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Vainamoinen: Yeah, that's actually an elementary problem in democracy. You wouldn't understand.
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vsr: If there is Democracy in Europe, why would people want to go away? Sounds more like dictatorship masqueraded as democracy.
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sanscript: Russians haven't always been lucky in choosing the "right" candidates themselves either.
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vsr: But Russians have no problem with Merkel being elected in Germany, or Hollande in France, while Europeans clearly have a problem with Putin in Russia.
I can't speak for others - but I personally have a chronically problem with everyone :p

Both America and Russia have massive problems with inequalities (including India and somewhat China)... In these countries we have like the "wild west". We now see bigger problems in the collective when education, health and the economy are declining.

And some European countries are too laze to stake out their own road, and blindly follows the big ones.
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jamyskis: You mean the decade in which America was governed for seven years by a Democrat - Bill Clinton no less?
But yeah, I agree that the 90s were the best decade in over a century. It was very much the decade of political centrism.
Bill Clinton was okay, in exception for mass bloodshed in Yugoslavia, he lowered US debt, fought the inflation, established more or less good relations with Russia.
I don't care about Monica, I think he could have find more suitable person for intimacy. I never understood why he was 'flicked' by CIA. There were talks that he was going to reform the agency with no confirmation from trusted sources.
Btw: Indoctrination isn't always a good thing ;-)
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vsr: So it's ok if you mind your business in EU. Russia will mind it's own business. Same with Syria and other sovereign countries.
That's rich coming from a guy from a country with a proven history of interference in international elections, most notably providing financing to the French Front National (proven), to the British UKIP (likely) and to the German AfD (suspected).
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paladin181: Time for all the whiners to make good on their promises. When does the mass exodus to Canada begin?

When something gets so bad and makes people so angry that Donald Trump as President is the result to ensure we don't have to go through it any longer, someone, somewhere really fucked it up.

Don't pass judgement and hate people for wanting change from expensive unaffordable healthcare (the only healthcare I can afford carries so little coverage as to be non-existent), from socialist high taxes stealing earnings to give to people not contributing to society except to collect a check, from such lax immigration laws as to be non-existent...

Trump wasn't the better candidate per se. He was the only real choice that wasn't four more years of punishment towards a socialist agenda.
I'm the sole income provider for my family because my child has special needs. My job doesn't offer health insurance, but it is a highly skilled job. I work for a small business that without me 70 other people would not have a job anymore. We cannot afford health insurance for our workers, myself included. These past few months I worked 80 hours a week. Tell me how I'm laxy and don't contribute and don't deserve my MinnesotaCare health insurance.

[edit] Also, thanks to the affordable care act your health insurance has more coverage than it would have before with the elimination of pre-existing conditions clauses, and if you're a woman that coverage is expanded even further. The costs went up so much because of the republicans killing the sources of subsidizing the insurance like the Medical Devices tax. There's still a lot that needs to be fixed with it, and could be fixed completely if there were a single payer option, things like how the same insurance in one area can be 1000% more expensive in another zip code, but that blame goes on the private companies, not the heart of the law.
Post edited November 09, 2016 by vulchor
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Crosmando: If a country cannot control it's [sic] own territory (and thus it's [sic] borders) it's [sic] doesn't deserve to even be called a country.
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Vainamoinen: That's a bit of a difficult advice to give from a 97% immigrant country to a 98% immigrant country.
No? An immigrant is someone who is born in another country, and the majority of Australians were born here. You obviously mean we're descended from English/Irish settlers, which is true, but what country in the whole world is 100% indigenous? In every case there was some tribe there first, which was expelled by another, even the Australian aboriginals in all likelihood came from elsewhere and killed/expelled the previous inhabitants.
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vulchor: I'm the sole income provider for my family because my child has special needs. My job doesn't offer health insurance, but it is a highly skilled job. I work for a small business that without me 70 other people would not have a job anymore. We cannot afford health insurance for our workers, myself included. These past few months I worked 80 hours a week. Tell me how I'm laxy and don't contribute and don't deserve my MinnesotaCare health insurance.
The Trumpite response to this will probably now be "you're making this up, you're a Hillary plant, it's a democracy so suck it up as I find your liberal tears delicious". Or something along those lines inspired by post-truth politics.

But on a serious note, hold in there. It'll probably be a hard four years, but I wish you strength in getting through them.
Post edited November 09, 2016 by jamyskis
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vsr: So it's ok if you mind your business in EU. Russia will mind it's own business. Same with Syria and other sovereign countries.
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jamyskis: That's rich coming from a guy from a country with a proven history of interference in international elections, most notably providing financing to the French Front National (proven), to the British UKIP (likely) and to the German AfD (suspected).
You are talking about politician's business. I'm not a politician and i never provided anything to parties you mentioned.
I'm just amazed about level of hatred towards Putin among simple European folks.

