Brig SPF, Lynch Damn, Vig SPF achieves the same effect. The big thing is making sure the roleblock is prevented, in case of scum!SPF.

If the vig target doesn't die, Joe is very likely scum.
If the vig target and someone else die, Joe is town.
If only the vig target dies, then either Joe is town or town directed the NK.

Unbrig vote Damnation
Unvote Joe

And it seems I really need to stop saying things like "I'm not moving off this wagon ever."

The "where's the mod?" votecount.

Lynch:

JoeSapphire - 3 (Lifthrasil, SirPrimalform, ZFR)
SirPrimalform - 2 (bler144, JoeSapphire)
Lifthrasil - 1 (trentonlf)
ZFR - 1 (yogsloth)

None - 3 (elebutterfly, Damnation, adaliaBookwyrms)

Brig:

SirPrimalform - 3 (yogsloth, trentonlf, bler144)
JoeSapphire - 1 (Lifthrasil)
Damnation - 1 (ZFR)
trentonlf - 1 (SirPrimalform)

None - 4 (elebutterfly, JoeSapphire, Damnation, adaliaBookwyrms)

With 10 active players, it takes 6 votes to reach a consensus.

Day 3 will end at 23:00 UTC tomorrow, which is 21 hours from now. If you require an extension, please let me know as soon as possible.

I love the plan! I can't promise to stick to it.

If the mafia know exactly what the night actions are going to be then they have more control over the night. It's possible that SirP is town and the cylons have a roleblocker of their own - or some other horrible power that we haven't thought of. If I promise to kill SirP and he's town they'll just leave me to it. If I promise nothing then it's harder for them to know what to do.

You're not going to like it but...

Also I have no reason to trust you.

Also I don't like the part of your plan that's "and then we get to end game and it's really obvious who the cylons are". Well I love it but I don't think it's UNPROBLEMATIC.

Also your plan doesn't really take possible cylon power roles into account. Not that we've seen much evidence of them having anything.



Are we going to find out what you spotted in Zephyr's text, or do we have to wait for yogsloth to guess?

brig SirPrimalform

unvote SirPrimalform

Vote Damnation

There. I'm frakking flippity-flopping my votes all over the place like a motherboat, are you happy?

The reason not to bother brigging Joe is that, if he is scum, he's GF. Which means he can't do crap about any protection. You either lynch him (I'm not really in favor of that), or you hunt elsewhere.

Now, we did see Yog's role way back in Vitek's game, and that was kinda scum JOAT, but even that pretty OP role didn't have kill + GF in same night. So I'm assuming there's nothing quite that nuts.


Uhhh...if Joe is town he's almost certainly telling the truth about 6 shots, not 8. Ergo town!joe proves no block, no?

I googled that to see if it was a thing, and all I got is a reference to minivan advertisements (2 in the front, 5 in the back), and the urban dictionary entry for a sexual act AKA "the minivan." I guess I need to get out more - or stay in more, or whichever it would be.

Man, your positions/reads are squishier than mine...


gotta do home stuff. obvs not caught up yet.

Are you going to give us this info if your lunchwagon starts heating up? Or is it likely you won't be around to keep checking?
I want to know what you're going to say about this post, but it's a bit early to ask for your claim. Although I don't really see how another claim can hurt town too much, especially if you're not going to be around to counter-claim somebody else...

Too hot to sleep...

I know it’s not much to work with but this is the first game I’ve seen where people have been so eager to discount a cop read on the basis that there might be a godfather.. Anyone who is worried about this want to explain why, currently? Is it role mechanics or textual evidence to doubt bler?

@ZFR I was being meta-y and in retrospect kinda stupid with that point, the idea was that a scum RL lurker would be more likely to ask to sub out earlier, seeing as a team of 3 would be hurt more by RL lurking than a team of 10...

Also I mistakenly said joe said he performed the nightkill, on reread he just said he killed flub, it was I think yogs who got outraged at not immediately lynching the person who “claimed the nightkill”. Semantics... but unfortunately that’s how I play.

I mean... I'm like 92.4% sure he's mafia, so... threatening to vote himself? "Disturbing" is such a heavy word. Help a brother out. What?

