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Hey guys, let's try to keep things from going too far into silliness. I don't want to have to step in so just keeps things civil and grounded.


And GG to the NHS as ever.
All these people having a pop at the NHS, which is admittedly underfunded.

I was mighty glad for it four years ago when I was hit by a car suffering two broken ribs, a punctured lung, torn medial ligament and the right side of my body looking like one giant bruise.
Paramedics arrived 4 minutes after I was hit and the ambulance 3 minutes later which rushed me to the hospital where a team of doctors were ready and waiting.
I was kept in an observation ward for two weeks with three good meals a day and doctors regularly checking up on my progress.

I didn't have to worry about my treatment bankrupting me for lack of insurance, or indeed said insurance company looking through my contract for any mistakes so that it could weasle out of paying for my care, as I have heard happens in a certain country.

God bless the NHS and may it outlive the greedy, feckless politicians who would do away with it if they could.
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darthspudius: People, specifically foreign people ARE getting preferential treatment and not just in health care. In housing, for their benefits, in the food banks and even in the job market.
No they're not.
Take it from someone who worked in the benefit system with the lowest of the low. The housing and benefits systems don't give a shit who you are, what colour you are, what gender or religion you are.
They are designed to stop people getting any help whatsoever unless you know the right things to ask for (so particularly difficult for people who don't speak English and can't access that information easily).
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adaliabooks: They are designed to stop people getting any help whatsoever unless you know the right things to ask for (so particularly difficult for people who don't speak English and can't access that information easily).
There's been several occasions where I either haven't applied for help or delayed doing so because the forms required are incredibly lengthy and ask questions that are vague and almost impossible to give a sensible answer to.
Post edited July 07, 2018 by PoppyAppletree
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adaliabooks: They are designed to stop people getting any help whatsoever unless you know the right things to ask for (so particularly difficult for people who don't speak English and can't access that information easily).
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PoppyAppletree: There's been several occasions where I either haven't applied for help or delayed doing so because the forms required are incredibly lengthy and ask questions that are vague and almost impossible to give a sensible answer to.
Yup, and they are designed that way on purpose. They make everything as complicated as possible to reduce the amount of people who can be bothered to claim.
In the case of many disability related benefits they practically blanket refuse and expect you to appeal to get anything, most people can't be bothered so they don't even try even though a simple appeal (asking them to look at the decision again) often results in success without need to go to tribunal or anything complicated.

Hence immigrants are actually at a severe disadvantage.
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PoppyAppletree: There's been several occasions where I either haven't applied for help or delayed doing so because the forms required are incredibly lengthy and ask questions that are vague and almost impossible to give a sensible answer to.
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adaliabooks: Yup, and they are designed that way on purpose. They make everything as complicated as possible to reduce the amount of people who can be bothered to claim.
In the case of many disability related benefits they practically blanket refuse and expect you to appeal to get anything, most people can't be bothered so they don't even try even though a simple appeal (asking them to look at the decision again) often results in success without need to go to tribunal or anything complicated.

Hence immigrants are actually at a severe disadvantage.
To date I have never filled out a low-income form for dental treatment, despite needing to on many occasions. The only times I've bothered to apply for other benefits in the last five years or so were when I was charged council tax in the gap between college and university when I was still a full-time student, and when I literally couldn't walk. The former got denied, the latter to my surprise actually went through.
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adaliabooks: Yup, and they are designed that way on purpose. They make everything as complicated as possible to reduce the amount of people who can be bothered to claim.
In the case of many disability related benefits they practically blanket refuse and expect you to appeal to get anything, most people can't be bothered so they don't even try even though a simple appeal (asking them to look at the decision again) often results in success without need to go to tribunal or anything complicated.

