Posted April 10, 2023
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
MysterD
OLD User
Registered: Sep 2008
From United States
Posted April 11, 2023
No way.
Like most companies - they'd rather sit on the IP they own, do nothing, and let it rot...than let someone else try to damage the brand and/or do anything successful with it.
Also, what's to stop American McGee from hooking up w/ another AAA publisher, throwing this same pitch, change the IP name to something else & new, and get this made? Sure, it'll be tough - since I don't think Alice 1 and 2 did numbers and sales - but, maybe he could get lucky w/ someone? [shrug]
Also, I think Square sold off a lot of their Western stuff (to Embracer) so they can try to sell a lot of their own stuff to Sony, which I'll still waiting on here, for better and/or worse...
It's not that simple as changing the brand. If people want to see more of THAT Alice, then they want to see more of that Alice. A different story with the same gameplay is not going to satisfy that. There are already plenty of other 3rd person action platformers out there and yet people still want Alice.
Dragon Age: Origins plays exactly like KOTOR, but it is still not KOTOR 3.
This game's too niche - it didn't really do blockbuster numbers, last 2 times around.
Do I really think EA would spend that kind of money on this? No, they seem to interesting what they think will be ridiculously obvious money-makers like Battlefield, Star Wars, FIFA, Madden, etc.
I'd probably have a better chance of winning the lottery than seeing say Jade Empire 2, Titanfall 3 and Alice 3.
It'd probably take someone like to Microsoft to want to do that Alice game w/ McGee and a company of that sort to say take the IP for insane $ for something like this to happen, for McGee to get Alice 3.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by MysterD
Pax-Christi
New User
Registered: Aug 2022
From Canada
Posted April 11, 2023
There's no point begging a corporation like EA, it's better to just start fresh and push forward.
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EA turning down McGee's Alice: Asylum might have to do with the estimated budget of 50 Million USD to cover development cost. Marketing, licensing and miscellaneous costs to release and publish are not included.
Tokyo_Bunny_8990
New User
Registered: Jul 2021
From Japan
Posted April 11, 2023
Heard about this game but isnt it a very niche game tbh?
EA did plan on a movie adaptation which got shelved but given the fact that video game adaptations are now becoming more popular and viable (The Last of Us show, Super Mario movie, Sonic movie), I can see EA wanting to give it another go which is why they dont want to let go of the IP.
McGee definately tried creating the conclusion to his trilogy with otherworld and asylum but it seems the demand just wasnt there. Cant really fault EA to want to focus on more lucrative IPs.
EA did plan on a movie adaptation which got shelved but given the fact that video game adaptations are now becoming more popular and viable (The Last of Us show, Super Mario movie, Sonic movie), I can see EA wanting to give it another go which is why they dont want to let go of the IP.
McGee definately tried creating the conclusion to his trilogy with otherworld and asylum but it seems the demand just wasnt there. Cant really fault EA to want to focus on more lucrative IPs.
SargonAelther
Pls add Offline Installers for My Rewards!
Registered: Dec 2013
From Other
Posted April 11, 2023
For a game so "niche", it certainly always managed to gain a lot of attention among the player base and the gaming media.
Demand isn't there? People literally threw money at a mere design bible for the game! How much more demand do you want from an unannounced and unsanctioned game? Sanction it, develop it, announce it and then, due to awareness, the fan base will grow.
Demand isn't there? People literally threw money at a mere design bible for the game! How much more demand do you want from an unannounced and unsanctioned game? Sanction it, develop it, announce it and then, due to awareness, the fan base will grow.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by SargonAelther
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
Posted April 11, 2023
The sales were not incredibly high.
But I think the main reason were of legal nature. The first part had to be pulled from stores in certain regions
AMG was not all too pleased with how EA handled the whole thing. And he actually stated at some point, that he had no interest in working in this area again - contradicting his statement quoted earlier. He thought that more money could have been made with a online free to play variation of the game and according to that statement he didn't want to create another single player game sold on physical media.
Did he really try to make a sequel? We don't know, we only have his word for it.
SargonAelther
Pls add Offline Installers for My Rewards!
Registered: Dec 2013
From Other
Posted April 11, 2023
The game is not sold separatly, neither are collections and the description of keys from keysellers say that they won't activate in Italy.
I have the DVD versions of the games, so I don't realyl have a problem, but I wanted to buy the game on Origin to have a complete collection, no luck for me.
