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General discussionOffline installers with an option to install GOG Galaxy(1687 posts)(1687 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted July 06, 2017
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Thanks for bearing with us in this thread. We’d like to announce that today we’ve introduced the addition of new installers, with implemented GOG Galaxy client.

Like Destro described it back in May, we decided to separate the „new" and „classic” installers, for your choice. So if you don’t care about the features like achievements or cloud-saves and don’t want to use GOG Galaxy, you can download the „Classic Game Installer", just like it was handled before. For games that have new installers, the default download view on „My account” will show the "GOG Galaxy Game Installers" - you will notice that, as it is visibly described in „My account” game view. To download the „classic” ones, just go to „Options" and choose „Classic Installers”.

The new GOG Galaxy Game Installers were added to +100 games - a selection of all games that make use of GOG Galaxy features. I'll post the current list of games with the new installers in a separate post.
Going forward, all new games that will use GOG Galaxy features, will now receive both GOG Galaxy Game Installer and Classic Game Installer.

Introduction of GOG Galaxy Game Installers doesn’t change anything in terms of keeping the Classic Game Installers up to date. As soon as we receive an update for any game, we will prepare an updated version of the classic installer, just like it was done in the past.

Edit: Pinned.
Post edited July 06, 2017 by fables22
Posted May 11, 2017
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Djaron: it really reminds me about the little educational video against TCPA, that was called "trusted computing"...
you can apply all the ideas and point made there and replace trusted computing with "galaxy" up to the last sentence :)
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Gersen: Well twelve years later TMP or Trusted Computing in general still hasn't killed Linux, hasn't killed open source softwares, hasn't killed piracy, hasn't locked down Windows preventing unsigned software to run, and in general most of the fears/theories linked to TMP never came to be. Not sure if it's really the best example to use to prove your point.
It's not about what you could direct see and more about what you're not supposed to see. Have a look at the infrastructure on modern mainboards, the possible alternatives (the UEFI-crap in common) and things Intel or AMD enforce you to use. Some example? The Intel Management Engine: https://libreboot.org/faq.html#intel

But yeah, go on. :)

What I find interesting here in this thread are the all-time relativisations from some participants: In fact offline-installers are the only way to get a complete backup to be installed whenever, however and whereever the user wants. Everything else? A false compromise, but indeed: Files come up from the "Internet", so they'll be available all the time, of course not ... but you can try argument that way. And after repeating this more than a thousand time again, it won't become truth.
Post edited May 11, 2017 by throgh
Posted May 11, 2017
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throgh: It's not about what you could direct see and more about what you're not supposed to see. Have a look at the infrastructure on modern mainboards, the possible alternatives (the UEFI-crap in common) and things Intel or AMD enforce you to use. Some example? The Intel Management Engine: https://libreboot.org/faq.html#intel
Again it's mostly it's thing that "could" happen, things that "could" be abused. I am not saying to not be vigilant about it, just that as an example of thing going wrong this was a very poorly chosen one.
Posted May 11, 2017
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P1na: I do, of course I do. I'd appreciate you didn't assume I'm incapable of reading comprehension, I'll have you know GOG considers me qualified to untick a checkbox every time I install a game. I'm a very intellectually advanced person, a high level customer.
I never assumed anything such... some people think there is an inheritable difference in the files you get from Galaxy compared to the files you get with a standalone installer. I was just pointing it out, that there isn't.

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P1na: First, you are not required to understand. What each person considers valuable is different, and if I think the offline installer is the ONLY thing that makes it worth it to buy GOG, that's my own take and I don't need to give any explanation to anyone.
Never said you did... I think its in my prerogative to question something if I so choose though. Doesn't mean you owe me any explanation, but you did ask the question.

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P1na: That said, I find them very nice, specially those that don't have extra bin files and it's just a single file. Having them all on a folder, where I just need to double click to install the game on any computer I connect my HD bunker to, is essentially a wet dream for me. Sure I could for example copy all the installed files and make a rar of them, but I find that really dirty. That's why I prefer buying GOG over Humble. Or did, anyway.
And there is nothing wrong with that... but if were talking purely from a game preservation stand point (as you seem to have indicated in your original question), the standalone installers being part of that equation is irrelevant, that's all I'm saying. That's not a question of how nice they are to have, they are pretty useful sure.