After sleeping on that I admit to having a moment of paranoia today that the reason you didn't take that into account was that you're not actually doctor, and that I'm townreading you just because I was townreading HSL and everyone else is townreading you because you subbed in replacing a player with a reputation for never voting who didn't vote that one particular time.

But that's just paranoia, right?

Sigh. Mod WIFOM is the most bitter kind of WIFOM.

Think of it this way - any pair picked randomly is as likely to be any mafia as any other. It was the same problem with Trent's suggestion that Cristi's claim was improbably because we'd already seen a Miller flip and RB claim out of the first 4 on the table.

As humans we like to attach narrative to things, but ultimately random is random. And a small sample size will frequently lead to strange outcomes - this is why I've somehow been cop more often than I've been either VT or mafia, despite the fact those SHOULD be more common outcomes, esp. since I played in an all-mafia game, but no all-cop game, at least not yet.

I care.

I challenged him on the logic of why it made sense to vote himself on D2 but instantly ask to be voted out D3 and wasn't particularly satisfied with the answer.

I know most people aren't on board with my original adalia/trent/ZFR theory (and it is, of course, probably wrong) but if that were the case his self-vote wasn't only LAMIST, it was pretty slick strategy. Him going in the brig dropped the adalia wagon to 3, and that was pretty much the end of it. So he would've gotten to distance from a buddy by voting him, leave the wagon only due to the brig (so no expl. for getting off it), and town cred for time served.

It sure would be nice if Dangnation would share whatever he's got.

1) Yeah, fair enough, i straight misread that. Now, reading it the way you are, I have no thoughts about it.

2) I'm skeptical. Having been cop many, many times, it's not unusual for the original cop PM to specify that you read "town or maf" as it was here (I should probably double check that), but with the N1 results we have the machine and the whole red/green thing.

Aside from the fact it would be a real screwjob to the canon as I recall it, the mod would have to write flavor that says basically "This large blue light you'd never noticed before blinks on! You shake your head wondering WTF, how you never noticed that light before, and whether anyone will buy your fake-sounding claim!" which, you know, might be in play.

But prolly not. That's a total guess though.

Well if we lynch Damn and he flips maf, you're probably off the menu regardless. The problem with both ZFR and Trent is their VT claim and back to the GF yada yada. Though with Trent it is possible he's only claiming VT now because of block PM. I don't find that super likely, but it is possible.

Lift is so enthusiastic about being copped that kinda same problem. WIFOM and all of you not wanting to and him wanting to.

And of course, ultimately lynch flip matters and if it's not strongman (or if yogs is just bluffing doctor) I'm probably dead anyway. /shrug

Glad I popped back on before going to sleep.

Wow, that plan of Book's is... awfully neat. I had been thinking that either Joe or Book was cylon and that Joe's lynch would be the more informative of the two but Book's "do what I say and everything will be wonderful" plan strikes me as a convenient way to get rid of a couple of power roles.

Brigging me means no chance I'll block the NK, leaving bler to presumably kick the bucket. Meanwhile Joe vigs me getting rid of two town PRs in one night.

Unvote JoeSapphire

For the record I now think the mafia are Book, trent and ZFR. I think our best bets are one of those three, but I guess I'd also support lynching Damnation.

For now vote Damnation but I'll vote for any of the three scum if anyone else is with me?

How so? If they hold their shot or shoot the same guy, you're no worse off and we've effectively directed the NK. If they kill someone else, then they confirm you are town.

Heck, you even get to shoot the guy you are currently voting! Why are you comfortable enough to lynch him, but not to NK him?

Are you seriously claiming there might be two roleblockers and a Miller and possibly a GF in the game? That kind of setup is custom designed to make the cop worse than useless.

I don't care. You don't have to trust me. I'm trying to give you a way to mechanically clear yourself and you are fighting me on it.

Good Idea: Scum acting townie to try and deep wolf into a town bloc.
Bad Idea: Town acting wolfy to try and deep town into a wolf bloc.

We've got a fair sized town bloc, and these kills should either kill scum or confirm more of that town bloc.

Which scum power roles are going to screw with the pan? Godfather? Ninja? Role Cop? Wait, wait, I know. They're going to Commute at us! Oh No!