For example, in Russia there is no such level of hatred towards Merkel, who is constantly threatening with new sanctions against Russia, or Hollande, who is doing the same stuff, or president of Poland, who is constantly begging for battle tanks from USA to "fight Russia".
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vulchor: I'm the sole income provider for my family because my child has special needs. My job doesn't offer health insurance, but it is a highly skilled job. I work for a small business that without me 70 other people would not have a job anymore. We cannot afford health insurance for our workers, myself included. These past few months I worked 80 hours a week. Tell me how I'm laxy and don't contribute and don't deserve my MinnesotaCare health insurance.
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jamyskis: The Trumpite response to this will probably now be "you're making this up, you're a Hillary plant, it's a democracy so suck it up as I find your liberal tears delicious". Or something along those lines inspired by post-truth politics.

But on a serious note, hold in there. It'll probably be a hard four years, but I wish you strength in getting through them.
Thank you so much for the sentiments, it really is appreciated. I was hoping that HIlary Clinton would be elected and be a bit more like Angela Merkel. She's proven tone-deaf lately, but overall she's had a great impact on the world and I admire her and the German people.
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vsr: I noticed that Europeans know exactly what kind of leaders other countries need and what they should do, but can't do anything in theirs own country, dreaming to migrate to Canada or, if lucky, to USA. :)
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Pheace: Where are you seeing Europeans dreaming of this?
LOL.

It's like FOX in America - some channels are obviously feeding the public misinformation, telling Russians that the Eropeans are fleeing to America, to the big dream because we live under horrible conditions...

People haven't been dreaming of the USA since before the liberal Kennedy - It all went sour after that him.
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jamyskis: That's rich coming from a guy from a country with a proven history of interference in international elections, most notably providing financing to the French Front National (proven), to the British UKIP (likely) and to the German AfD (suspected).
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vsr: You are talking about politician's business. I'm not a politician and i never provided anything to parties you mentioned.
I'm just amazed about level of hatred towards Putin among simple European folks.

For example, in Russia there is no such level of hatred towards Merkel, who is constantly threatening with new sanctions against Russia, or Hollande, who is doing the same stuff, or president of Poland, who is constantly begging for battle tanks from USA to "fight Russia".
This is true, it is not the fault of the Russian people for what Russian people do behind closed doors. Separate the individuals living in the the state from the state. Putin has done a lot to stabilize Russia, but it is scary on the outside seeing him consolidate so much power to himself.
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richlind33: ...What I think is interesting is the polls seem to be suggesting that a lot of Trump voters are well aware that he's a rather deeply flawed person, which tells that they would have voted differently if a better choice had been available, and that's pretty sad, because there *should* have been better candidates available.
He won the primaries. So at least there weren't better candidates. Which are the better candidates and why didn't they show up in the primaries and won them?

I hope that voters didn't just vote for him out of a fancy but really believe in him. Actually I wonder if this is true, do they really, deep down in their heart, are convinced it will be better for them? Because this is just unlikely. It's more likely things will go downhill economically with Trump. We will see but I don't think he is extremely competent nor has the right ideas. But I wonder if the voters for Trump actually believe that he has a good plan? I strongly doubt that many people would believe in his plans or his competence but I cannot imagine them voting for him without believing in him.

All in all just an expression of how little I understand about the US voters. Falling for the populist guy, what ever came good out of that? History should teach you that lesson really quickly.
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vsr: You are talking about politician's business. I'm not a politician and i never provided anything to parties you mentioned.
I'm just amazed about level of hatred towards Putin among simple European folks.

For example, in Russia there is no such level of hatred towards Merkel, who is constantly threatening with new sanctions against Russia, or Hollande, who is doing the same stuff, or president of Poland, who is constantly begging for battle tanks from USA to "fight Russia".
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vulchor: This is true, it is not the fault of the Russian people for what Russian people do behind closed doors. Separate the individuals living in the the state from the state. Putin has done a lot to stabilize Russia, but it is scary on the outside seeing him consolidate so much power to himself.
Why you have to be scared of anything when you are part of NATO?
Why demonize Putin?
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SirPrimalform: I just wanted to offer my condolences.
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jamotide: Why, there's not much difference between these two right wingers. But Trump will be way more amusing, so I think they made the right choice! Just like the Bushman was way funnier than Oh bummer. (except for the punability of the name)
Trump would be hilarious if he wasn't a real person. As bad as Clinton is she was by far the lesser of two evils. It's just a shame the Democrats chose such an awful candidate.
Post edited November 09, 2016 by SirPrimalform
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sanscript: People haven't been dreaming of the USA since before the liberal Kennedy - It all went sour after that him.
It sure did, and for those of us with our eyes and hearts open its been a waking nightmare living here. The problem is so many Americans still think we're the best and our ideas are the best, they can't understand that other countries have ideas and policies that have made them far better than us in all important international metrics. The cold-war era rhetoric of "socialism is evil" has forever damaged any hope of reforms in this country I believe, because people don't want to try to learn a new definition for something. They tie in emotions and let those overrule facts.