Hence immigrants are actually at a severe disadvantage.
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PoppyAppletree: To date I have never filled out a low-income form for dental treatment, despite needing to on many occasions. The only times I've bothered to apply for other benefits in the last five years or so were when I was charged council tax in the gap between college and university when I was still a full-time student, and when I literally couldn't walk. The former got denied, the latter to my surprise actually went through.
Is dental not part of the UK's NHS? Over here it isn't part of Medicare, and literally the only medical operation I've have to have in my adult life has been wisdom teeth removal, gg. Even getting your teeth cleaned and whitened by a dentist here costs you a small fortune.
Post edited July 07, 2018 by Crosmando
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PoppyAppletree: To date I have never filled out a low-income form for dental treatment, despite needing to on many occasions. The only times I've bothered to apply for other benefits in the last five years or so were when I was charged council tax in the gap between college and university when I was still a full-time student, and when I literally couldn't walk. The former got denied, the latter to my surprise actually went through.
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Crosmando: Is dental not part of the UK's NHS? Over here it isn't part of Medicare, and literally the only medical operation I've have to have in my adult life has been wisdom teeth removal, gg. Even getting your teeth cleaned and whitened by a dentist here costs you a small fortune.
Dentistry and opticians aren't fully integrated, but there's subsidies for them; in Scotland and I think also Wales eyecare is included, but not in England. I think my last scale and polish was £15, but more intensive work has cost a lot more (in the hundreds though, not in the thousands).
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adaliabooks: In the case of many disability related benefits they practically blanket refuse and expect you to appeal to get anything, most people can't be bothered so they don't even try even though a simple appeal (asking them to look at the decision again) often results in success without need to go to tribunal or anything complicated.
Yes, this is the experience of a few people I know. People with extremely obvious disabilities are being told they're fine in their initial (re-)assessment, but the success rate of appeals is through the roof. The assessments are being done by lowest bidder private firms (surprise surprise).
UK has a National Hockey Series too? Wow, I didn't know Brits like iceskating and hitting a rubber buck with wooden sticks. It IS mesmerizing, I know.
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timppu: UK has a National Hockey Series too? Wow, I didn't know Brits like iceskating and hitting a rubber buck with wooden sticks. It IS mesmerizing, I know.
I hear the United States has finally got a National Health League.
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DOWL: Perhaps because it allows everyone access to healthcare, regardless of how much money they have. I'm assuming this is a troll, because no one in their right mind would deny free healthcare for all, right?

Private healthcare was what came before the NHS, you know, when the poor were dying on the streets.
It doesn't give everyone access to healthcare. You get whatever you're given and then restricted in what you can do yourself.

Agreed, the only complaints I hear is how the government should give them more funding to cope with increasing demand.
Do they ever specify how the money will be spent? Otherwise it's like throwing money at the military.
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DOWL: Perhaps because it allows everyone access to healthcare, regardless of how much money they have. I'm assuming this is a troll, because no one in their right mind would deny free healthcare for all, right?

Private healthcare was what came before the NHS, you know, when the poor were dying on the streets.
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Spectre: It doesn't give everyone access to healthcare. You get whatever you're given and then restricted in what you can do yourself.
You're going to need to back those claims up something powerful friend.
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Spectre: It doesn't give everyone access to healthcare. You get whatever you're given and then restricted in what you can do yourself.
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PoppyAppletree: You're going to need to back those claims up something powerful friend.
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Spectre: It doesn't give everyone access to healthcare. You get whatever you're given and then restricted in what you can do yourself.
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PoppyAppletree: You're going to need to back those claims up something powerful friend.
Back what up? It's not me who is making claims about the NHS, which is made up of a number of various groups.

If you want to, you can explain to other posters what waiting lists and death panels are and how everyone has to go through a busy GP,if they can get an appointment, before getting to see a specialist but only if GP agrees.

You can also provide a reason why medicines can't be bought directly by the public even when in other countries you can and why other websites provide better health information than the NHS one which we pay for.

Considering that last point, you can also ask how would people know the state of the NHS compared to other countries, when most of the public is kept ignorant on such matters apart from the odd politicised news articles giving the worst news on American healthcare.
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PoppyAppletree: To date I have never filled out a low-income form for dental treatment, despite needing to on many occasions. The only times I've bothered to apply for other benefits in the last five years or so were when I was charged council tax in the gap between college and university when I was still a full-time student, and when I literally couldn't walk. The former got denied, the latter to my surprise actually went through.
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Crosmando: Is dental not part of the UK's NHS? Over here it isn't part of Medicare, and literally the only medical operation I've have to have in my adult life has been wisdom teeth removal, gg. Even getting your teeth cleaned and whitened by a dentist here costs you a small fortune.
It's semi subsidised. There will be set cost for treatments. You pay a part of it and the state pays another part.
I think checkups every six months are free but they only seem good for having the dentist scratch your teeth.

He's right about about the system being made deliberately awkward so people can't claim. Which results in extra crime or people being killed.

https://www.alexlowery.co.uk/why-did-a-man-with-aspergers-starve-to-death-in-the-uk/