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General discussionMade in Europe grouping please?(85 posts)(85 posts)
(85 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted March 13, 2025

Yes all of this is nice and fine. But you also get some users here with "what aboutism" asking what about us who want games made in *insert my country* , made by *insert gender or race*. In the end it will just divide gaming into this. Some dude already said I only buy games made in Europe... then you can even go more political, which countries are Europe, EU or not, does UK go there and Russia and Turkey etc. So I can already see everyone wanting their own to be represented in gaming.
Usually when someone in an argument throws up a bit of what-about-ary - its because their argument against the proposition is very weak indeed. When that doesn't work, they get angry and start behaving inappropriately.

The truth is, all I have requested is a country of origin tag, specifically for Europe. But if feasible why not have a tag per country? It's just metadata, and makes it easier to search for stuff that I will then buy.

I do the same thing in the supermarket. I live in Scotland, and to ensure I have the most local produce available, I buy Scottish produce (beef, pork, etc). I buy bread in the same way. Why is it such a problem to do the same for video games? My gut feel is that those against the idea, know that their country might be a location that I won't buy from.

So what? I'm just one Whale who spends a silly amount of money on videogames. If they have nothing to worry about, they have nothing to fear.

I have a short list of countries I would prefer to not buy any goods or services from (not just games - anything at all):

North Korea
United States of America
Russia
China

Why? They do not respect the GDPR legislation, they do not think twice about stealing digital property back from consumers and they have absolutely awful governments, one of which has invaded a country that is part of Europe, and another who now supports them.

But actually my goal was only to ensure that any game I now buy, is only made in Europe. I don't get the faux outrage really, it was just a small, tiny, thing. A tag in a database saying "Made in Europe". <shrug>
Posted March 13, 2025
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UnashamedWeeb: OP was misguided for going with CD Keys, but it definitely doesn't change the fact that software should have country of origins to be pro-consumer.
Physical goods always have the country of origin printed in the label. GOG makes thematic sales based on the country of origin. It should not be difficult to add that little bit of information to game cards.
Posted March 14, 2025
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Chakyash: But you also get some users here with "what aboutism" asking what about us who want games made in *insert my country* , made by *insert gender or race*. In the end it will just divide gaming into this. [...] So I can already see everyone wanting their own to be represented in gaming.
First of all, no one is saying this except Amok who is making whataboutism arguments. You're projecting.

Second, gaming has always been divided both by gaming communities, genres, consoles, and stores. This is simply market fragmentation and is healthy for a competitive market. So I don't see your point.

What do gamers stand to lose if they're divided? The only alliance I can see is against DRM or anti-consumer decisions, which is why most of us are here.

Lastly, why would I want to be united with gamers? Some gamers here and elsewhere have said some objectively moronic things I definitely do not want to be associated with. So if being divided means having my own autonomy to make my own decisions to choose what I want to play or believe in that doesn't fall in line with what the mass market wants, I'd always choose my individualism (or divisionism in other people's views) 100% of the time.

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Carradice: Physical goods always have the country of origin printed in the label. GOG makes thematic sales based on the country of origin. It should not be difficult to add that little bit of information to game cards.
Absolutely right, it shouldn't. The argument that it's already available a Google search away and therefore shouldn't be added is ridiculous. As Breja said, might as well get rid of screenshots, trailers, devpub info, filesize info because everything's already available on PCGW.

There's a good reason I stopped keeping track of that metadata and it's because I work 10+ hrs/d and can't track that shit anymore. That's a job that should be delegated to the store that already has access to that info and the labour we're already paying to update this to all the store pages. Truly one of the dumbest things I've heard in a while here.
Post edited March 14, 2025 by UnashamedWeeb
Posted 5 days ago
Let me be clear: I do not condone the use of CD keys and similar gray sites.
However, it's clear to me that right now that both putin russia and trump usa are making war to Europe so I want to support European business instead of americans (since russia is already banned basically everywhere). I want to be as supportive to the rest of Europe as possible so that bullies can't do much damage other than what they are doing in their own countries.

