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General discussionMeanwhile in Köln/Cologne.... (warning: politics inside)(569 posts) (569 posts) 
(569 posts) 
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This is my favourite topic
Posted January 05, 2016
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catpower1980: Bizzarely, in Belgium we only go to Köln for the Oktoberfest, what's so special about this carnival? Bigger event/crowd than in Berlin?
There's no 'carnival' in Berlin. Not this kind. Not the Weiberfastnacht to Aschermittwoch kind of carnival.

These are more local events in that general Southern area of Germany, some federal states and cities we literally call "carnival strongholds". The events come with a strange kind of tradition and an absurd pride in the amount of alcohol consumed. In short, it's an all age group binge drinking festival with a bit of silly costume and dated jokes on top.

I'm not a big fan. :p

Actually, a friend of mine who's from the North originally - Hanover - lives in one of those strongholds. She tries to be out of town each year. We call people like her – again, a literal translation – a carnival refugee.
Post edited January 07, 2016 by Vainamoinen
Posted January 05, 2016
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Tarm: No medieval.
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WBGhiro: You're right the cleavage is still safe. Condolences to all the leg men though
It's important to get the specific regression named right.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Tarm: It's important to get the specific regression named right.
Sometimes i just get too excited on the doomsaying and get ahead of myself, sorry.
Post edited January 05, 2016 by WBGhiro
Posted January 05, 2016
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Tarm: It's important to get the specific regression named right.
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WBGhiro: Sometimes i just get to excited on the doomsaying and get ahead of myself, sorry.
You don't get that right you can't fight it the correct way. :)
Posted January 05, 2016
Mmh... what does migrants committing violence has anything to do with Poland censoring its own press ?`Because I can't find any logical link between these two facts.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Narakir: Mmh... what does migrants committing violence has anything to do with Poland censoring its own press ?`Because I can't find any logical link between these two facts.
Censoring and more state control of information can use fear in the general public for immigrants as a excuse. Generally speaking fear of any kind in the general public is one of the most used tools for states that want to get more power.

Not saying I agree here just that there is a logical link.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Vainamoinen: Oh, Cologne. It's all about the carnival. *sigh*
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catpower1980: Bizzarely, in Belgium we only go to Köln for the Oktoberfest, what's so special about this carnival? Bigger event/crowd than in Berlin?
Well, I guess you don`t mean Köln, when you say "Oktoberfest"! The Wies`n (Oktoberfest) is only happening in Munich (Bavarian Empire), not in any other town of the Bavarian colonies!!!
Posted January 05, 2016
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Narakir: Mmh... what does migrants committing violence has anything to do with Poland censoring its own press ?`Because I can't find any logical link between these two facts.
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Tarm: Censoring and more state control of information can use fear in the general public for immigrants as a excuse. Generally speaking fear of any kind in the general public is one of the most used tools for states that want to get more power.

Not saying I agree here just that there is a logical link.
Eh isn't it already the case ? I mean just watch the news and try to see if there's something positive about anything.
Post edited January 05, 2016 by Narakir
Posted January 05, 2016
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immi101: uh, how do you expect us to check your vague "somewhere around here a supermarkt was closed"-story?
c'mon, give us some details ...
jamyskis wished me dead not long ago out of some radical extremist hissy fit.
Do you really expect me to dive deeper into my personal life and environment here? I really don't feel like it anymore.

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Narakir: Mmh... what does migrants committing violence has anything to do with Poland censoring its own press ?`Because I can't find any logical link between these two facts.
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Tarm: Censoring and more state control of information can use fear in the general public for immigrants as a excuse. Generally speaking fear of any kind in the general public is one of the most used tools for states that want to get more power.

Not saying I agree here just that there is a logical link.
Yep, fear is a common tool and easy to combine with denunciation of opposite opinions.
Poland currently is like "Beware, the foreigners are coming!" and Germany is like "Beware, the Nazis are coming!".
Claiming to see "Nazis" is the usual way of denunciation here. From what I gathered, only a small percentage of Pegida are actually NPD guys while the rest is a mixed bag of atheists not wanting even more religion around, humanists not liking muslimic philosophy, christians not wanting more competition and people that think there is already too much parallel culture, but it's more convenient to say "Pegida are all Nazis!" and for the other side "Immigrants are all rapists and thieves!". The sad thing is, that people just don't notice the similarity of this.