No. You're going to have to work harder than that. Figure out a viable setup with a scum power that screws with the plan and present it to the class.

You're going to have to wait for the sloth.

The game I modded was flavour saturated (I nearly broke it with block flavour) and the cop read was “guilty” or “not guilty”... which I thought was the standard, since it fudges what happens when you target a vig or SK.

Putting this out there now that my flavour does frak all to clear me of godfather suspicion. C.f posts throughout the game where I have insisted that reading into character flavour isn’t going to help.

Joe how many clips do you have for that pistol of yours?

The reasoning for GF Joe (sounds like an action figure) is that instead of vigging flub he’s straight up claiming the NK, after a long and elaborate falseclaim at L-1? When i put it like that it doesn’t sound likely. was anyone poised to hammer? I forget and am on phone, will check later.

Books why was that comment specifically for yoga?
And ZFR pleeeease don’t consider voting for yourself. ;-; Your townie death doesn’t help. The reasons for it do - voting for yourself screws up that reasoning. #itgetsbetter

Actually that's quite funny. You made this post while I was typing my last one and Book/trent/ZFR is exactly where I've arrived now. I was there earlier but with Book OR Joe on the team. Book's "plan" looks very much to me like a manipulation so Joe has dropped in priority. I hadn't noticed this bit about ZFR getting a "legit" chance to jump off Adalia's wagon though. Goddamn.

Yeah, I'm really hoping Damnation comes back before the deadline.

Joe had no f'ing clue what his flavor was until it was pointed out to him that the flavor he was originally presenting sounded insane.

2/6 shots is straight from the daybreak post. Latest version of Joe's personal flavor story is that he just pulled the trigger a bunch of times, not that he fired 6 shots.

Godfather is a relatively common role, and, like Miller, it is a good one to help prevent town from getting too complacent about just following a town cop. There are several hints that a Godfather might be in play, including the strength of the possible town power roles, and Deputy and Miller both showing up in the flips.

There is a very simple reason vanilla Trent wouldn't have known about being blocked, one which should have occurred to a vanilla ZFR.

I see the premise but if we're going down this road, I kinda think Joe should keep it holstered if we lynch maf rather than forcing him to stick to a pre-determined shot that may or may not make sense with the flip.

I am open to the suggestion of 'mandating' a shot in the context of "if town!x, scum!y highly probable"

Uhhh...why only if we ask? I'm not trying to be a smurfhole, but you know that's kinda the opposite of how most of the game is played, and we are kinda on a deadline.

I tell people all kinds of ***** they don't even care about completely unprompted!

But since you put it that way, uh Please, do tell us whatever you think is relevant to helping town solve the game. I mean, your role would flip with you, but presumably you know something more than that. And we only have two mislynches (give or take) to go, so...

I won't guilt you with the rest of it. I get that a few of us talk a lot and it's hard to keep up with. I'm putting way more time into this than I should.

You weren't asking me, but my immediate reaction is I don't. As you note you were never at L-1, and cristi (known town) was available as an alternative.

Not often someone is distraught with a smiley face. What are you distraught about? I mean, in the end it is a game.

I stress about it mostly just because over time it takes over my brain. And sure, i claimed partly so I wouldn't feel singly responsible for town losing if we do, or for trying to crack the game all by my lonesome.

And if you don't do the best you can, yogs will fly to Belgium and picket outside your house that says...that says...dammit, I can't come up with anything funny right now.

Well, I suggested people look at the Joe-wagon(s?) for clarity and I don't think anyone did that even though it's really the most up to date data before the claimstorm. And...now that I'm here it was a long day and I don't have much energy.

Why would you say that? If anything his flip sooner would be useful for revisiting D1 wagons.

unvote

I confess I didn't anticipate quite that much enthusiasm either. It might just be me, but SPF seems eager to vote for anyone not named SPF. Which, I suppose, given he's at least on the menu might just be NAI.

I'll check in in the morning, and anticipate being home about an hour before deadline. In the time I've been on I've just been responding to shit and not analyzing beyond what it means that deadline for modkill passed and ...who knows what that means. Maybe that post was substantive. Maybe it was the collective town vote against modkill.

frak me.