And frankly, I am very sorry because I have always thought of the USA as a different but friendly country, not as an enemy. Trump's recent attacks on Zelensky and Europe with tariffs have made me change my mind. The USA is no longer a friendly Western democracy, perhaps it never was, perhaps it was only with us Europeans... but it is now clear that they do not want to protect Western values ​​but are only interested in money to the point of having sold his soul to putin and his dictatorship.
I thought that Trump's election the first time was just a protest vote and that it would never happen again. I thought that even the Republicans themselves (who have had many respectable leaders in the past) didn't even want to see that clown anymore.

Instead what I see is that now the USA is at the service of their new king Trump and that rich Nazi called Musk.
I'm so disgusted...

And let's be clear: the Italian government has disgusting people like Salvini too, and he and all his allies disgust me too... in Europe we have that dictator Orban in Hungary who continues to act as a Trojan horse for Putin. But just as in the US there are people who didn't vote for that clown Trump, here in Italy/Europe there are people who are not at fault. As an Italian and European citizen what I want to do is try to make the economy prosper here hoping that greater European integration means less power for the worst national governments (as in fact has already happened since the Italian government, to stay in Europe and not lose European money, had to make a lot of compromises and cannot do stupid things like the Trump government does in America).

This is why I am also in favor of introducing the country of origin in games.
It is a purely political issue. And I know that many do not like this expression and that some say that it is "stupid" to exclude beautiful games made in unfriendly countries but I do not agree. Politics is very important and making political choices is fundamental as far as I am concerned.
The choice to buy only drm-free games is absolutely political. The choice to boycott companies that exploit their workers is political. The choice to support companies in Europe is political.
If I did not have this type of mentality I would never have started using gog, but I would have simply stayed on steam.
Posted 5 days ago
Hmm...
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Posted 4 days ago
I've only read the first page of arguments, for and against, and I'm somewhat in the middle. Both sides made good points.

That said, looking at things from the game provider perspective rather than GOG customer, has me concerned about some issues.

It is disingenuous to infer there is no negative, so no penalty.

A country stamp, would in the case of some folk, mean they exclude some providers either fully or partially. Is that fair to those providers?

I'm personally against exclusivity on race or country grounds. I'd like to think gaming is above politics, certainly when it comes to being entertained. Last I looked, it is not politicians making games, and going by my own dislike of political parties in my own country, I'd hate to be penalized any more than I already am.

GOG, by all accounts have a tough time getting decent games here. So is having a country stamp going to make that harder? I imagine it could.

Shouldn't your purchase be about the merits of the game? Having a country label can be a bit like declaring what the developer had for breakfast .... not really relevant. It's not really like the other tags here.

I can't help but feel this would border on being some kind of racism.

I have to admit, I am against something that feels all too much like the region nonsense we've had to put up with for years ... whether that be games or music or movies or ebooks. Sure I know it is voluntary in this instance, but to my mind it is encouraging the wrong behavior and thinking. I'm much more about promoting togetherness.

So at the end of the day, I feel GOG should just concentrate on providing DRM-Free games, and not worry about country stamps.

I'm much more concerned about games being sexist or racist etc ... but only when in a significant way. But of course, that will be subjective for some.

I also can't help but feel the OP is being very political. It is one thing to want to support developers from your own country, and I'd maybe even applaud that. It is quite another to want to support the whole of Europe, especially when not every country in Europe is a good one.

