Posted September 04, 2018
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hmcpretender
hobby strategist
Registered: Apr 2012
From Other
![timppu](https://images.gog.com/27a38075b39196b7c723f8e05f687f831432657aed353eb2a8014101f03b855f_forum_avatar.jpg)
timppu
Favorite race: Formula__One
Registered: Jun 2011
From Finland
Posted September 04, 2018
Maybe, if they felt there are enough people caring about the old patches and installers. I've seen the opposite too, e.g. in the gogrepo.py discussion some people wanted a feature which would download only the base installers, and never the patches (as they expect the base installer to be the updated version anyway).
I personally would like to see GOG moving into automating the generation of offline installers as much as possible, even if it means less (separate) patches or no patches at all. The standalone patches have always been somewhat painful and people want contradicting things from them: some want delta patches, some want incremental patches, sometimes the patches are not backwards compatible, sometimes it is not quite clear which patches exactly need to be installed on top of the base installer in order to get to a certain patch level, etc. etc.
I personally would like to see GOG moving into automating the generation of offline installers as much as possible, even if it means less (separate) patches or no patches at all. The standalone patches have always been somewhat painful and people want contradicting things from them: some want delta patches, some want incremental patches, sometimes the patches are not backwards compatible, sometimes it is not quite clear which patches exactly need to be installed on top of the base installer in order to get to a certain patch level, etc. etc.
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Olauron
Arcane Wellspring
Registered: Dec 2012
From Russian Federation
Posted September 04, 2018
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It is not a huge issue (I can use Galaxy for such frequent updating games and download backup when patching is over), but it will not hurt to keep files for a week or at least 3 days from creating a link to them.
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darthspudius
Steam is Power!
Registered: May 2011
From United Kingdom
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Ranayna
New User
Registered: Jun 2011
From Germany
Posted September 04, 2018
I have read the thread, and i would like to thank everyone for the input :)
A couple of points were made that I want to adress, in no particular order:
- The day when GoG does not release any patches, only updated installers, will be the day when i fully stop buying games here
- Where to buy games if not here? You may call me a hypocrite, and maybe I am, but I will be buying my games on Steam if GoG versions are not properly maintained. I already have the steam client. Having a foot in the door is quite the advantage ;) I do not want to use any other clients, that is why I boycott uPlay and Origin. Or if not on Steam, then here, but only after the game is matured and cheaper. Though D:OS2 shows that this still might not prevent issues.
- Required additional testing of patches. Sure they need to be tested, but do you think the full installers do not have to be tested? And considering D:OS2, where the full install, from one SSD to another SSD, took almost half an hour...
The frustrating thing is also that D:OS2 got another update today. So if i had started downloading the new installer yesterday, I could have thrown everything away.
I was considering to pre-oder Pathfinder: Kingmaker (to get the wallet funds). I forgot about my troubles with Spellforce 3 to be honest. Now I know patching is still handled badly, so I will not pre-order. If reviews make me want to play the game, I will get it on Steam.
A couple of points were made that I want to adress, in no particular order:
- The day when GoG does not release any patches, only updated installers, will be the day when i fully stop buying games here
- Where to buy games if not here? You may call me a hypocrite, and maybe I am, but I will be buying my games on Steam if GoG versions are not properly maintained. I already have the steam client. Having a foot in the door is quite the advantage ;) I do not want to use any other clients, that is why I boycott uPlay and Origin. Or if not on Steam, then here, but only after the game is matured and cheaper. Though D:OS2 shows that this still might not prevent issues.
- Required additional testing of patches. Sure they need to be tested, but do you think the full installers do not have to be tested? And considering D:OS2, where the full install, from one SSD to another SSD, took almost half an hour...
The frustrating thing is also that D:OS2 got another update today. So if i had started downloading the new installer yesterday, I could have thrown everything away.
I was considering to pre-oder Pathfinder: Kingmaker (to get the wallet funds). I forgot about my troubles with Spellforce 3 to be honest. Now I know patching is still handled badly, so I will not pre-order. If reviews make me want to play the game, I will get it on Steam.
![hummer010](https://images.gog.com/49df97f09b785b1655e07df808b922d9c847856384e7308f699ee8e720a43698_forum_avatar.jpg)
hummer010
Crazy Penguin
Registered: Dec 2012
From Canada
Posted September 04, 2018
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Add to that the complains from "slow internet users" whether they want the patches to be incremental (=bigger) or delta patches (=more complicated as you'd have to install several patches). And then the cases when the game gets so massive changes that newer patches will not be backwards compatible anymore with all older versions.