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P1na: Sure, they could do that. So long as they give me an option to get an offline installer somehow, without unwanted crap on it, I'm fine. But that's precisely what they're taking away.
I'm just saying GOG can easily do that with or without standalone installers... with or without Galaxy being needed, if we are talking purely about game preservation. What GOG ends up doing is another matter though.
Posted May 11, 2017
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throgh: It's not about what you could direct see and more about what you're not supposed to see. Have a look at the infrastructure on modern mainboards, the possible alternatives (the UEFI-crap in common) and things Intel or AMD enforce you to use. Some example? The Intel Management Engine: https://libreboot.org/faq.html#intel
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Gersen: Again it's mostly it's thing that "could" happen, things that "could" be abused. I am not saying to not be vigilant about it, just that as an example of thing going wrong this was a very poorly chosen one.
No it is exactly a good one, but as I've said above: You're using relativisations all the time, again and again. Same as BKGaming here: Because it can happen, it also will happen. That's the point! It's only the question: When? And perhaps: How? But you can go on with that. I won't! :-) Better to step away from this and have a good time left until tomorrow. The show here is a good one. ;-)
Posted May 11, 2017
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Fairfox: basjehik nlosikeurs lweikjr slejhro or something to that effect
If you can't be arsed to write something legible, I can't be arsed to read it.
Post edited May 11, 2017 by Breja
Posted May 11, 2017
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throgh: In fact offline-installers are the only way to get a complete backup to be installed whenever, however and whereever the user wants. Everything else?
So if I provide you a zip file on the site with an install script with all the game files... your not getting a complete backup to be installed whenever, however and wherever the user wants?

Hmmm, I'm pretty sure you can. Just saying, there is always more than one way to do things. How practical or easy to use they are is another matter.
Post edited May 11, 2017 by BKGaming
Posted May 11, 2017
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BKGaming: I'm just saying GOG can easily do that with or without standalone installers... with or without Galaxy being needed, if we are talking purely about game preservation. What GOG ends up doing is another matter though.
And I'm just saying that poluting offline installers, the one way they currently offer to keep a game in storage, with bloatware is a serious hit on the flotation line of the trust I had on GOG respecting those installers. It's the moment to cut your loses, store those installers in the basement, and wield your cane to make sure no kid gets on your lawn and touches them.

It's the moment you lose the confidence that buying GOG is the best way to future proof your purchases, and therefore GOG products lose a sizeable chunk of their value.
Posted May 11, 2017
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throgh: In fact offline-installers are the only way to get a complete backup to be installed whenever, however and whereever the user wants. Everything else?
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BKGaming: So if I provide you a zip file on the site with an install script with all the game files... your not getting a complete backup to be installed whenever, however and wherever the user wants?

Hmmm, I'm pretty sure you can. Just saying, there is always more than one way to do things. How practical or easy to use they are is another matter.
No? Won't use it until known what needed and what packages to install. That's the problem with your shortened view on those things. Fitting the platform! ;) And also know why some error messages come up.
Posted May 11, 2017
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P1na: And I'm just saying that poluting offline installers, the one way they currently offer to keep a game in storage, with bloatware is a serious hit on the flotation line of the trust I had on GOG respecting those installers. It's the moment to cut your loses, store those installers in the basement, and wield your cane to make sure no kid gets on your lawn and touches them.

It's the moment you lose the confidence that buying GOG is the best way to future proof your purchases, and therefore GOG products lose a sizeable chunk of their value.
Then it comes down to where do you draw the line? I'm personally nowhere near the line, even if I think this ideal is less than stellar. GOG still has a lot more value in this area than Steam, consoles, or any other of the major players here, but yea each of us has to decide where that line is.

It may bloat the installers and complicate the matter but the installers would still carry out the relevant function of installing games free of anything else just fine.
Posted May 11, 2017
high rated
Anyone want some popcorn? This is a good show. :)

GOG: We know it won't work, but we want to do it anyway because a general population of our users are stupid. And we're using these stupid people as a blanket to push Galaxy down more users' throats based on our marketing staff determining that if it's pre-checked then most users will ignore or miss it it, thus increasing the Galaxy userbase dramatically without extra effort from us. That's what our bosses/"empty suits" want from us anyway. But we'll pretend it's just for everyone's good.

Users: We see what you did there. Stop being corporate shills.
Posted May 11, 2017
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MaximumBunny: Anyone want some popcorn? This is a good show. :)
I'd like to take one portion. Sitting next to you. :)
Really a good show, isn't it? To see how some people here defend the politics from GOG even to the end of whatever. There is enough proof, even a plan for the next years with a concrete mission-statemen and GOG does everything "correct". Snow jobs at the best.
Posted May 11, 2017
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throgh: No? Won't use it until known what needed and what packages to install. That's the problem with your shortened view on those things. Fitting the platform! ;) And also know why some error messages come up.
And that would be up to GOG who would write the script to account for that... no shortened view needed. They actually are already doing this in Galaxy I believe, because it looks like Galaxy runs a small script after installation to handle this. So in theory if correct, they basically would just make that script usable outside of Galaxy. I assume they will do something similar on Linux.