I'm no fan of what is currently happening in the USA, but I don't believe penalizing game developers there is going to achieve anything ... the issues lie elsewhere.
Posted 4 days ago

I'm no fan of what is currently happening in the USA, but I don't believe penalizing game developers there is going to achieve anything ... the issues lie elsewhere.
Forget the politics, would you like metadata about products that you might buy? a country of origin tag would be just that. There are many reasons why you might want to know where a product has originated, here are a few:

1) You want to actively support your countries talent.
2) You want to actively support another countries talent.

then a few "political" ones:

3) You don't want your money to go to a developer in a country that is invading yours.
4) You don't want your money to go to a developer in a country that supports a country that is invading yours.
5) You don't want your money to go to a developer in a country that supplies arms to a country that is invading yours.
6) You want your money to go to a developer in country of an ally, who is supporting yours.

For instance, if Australia was invaded by China tomorrow, would you be happy if someone in the UK (your ally), then sent money to China, which would be taxed and that money used to make arms that will be used to blow up your citizens? Or would you like your ally to stop doing so?

As I have said repeatedly, I'm asking for metadata,not for GOG to actively BAN products from places such as Russia, China, USA or North Korea.

Gamers don't live in a Vacuum, we live in the world. All I am asking for is metadata, so that I can make an informed choice on purchases that I make. If I was being really "political", I would be asking for a Ban. I'm not, I'm asking for Metadata.
Post edited 4 days ago by Ozimandeus
Posted 3 days ago
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Timboli: I'm no fan of what is currently happening in the USA, but I don't believe penalizing game developers there is going to achieve anything ... the issues lie elsewhere.
I'm with you on a lot of points here, especially the fact that GOG has enough difficulty getting great games on their platform already without stamping the mark of cain on their business clients' foreheads.

To your concluding point, I'd like to add that the US entertainment industry is part of the counter culture. They stand opposed to the things their president embodies, and in fact, the president hates the entertainment industry of his own country with a passion. As we speak, US childrens' books are "reviewed" and possibly banned from libraries by Homeland Security. And judging from the last time Trump took office, it will only need a few larger scale school shootings and he'll have video games banned altogether.

If I buy American video games, I'm funnelling tax money into a corrupt regime.
But I'm also supporting an inclusive industry on the brink of being censored out of their wits.

If a US developer is willing to release their games here, I'll buy them. Next month, a game will release here that I've been waiting for for four years and the US dev has earned every last cent of my money.
Post edited 3 days ago by Vainamoinen
Posted 3 days ago
We're already doing it for some made in Europe games in the threads I've linked before and GOG usually does annual sales without anyone batting an eyebrow. Besides Ukraine, none of them get the same amount of pushback as I'm seeing here.

We're just asking for equality across the board for all games since tracking this is tedious and should be done by the store. They already have all this developer and billing address data or can link it very easily since the developer names are being tracked by some database out there anyway.

Just because some people are sensitive to politics and current events and does boycotts doesn't make it fair that all customers should be punished and not have access to this info. Many of us aren't political despite the impulsive accusations people throw around here.

And even so, counter-boycotts can be facilitated with these country of origin tags. For example, some Westerners might not want to support Ukraine and having this origin label lets them boycott Ukrainian devpubs to support Russian ones. This only gives power to them to do that, so that's a win-win for everyone.

As mentioned before, I personally use this label as a way to enjoy works I wouldn't have otherwise played because of its unique and novel backgrounds like Cris Tales or Wolfstride being JRPGs made in Colombia and Brazil respectively. If I hadn't known, I wouldn't have picked them up since a lot of indie JRPGs are a dime a dozen these days. I also go out of my way to pick up Canadian games because our social culture has been dead for years and I want to explore gaming mediums with Canadian influence as a way to connect with and experience new culture in my country.

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Timboli: Is that fair to those providers?
I don't care about devpubs' POV, I'm a customer. GOG should be catering to what consumers want mostly and the only time we consumers should even consider devpubs' views is getting their games for a win-win scenario where we can buy their games and they make profits. And when has country of origin tags stopped physical manufacturers from making products to sell overseas? The answer is it doesn't. It's simply based on business economics and some logistics. This is the same for software.