To keep it simple, I suggest GOG should do this:
1. No patches to offline installers. Period. When updates arrive, the whole installer is always updated.
2. For people who want daily updates or want to keep it simple, yes, you need to use the Galaxy client in order to use its auto-update feature.
This would also allow GOG to automate the whole process more, ie. the updated offline installers are automatically generated whenever the Galaxy version gets an update.
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HypersomniacLive
The Reluctant Voter
Registered: Sep 2011
From Vatican City
Posted September 04, 2018
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Today's update of D:OS2 was a hotfix for Chinese players using a controller (that's an update I'd have personally skipped if I had downloaded the game yesterday).
Just a suggestion.
Having said that, I agree with what you said in your OP. It's been mentioned a number of times before, but the only response from GOG was that people aren't tech savvy enough, and maintaining multiple patches for the standalone installers would be confusing.
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Olauron
Arcane Wellspring
Registered: Dec 2012
From Russian Federation
Posted September 04, 2018
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Ranayna
New User
Registered: Jun 2011
From Germany
Posted September 04, 2018
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Today's update of D:OS2 was a hotfix for Chinese players using a controller (that's an update I'd have personally skipped if I had downloaded the game yesterday).
Just a suggestion.
Having said that, I agree with what you said in your OP. It's been mentioned a number of times before, but the only response from GOG was that people aren't tech savvy enough, and maintaining multiple patches for the standalone installers would be confusing.
![hmcpretender](https://images.gog.com/1001ce86baaff3ab884ab1b13253bca61ac2a33ef42c638f0eba9078bb1ca535_forum_avatar.jpg)
hmcpretender
hobby strategist
Registered: Apr 2012
From Other
Posted September 04, 2018
Are those really idiots if they are doing fine? I had an old XP-machine in my household up until last year. Never had any issues with it.
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HypersomniacLive
The Reluctant Voter
Registered: Sep 2011
From Vatican City
Posted September 04, 2018
![avatar](http://images.gog.com/efc780a273eff0c808dc7692ed2049e0f456a167af84e40426480e9bd6edceea_avm.jpg)
That's why I said if you had downloaded the game, not just some parts of it, yesterday.
But there may still be hope. If you're missing some parts of an installer that got too quickly updated in the future, I suggest to contact Support and explain your situation. Chances are that they'll accommodate you with the ones you're missing via FTP download links (no guarantee, but they've done it in the past).
Regarding the changelog feature, while I agree that changelogs are sometimes pretty useless, I don't think the bit I highlighted is fair. GOG releases whatever the devs/pubs send them, i.e. whatever the content of a changelog, it was provided by the devs/pubs themselves (updates and changelogs by GOG are denoted as "Internal", if you've noticed). So, it isn't really any different from, say, Steam, and I'm not sure that GOG can do anything about it.
I will, however, say that I've occasionally seen devs post changelogs/patch notes in game fora that are way more detailed than those in our libraries; I assume that in these cases, devs/pubs are still responsible for the latter ones.
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Ranayna
New User
Registered: Jun 2011
From Germany
Posted September 04, 2018
I literally cannot download the game in a single day.
I am on an 8 mb/s line. That alone would not be to bad. But I am sharing that line with a couple of people who regularly watch streams. And I am not really in a position where I can have running my computer the whole day or night. So im am lucky if I can download 2, or maybe three of those 4GB parts in a single evening. Luckily, i am not on a metered connection.
A couple of years ago, the Telekom, the biggest provider in Germany and a formerly state-owned company, had plans to convert all DSL flatrates to metered connections. With a per month data capacity of 75GB, so not even two downloads of D:OS2.
Luckily a massive shitstorm ensued and those plans were scrapped. Still a lot of other providers have what they call a "fair use policy" where they reserve tthe right to throttle connections after reaching an arbitrarily determined cap.
Faster connections are not available were I live.
I am on an 8 mb/s line. That alone would not be to bad. But I am sharing that line with a couple of people who regularly watch streams. And I am not really in a position where I can have running my computer the whole day or night. So im am lucky if I can download 2, or maybe three of those 4GB parts in a single evening. Luckily, i am not on a metered connection.
A couple of years ago, the Telekom, the biggest provider in Germany and a formerly state-owned company, had plans to convert all DSL flatrates to metered connections. With a per month data capacity of 75GB, so not even two downloads of D:OS2.
Luckily a massive shitstorm ensued and those plans were scrapped. Still a lot of other providers have what they call a "fair use policy" where they reserve tthe right to throttle connections after reaching an arbitrarily determined cap.
