks down, people making ports to new hardware only do so for some games, and eventually the original hardware will all be broken/lost.....this is true for PC games and console games.

Also let's not forget the legally questionable EULAs which state one only licenses a game COPY...not owns the game itself.
Post edited August 20, 2019 by GameRager
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GameRager: ALL games are rented if you think about it...even if rented is taken figuratively.
No. Steam and Co are figuratively "rented", since your usage right is tied to the service - when the service is terminated (for you, or in general) you lose the game.
If you buy a physical copy, or buy on GOG and download the backup installer, that single copy is all yours - you own it. Just like you own a vinyl record, even if there are no means to play it any more. Or a combustion engine car, even if in some future there will be no gas available.
What you can't do is make unlicensed copies of the product and spread them. Much like you can't (even if you had the resources) faithfully recreate your Porsche and sell the copies...

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GameRager: Also let's not forget the legally questionable EULAs which state one only licenses a game COPY...not owns the game itself.
Most of these EULAs are not legally binding in Europe, fortunately there is something called "principle of exhaustion" - meaning, once you obtain ownership of a product (you own the COPY), you can do with it with it as you like, as long as it's legal (making illegal copies is not, of course). Microsoft tried to forbid the reselling of the cheap OEM editions of Windows and Office and fell flat with it.
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Hickory: Of course it will be built to accommodate as large an audience as possible, but that does not rule out innovation. Just ask the people who won't be able to use the ray-tracing aspect of Cyberpunk.
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GameRager: So then they can play a version with less bells and whistles, but as long as they can do so and others can enjoy the extra stuff then both can be happy and innovation can still happen. Take all the games which had optional shadows/colored lighting/etc in years past as examples.
So what's your point? Innovation would not happen if it weren't for those who can. With only those who can't, it dies.