The sales were not incredibly high.
But I think the main reason were of legal nature. The first part had to be pulled from stores in certain regions
AMG was not all too pleased with how EA handled the whole thing. And he actually stated at some point, that he had no interest in working in this area again - contradicting his statement quoted earlier. He thought that more money could have been made with a online free to play variation of the game and according to that statement he didn't want to create another single player game sold on physical media.
Did he really try to make a sequel? We don't know, we only have his word for it.
We already know that F2P games make loads of money, that doesn't mean that we should abandon proper single player games. In terms of "Contradicting statements", people can and do change minds.
Yes he was planning on making a prequel. I trust his word far more than of this utterly disgusting company that you seem to eagerly defend.
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
Posted April 11, 2023
Not grammar but your perception of time.
It's not about YOU knowing f2p makes a lot of money. It's about McGee knowing that and saying that that's one of the reason he didn't want to make a sequel at that time.
If he wants to do that now ... that's another story. But it was brought up as if he wanted to do that right after part 2, which according to other statements is just not true.
I suspect, the reason for it is probably because he's not making enough money anymore with f2p.
SargonAelther: Part one is not available ANYWHERE digitally. EA just love delisting games for no reason, just like they delisted Syndicate 2012. That's not true, you can buy a collection of part 1 and 2 on Origin. Only by using a VPN I could see that collection in the EA store. Key sellers sold the keys of course as well, with a note that these won't avrivate in all regions (mine being one of the excluded ones of course).
And yes, I would have loved a sequel too. If I didn't like the games, I would not have bought the CD versions. But it's not happening and EA are definitly not the only ones to blame. It's not the little dev vs the big corporation, it's a business decision made by both parties.
It's not about YOU knowing f2p makes a lot of money. It's about McGee knowing that and saying that that's one of the reason he didn't want to make a sequel at that time.
If he wants to do that now ... that's another story. But it was brought up as if he wanted to do that right after part 2, which according to other statements is just not true.
I suspect, the reason for it is probably because he's not making enough money anymore with f2p.
And yes, I would have loved a sequel too. If I didn't like the games, I would not have bought the CD versions. But it's not happening and EA are definitly not the only ones to blame. It's not the little dev vs the big corporation, it's a business decision made by both parties.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by neumi5694
SargonAelther
Pls add Offline Installers for My Rewards!
Registered: Dec 2013
From Other
Posted April 11, 2023
American's "business decision" was to make a prequel. It was EA that denied it. It is EA that won't sell the first game. It is EA that won't sell or license the IP.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by SargonAelther
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
Posted April 11, 2023
Edit: Sorry, my bad. It was not a couple of months ago, but way earlier, must have been before the end of 2021
I remember buying Alice 2 on XBox 360 shortly after. Just found the receipt.
And I'm probably mixing up something, could be that I saw the collection in the humble store.
Anyway ... since these keys could be activated in certain regions and not in others, it means that they did NOT stop to sell it everywhere at the same time.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by neumi5694
Tokyo_Bunny_8990
New User
Registered: Jul 2021
From Japan
Posted April 11, 2023
The first Alice had a budget of $4.5 million and shipped 1.5 million copies. This is good and was considered a commercial success which is why they greenlit a sequel. Sequel budget ballooned to $9 million and there is no data on sales but we can easily assume it needed to ship at least 3 million to be considered a similar success to the first. Not sure how accurate VGChartz is but assuming it is, total sales for PS3, 360, and PC is 0.59, 0.5, and 0.12m respectively for 1.21 million copies sold which is less than the original. It makes sense for EA to not move forward.
To be fair, PC sales seem insanely low given the fact that the first was PC only and still pushed 1.5m. But even if we assume every player who bought 1 on PC also bought 2, we still only get 2.59 million which is still 0.4m shy of the 3 million to consider the game an equivalent success to the first due to the doubled budget.
Im guessing you are talking about the Otherlands project? It did raise $222,000 against a $200,000 goal which means it exceeded it but also only had 3,389 backers which means each backer put in about $65 on average for a graphic book and short film. While this could be representative that there is demand, it could also just mean that Alice has a cult-following of diehard fans who want more but not necessarily wide appeal which EA needs to greenlight a new game for mass production unless you want Alice to recoup costs through whales (DLC, MTX).