Faster connections are not available were I live.
![timppu](https://images.gog.com/27a38075b39196b7c723f8e05f687f831432657aed353eb2a8014101f03b855f_forum_avatar.jpg)
timppu
Favorite race: Formula__One
Registered: Jun 2011
From Finland
Posted September 04, 2018
![avatar](http://images.gog.com/49df97f09b785b1655e07df808b922d9c847856384e7308f699ee8e720a43698_avm.jpg)
I don't even use Galaxy currently, yet I'd be fine with offline installers not getting separate patches (but the main installer being updated instead). I guess I normally don't play games when they are still new and overly buggy requiring lots of fixing, I rather play them after they've been fixed.
For multiplayer games, I don't mind using a client as auto-update is pretty much a must for multiplayer games, to keep all the players on the same patch level.
![avatar](http://images.gog.com/efc780a273eff0c808dc7692ed2049e0f456a167af84e40426480e9bd6edceea_avm.jpg)
Oh well, I should have guessed...
Post edited September 04, 2018 by timppu
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hummer010
Crazy Penguin
Registered: Dec 2012
From Canada
Posted September 04, 2018
Rarely. The vast majority of the time, the full installer is updated, and that's the only way to get updates. For the most part, it isn't too big of a deal, there aren't that many huge games available at GOG on Linux.
I know my version of The Witcher 2 is out of date, but I just haven't had the desire to commit 20GB of my capped bandwidth downloading a new version of a game I'm not currently playing.
If Galaxy existed for Linux, and if it allowed incremental updates, I'd probably be willing to use it just for managing bandwidth.
I know my version of The Witcher 2 is out of date, but I just haven't had the desire to commit 20GB of my capped bandwidth downloading a new version of a game I'm not currently playing.
If Galaxy existed for Linux, and if it allowed incremental updates, I'd probably be willing to use it just for managing bandwidth.
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Gmr_Leon
Drifter
Registered: Apr 2011
From United States
Posted September 05, 2018
I tend to agree here. The awkward handling of offline installers has led to a lot of confusion for folks, and needs to be reviewed & revised.
I've skimmed over this thread, and to a certain extent, I agree with parts of what Timppu is saying. I don't agree with completely automating updates to the installer (not entirely sure to what degree that's possible anyway), but I think the idea is somewhat in the right direction.
I think that at a certain point, the most updated version of a build should be made the primary installer. So as an example:
You have a dev that releases several patches to build 1.58, ABCDE. You provide these incremental patches separately for a time, but once you see that they're all integrated into 1.58 & they're moving to 1.59, you roll them into an installer for 1.58.
However, what I think really needs to change here is how GOG is presenting both the installers & patches. Installers need to be in a couple of categories of their own, Current Installers & Archived Installers. Archived Installers would be compiled versions of major releases (i.e. all patches that came after the major release's initial release integrated into it), allowing people to revisit old versions of the game as they please. This would be especially interesting/useful for in development games, and games that have changed significantly over time, like No Man's Sky.
Current Installers would be the latest base build of the game for installation, with a subsection of Current Patches.
I think this would potentially solve issues for many folks, and generally improve the readability of the offline installer space. I know in my time here I've sometimes just found it a frustrating mess to navigate, so seeing some organizational improvement would be great.
I've skimmed over this thread, and to a certain extent, I agree with parts of what Timppu is saying. I don't agree with completely automating updates to the installer (not entirely sure to what degree that's possible anyway), but I think the idea is somewhat in the right direction.
I think that at a certain point, the most updated version of a build should be made the primary installer. So as an example:
You have a dev that releases several patches to build 1.58, ABCDE. You provide these incremental patches separately for a time, but once you see that they're all integrated into 1.58 & they're moving to 1.59, you roll them into an installer for 1.58.
However, what I think really needs to change here is how GOG is presenting both the installers & patches. Installers need to be in a couple of categories of their own, Current Installers & Archived Installers. Archived Installers would be compiled versions of major releases (i.e. all patches that came after the major release's initial release integrated into it), allowing people to revisit old versions of the game as they please. This would be especially interesting/useful for in development games, and games that have changed significantly over time, like No Man's Sky.
Current Installers would be the latest base build of the game for installation, with a subsection of Current Patches.
I think this would potentially solve issues for many folks, and generally improve the readability of the offline installer space. I know in my time here I've sometimes just found it a frustrating mess to navigate, so seeing some organizational improvement would be great.