The problem is, that such cloudy dogmatic thinking won't give anyone the possibility to see actual local problems and some cannot be solved simply because they are ignored for the greater good.
Post edited January 05, 2016 by Klumpen0815
Posted January 05, 2016
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Tarm: Censoring and more state control of information can use fear in the general public for immigrants as a excuse. Generally speaking fear of any kind in the general public is one of the most used tools for states that want to get more power.

Not saying I agree here just that there is a logical link.
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Narakir: Eh isn't it already the case ? I mean just watch the news and try to see if there's something positive about anything.
Yes maybe? All I said was that there is a logical link like you asked for.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Tarm: Censoring and more state control of information can use fear in the general public for immigrants as a excuse. Generally speaking fear of any kind in the general public is one of the most used tools for states that want to get more power.

Not saying I agree here just that there is a logical link.
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Klumpen0815: Yep, fear is a common tool and easy to combine with denunciation of opposite opinions.
Poland currently is like "Beware, the foreigners are coming!" and Germany is like "Beware, the Nazis are coming!".
Claiming to see "Nazis" is the usual way of denunciation here, from what I gathered, only a small percentage of those Pegida types are actually NPD guys while the rest is a mixed bag of atheists not wanting even more religion around, humanists not liking muslimic philosophy, christians not wanting more competition and people that think there is already too much parallel culture, but it's more convenient to say "Pegida are all Nazis!" and for the other side "Immigrants are all rapists and thieves!". The sad thing is, that people just don't notice the similarity of this.

The problem is, that such cloudy dogmatic thinking won't give anyone the possibility to see actual local problems and some cannot be solved simply because they are ignored for the greater good.
Yep, "Nazi" became a Totschlagargument (don`t know the english word) which one can use to kill all meanings one doesn`t like. You don`t have to prove somebody wrong or your own opinion to be right, it`s enuff to say someone is a Nazi or that a Nazi said this thing before, and your opponent is automatically on the wrong side of the meaning border, and nothing he says will be taken in account anymore, since common agreement is, that everything a so called Nazi says is not worth to be discussed.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Klumpen0815: Claiming to see "Nazis" is the usual way of denunciation here, from what I gathered, only a small percentage of those Pegida types are actually NPD guys while the rest is a mixed bag of atheists not wanting even more religion around, humanists not liking muslimic philosophy, christians not wanting more competition and people that think there is already too much parallel culture, but it's more convenient to say "Pegida are all Nazis!" and for the other side "Immigrants are all rapists and thieves!". The sad thing is, that people just don't notice the similarity of this.
I think you are wrong here. In the beginning PEGIDA and it's various branches might have been the mixture you described, but very soon the Neo-Nazis took over and by now most of the people there can clearly be described as racists and Nazis. You just have to look at the leaders and the speakers and investigate their connections to racist parties (especially the NPD and Die Rechte).
Posted January 05, 2016
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catpower1980: Bizzarely, in Belgium we only go to Köln for the Oktoberfest, what's so special about this carnival? Bigger event/crowd than in Berlin?
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Vainamoinen: There's no 'carnival' in Berlin. Not this kind. Not the Weiberfastnacht to Aschermittwoch kind of carnival.

These are more local events in that general Southern area of Germany, some federal states and cities we literally call "carnival strongholds". The events come with a strange kind of tradition and an absurd pride in the amount of alcohol consumed. In short, it's an all age group binge drinking festival with a bit of silly costume and dated jokes on top.
I checked my old Germany travelling guide to get some infos and apparently I should run around yelling "Alaaf" :o)

Well at this period we also have a big carnival in southern Belgium with a few days full of parties and drinking. Difference is that at least we have some traditional folklore where costumed men with ostrich feathers on their head throw oranges around ^o^ (google "gilles de binche" for pictures)
Posted January 05, 2016
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PaterAlf: I think you are wrong here. In the beginning PEGIDA and it's various branches might have been the mixture you described, but very soon the Neo-Nazis took over and by now most of the people there can clearly be described as racists and Nazis. You just have to look at the leaders and the speakers and investigate their connections to racist parties (especially the NPD and Die Rechte).
Maybe that's the case, because they were denunciated as Nazis from the beginning, leaving little room for any other group in this bag, because nobody wants to be associated with them (apart from themselves of course).
Divide and conquer.
Posted January 05, 2016
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Rincewind81: Get your facts straigt. You are using Breitbart(!) as a valid source
it was the only English-speaking available source when I woke up in the morning. I then edited the OP with a BBC article ;)
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionMeanwhile in Köln/Cologne.... (warning: politics inside)(569 posts) (569 posts) 
(569 posts)