GOG floated the idea, I assume they have already thought about all of this... my point still remains, you can still do what you are asking without standalone installed. It is certainly possible.
Post edited May 11, 2017 by BKGaming
Posted May 11, 2017
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BKGaming: Then it comes down to where do you draw the line? I'm personally nowhere near the line, even if I think this ideal is less than stellar. GOG still has a lot more value in this area than Steam, consoles, or any other of the major players here, but yea each of us has to decide where that line is.

It may bloat the installers and complicate the matter but the installers would still carry out the relevant function of installing games free of anything else just fine.
Yup, that's indeed part of it. I said months (or years) ago that my personal line was the moment regional locking didn't just limit my ability to purchase games and instead limited my ability to actually play them, but I never thought they would actually mess with the installers. That was the most basic thing for me, a core mechanic of GOG that was never in question. The fact that it now is makes any purchase here worth less, although I'll grant you it may still be higher than in many other places; but for instance buying on steam means my friends can play too since I use family sharing and that also has value.

The other part of it is the bullshit way it was presented to us. "guys, you really don't understand, it makes things better for stupid people". We do understand, that is precisely the problem. GOG could address our concerns instead of assuming we don't understand their words and ignores us while keeps hammering how good it will be for other people. There is no such thing as convenience for everyone, and a decision needs to be taken on who takes priority. The fact that some idiot incapable of installing galaxy yet somehow capable of installing a game is more important to GOG than people who have already bought hundreds of games here does hurt; and the fact that GOG insults our intelligence while doing so hurts even more. I don't enjoy being insulted.
Posted May 11, 2017
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BKGaming: And that would be up to GOG who would write the script to account for that... no shortened view needed. They actually are already doing this in Galaxy I believe, because it looks like Galaxy runs a small script after installation to handle this. So in theory if correct, they basically would just make that script usable outside of Galaxy. I assume they will do something similar on Linux.

GOG floated the idea, I assume they have already though about all of this... my point still remains, you can still do what you are asking without standalone installed. It is certainly possible.
And that's the other argument I've told you again and again: I don't need any client to manage my licenses and my software installations. I do it myself and I will do this! When GOG thinks their userbase is not competent enough for this ... they should stop selling the games immediately. The freedom of choice remains and my choice: NO GALAXY WITHIN THE INSTALLER, NO BLOATWARE TO DOWNLOAD. If I choose this crap one day, I'll do it myself. Nothing more. And I won't choose this, even not on Linux. I don't wait for this crappy software to be published. Why should I install even more proprietary packages?

And just for the records: The lie is again to see. GOG tells us even within their plans that Galaxy uses proprietary technologies. But on the other hand they seem to have no problem with on open implementation? Yeah, of course ... tell me more, GOG. How should we implement that? Only with reverse engineering, and ... howdy ... that's illegal in many countries. And you could even claim the software published on Github with source-code therefore. How practical. ;)
Posted May 11, 2017
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BKGaming: Then it comes down to where do you draw the line? I'm personally nowhere near the line, even if I think this ideal is less than stellar. GOG still has a lot more value in this area than Steam, consoles, or any other of the major players here, but yea each of us has to decide where that line is.
That's what I thought before I saw this announcement: I'm nowhere near the line to ditch GOG. Now the line seems to be crossed. However, I still think that Steam and consoles are clearly more unacceptable. (I didn't even like Steam but the reason why I fled Steam and never returned was that they didn't inform me properly about third-party DRM. I don't think GOG could ever sink so low that it would be better to support Steam instead.)

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P1na: Yup, that's indeed part of it. I said months (or years) ago that my personal line was the moment regional locking didn't just limit my ability to purchase games and instead limited my ability to actually play them, but I never thought they would actually mess with the installers. That was the most basic thing for me, a core mechanic of GOG that was never in question. The fact that it now is makes any purchase here worth less, although I'll grant you it may still be higher than in many other places; but for instance buying on steam means my friends can play too since I use family sharing and that also has value.
Wow, I agree so much with everything you wrote. I guess, there's a lot of us who thought it would take years for the line to be crossed because we couldn't imagine GOG being so stupid (or their average customer for that matter).
Post edited May 11, 2017 by 0Grapher
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionOffline installers with an option to install GOG Galaxy(1687 posts)(1687 posts)
(1687 posts)