Im not saying Alice is a bad game. There are many amazing games that dont get the attention they deserve and dont get a deserved sequel while there are many bad games that get sequel after sequel because the general audience is just dumb (looking at you every EA sports game and CoD/Battlefield fan). Unfortunately, the market decides.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by Tokyo_Bunny_8990
SargonAelther
Pls add Offline Installers for My Rewards!
Registered: Dec 2013
From Other
Posted April 11, 2023
Edit: Sorry, my bad. It was not a couple of months ago, but way earlier, must have been before the end of 2021
I remember buying Alice 2 on XBox 360 shortly after. Just found the receipt.
And I'm probably mixing up something, could be that I saw the collection in the humble store.
Anyway ... since these keys could be activated in certain regions and not in others, it means that they did NOT stop to sell it everywhere at the same time.
Yes, Humble Bundle held onto some keys for a long while, however by the time I got aware of that, I was too late. The only remaining keys are in the US, from stores that annoyingly demand a US postal code and / or US phone number just to be able to create an account.
There was no reason to delist this. EA are just scum. Money is the only thing that matters to them and they do not even attempt to pretend that it's not.
Games are art. They deserve to be treated to a higher standard than some stupid office application. Companies that treat their games as nothing more than a mere product are all scum and their CEOs need to be booted without a benefit package.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by SargonAelther
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
Posted April 11, 2023
The point was that it had to be delisted for "some" reason there and not in the rest of the world and the reason for that is usually a legal aspect.
Why it's gone everywhere now? Who knows, but maybe it's the same reason.
How do you know? Did EA explain to you why they did so?
They don't pull something off the market if it makes profit unless they have to (they even still sell Syndicate). We all agree there: They are a greedy bunch and greedy people will always try to make more money.
SargonAelther
Pls add Offline Installers for My Rewards!
Registered: Dec 2013
From Other
Posted April 11, 2023
The first Alice had a budget of $4.5 million and shipped 1.5 million copies. This is good and was considered a commercial success which is why they greenlit a sequel. Sequel budget ballooned to $9 million and there is no data on sales but we can easily assume it needed to ship at least 3 million to be considered a similar success to the first. Not sure how accurate VGChartz is but assuming it is, total sales for PS3, 360, and PC is 0.59, 0.5, and 0.12m respectively for 1.21 million copies sold which is less than the original. It makes sense for EA to not move forward.
To be fair, PC sales seem insanely low given the fact that the first was PC only and still pushed 1.5m. But even if we assume every player who bought 1 on PC also bought 2, we still only get 2.59 million which is still 0.4m shy of the 3 million to consider the game an equivalent success to the first due to the doubled budget.
Im guessing you are talking about the Otherlands project? It did raise $222,000 against a $200,000 goal which means it exceeded it but also only had 3,389 backers which means each backer put in about $65 on average for a graphic book and short film. While this could be representative that there is demand, it could also just mean that Alice has a cult-following of diehard fans who want more but not necessarily wide appeal which EA needs to greenlight a new game for mass production unless you want Alice to recoup costs through whales (DLC, MTX).
Im not saying Alice is a bad game. There are many amazing games that dont get the attention they deserve and dont get a deserved sequel while there are many bad games that get sequel after sequel because the general audience is just dumb (looking at you every EA sports game and CoD/Battlefield fan). Unfortunately, the market decides.
We don't know what the sales of the sequel are, or how up to date 3rd party estimates may be, so I am not going to comment.
I am not talking about Otherlands. I am talking about the Alice Asylum design bible that was on patreon.
They don't pull something off the market if it makes profit unless they have to (they even still sell Syndicate). We all agree there: They are a greedy bunch and greedy people will always try to make more money.
They did not provide a reason to ANYONE, meaning there isn't a good one. It was not some multiplayer game, demanding a dedicated server. There's no licensed music or licensed cars in there. Low sales are not a good reason to delist something. Some sales are still better than no sales. It's not like those 10GB on their storage server were costing them that much. They still sell the standard edition of the sequel, which is still about 8.5 GB.
Certainly the complete edition was far more appealing. The bundled 1st game was also slightly remastered, compared to the original CD version. There are many calls to put the game back on sale.
Post edited April 11, 2023 by SargonAelther
neumi5694
Survived the human apocalypse
Registered: May 2011
From Italy
Posted April 11, 2023
I remain at my opinion that they had some legal issues however, maybe even the simple fact that McGees name was in the title.