Ultimately adding this label should have very little effect on the grand scheme of things. When I compiled my lists above, there were only a small handful of devs who went out of their way to hide their location. Maybe like 2-3 out of 550 games I categorized, that's 0.5%. You can use that as a baseline for all genres, it's basically nothing and it's a non-issue.

I really can't understand how this extra consumer transparency would make things worse in the long run for the store and the consumers. Ultimately, we have the final choice on whether to buy a product or not and a country origin tag gives us more agency to make that decision, especially since googling most developers and location is already public on their website. If OpenCritic scores are no longer an issue, what makes this one so contentious? Some of you guys really like making mountains out of mole hills.
Post edited 3 days ago by UnashamedWeeb
Posted 3 days ago
The accusation of racism regarding labeling games based on their nation is, I think, deeply wrong, a non-sense.
We are not talking about discriminating against people based on their skin color, religious beliefs or sexual identity, but rather about providing simple information to understand where a game was produced. Information that has existed for a lifetime on all physical products.
As an Italian, I think this attitude of transparency and attention (especially on food but not only on that) was passed down to me by my parents, who are the most inclusive people in the world but who are always careful to understand where a product comes from, what's inside it and if it's made with quality in mind and obviously my parents have always preferred, when possible, made in Italy, because in other countries the laws on child labor, on the quantity of pesticides that can be used, etc., etc., are not as restrictive as in Italy.

I think it is only right to know where a game was made. I, as a consumer, can decide if I want to buy it based on all the elements I got (price, country of origin, reviews etc...). And if a US developer is worried about the sales since I can decide to avoid a product based on trump the developer can always decide to publicly say that he does not support trump in any way.

I mean I'm still listening to Linkin Park's music, not only have they always been against trump, even the new singer Emily Armstrong once made a song where she clearly said Fuck trump.

I don't think making purely political choices is wrong, and I don't think making political choices is the same as racism.
Racism identifies a group of people based on characteristics that are independent of will (a homosexual has not made a choice, he/she was born that way). On the contrary, politics means making a choice based on ideals (I do not want to support non-democratic countries because it goes against my ideals) and this is not racism.


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UnashamedWeeb: Just because some people are sensitive to politics and current events and does boycotts doesn't make it fair that all customers should be punished and not have access to this info. Many of us aren't political despite the impulsive accusations people throw around here.
And I don't think being political is a bad thing at all.
Post edited 3 days ago by LiefLayer
Posted 3 days ago
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UnashamedWeeb: I really can't understand how this extra consumer transparency would make things worse in the long run for the store (...)
According to gog it would. Only takes one country whose name shall not be uttered in these halls.
Post edited 3 days ago by Wirvington
Posted 3 days ago
No, thanks. Adding the country of origin to game pages could bring unnecessary politics into a space that should remain fun and inclusive. It might lead to unnecessary divisions or biases based on where games are developed. Instead, GOG should focus on addressing immediate issues like the delays in adding games to our libraries after redeeming Amazon Prime keys. Initially, it took minutes, but now it often takes more than half a day. This issue affects everyone's experience more directly and should be prioritized. Let's keep gaming free from politics and prioritize improving our experience with more practical solutions.
Posted 3 days ago
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MyTropico: snip
Do you think fun entertainment items like nerf guns made in India or Barbie dolls made in China on it creates unnecessary divisions or biases? Answer: they don't.

And to solve your other problem - the solution would obviously be to cut ties with Amazon because their profits haven't increased at all since they've partnered up.
Posted 3 days ago
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MyTropico: Adding the country of origin to game pages could bring unnecessary politics into a space that should remain fun and inclusive.
GOG makes sales based in the country of origin.
Posted 2 days ago
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MyTropico: No, thanks. Adding the country of origin to game pages could bring unnecessary politics into a space that should remain fun and inclusive.
The intellectual cowardice of that statement is beyond measure.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionMade in Europe grouping please?(85 posts)(85 posts)
(85 posts)