Tbh, it could be WIFOM...ZFR could somehow be scum, could've posted the NL thing to appear townish, and then could've NKd Korotan(as Korotan would probably be one of the less likely for ZFR to NK if he is scum).

That said, I think ZFR was too "bold"(posting quantity and how he posted on D1) to be scum, and is more likely town.

I didn't...as i've seen all the original films enough times to know that 48 hours is *holds up 3 fingers, then puts one finger down after thinking a bit* THIS MANY days. :)


Also in honor of Mr Murphy's fine work, some theme music for the game
(Music is not from 48 hours, but from Beverly Hills Cop...as I like that series a bit better)

I found this weird too, though for a different reason. I was leaning to trent being scum, but his last self-vote, was actually Town-indicative to me. I've seen scum self-hammer (HSL in Lift's game, Pooka when he was scum with GR, yogs in my Harry Potter game), and in all the self-hammering I've seen, scum have simply given up keeping pretences and were if not outright admitting, at least not denying to being scum.
Yet trent on self-hammering didn't admit to being scum. In fact he kept up the "lynch ZFR after me." So why did the self-hammer cause joppo to be sure that trent is scum.

I also don't like the "he fooled me once again." Feels so lamisty. When X fools Y in Mafia it's when X pretends so well to being Town that Y reads him as Town and then is "fooled" when X is scum after all. Did joppo read trent as Town this game so strongly that he can say he was fooled, had trent flipped scum?

Yeah... I saw my mistake soon afterwards. I saw the selfhammer and concentrated on that, and the often mentioned fact that selfvoting is a scummy action. I remember Pooka was a "free lynch" a couple games ago for doing it.
Only after I wrote that post I reread Trent's and realized that the rest of it was enough to shake hard that belief that scum had been caught after all.
Hence I requested for a bump so I could EBWOP. Which was promptly granted by the mod and ZFR, and completely wasted because I decided to check on other threads like the Black Friday's in the meantime. Sorry about that, guys.

Meant to write about this. I think this is obvious. Scum picked Korotan because his death would just keep us guessing.

No, I just didn't read him as scum while many others did, enough to vote him — including you. He was very close to the middle with a nudge towards scum in my scum scale, so I didn't saw it right to vote him.
Voting someone just because they are the leading wagon is not a good strategy, not even for Scum and much less for Town.

Going away now and back in some twelve hours. If anyone has followup questions they will have to wait.

OK, the bump request is there, and even though you didn't act on it, the reason you requested it means you meant to write something.

I'm going to accept your explanation (at first glance you thought it meant we caught scum because self-voting always is, then you realised it doesn't mean so so you asked for a bump? Am I understanding you right?)
But it still feels odd. It could just as well have been that scum!joppo read his post and realised how it would look later (like it did to dedo and me at least), so requested the bump to correct that.

Wait, so he was in the middle with a tiny lean towards scum side on your scale, and yet you wrote he (scum!trent) had "fooled" you? How?

This makes no sense. How did a scum, whom you did read as scum (albeit slightly) fool you?

If I was around for the deadline I'd most like have thought that Trent was in fact going to flip scum and Joppo was his buddy trying to gain any distance while he still has the chance to do so. I came back to the thread only after the day had finished this whole thing just looks weird as I can't understand where the apparent certainty came from and it makes zero sense to me in the context of Trent's flip.

But when you read trent's self-hammer, before reading joppo's post, what did you think about trent?

Because to me the self-hammer, while still maintaing "lynch ZFR next" pointed to him being Town. As I said, the scum-self hammer doesn't bother keeping up pretenses.

korotan kinda requested to be the nightkill. he said something like "if I get my wish and I am the nightkill" or something like that.

which makes me think the mafia killed korotan as a favour

which makes me think the mafia are players with a social conscience

which makes me think microfish and gymhenson.

j'accuse!


tell me more about this comment made by Joe

Well, it's a bit of a blur to me as I read the flip first and that kind of cursed me with knowledge so I'm not sure how I would have read Trent's final words at the time he posted them. Probably would have seen them as Town as I don't think Trent is one to keep the act going just to keep the voters sweating until the very last moment.


I know he asked for it but and that's the main reason I think it's likely to be a low information kill. Your theory seems like a bit of a stretch but it's interesting nonetheless.

This is why you send PMs to people when you start the new day. So forgetful people like me can remember to tell you to send PMs when you start the new day!

Will read all of this stuff later today (I hope).

Why do you feel the need to point out that this is an assumption? It was discussed both in pre-game and in this game that we do have 2 scum. That's part of this game's design. This emphasis that you 'assume' that we have 2 scum feels scummy. As if you would say: 'I totally don't know for sure that there are only two scum. Because I totally am Town. Really!'

Do you want to say that all us others lack social conscience?

End of Day: 08/12/20 19:00 UTC

This is negotiable if it causes a cattestrophic conflict with a player's schedule.

I just recall a back and forth from page 10(if youre set for 20 posts per page) between ZFR and Trent it was in question whether or not 2 scum was known fact. Cattes post linked from the signup thread does not say "There will be 2 scum in this game" so assuming 2 scum would be the better way to go I feel, also I stated as an assumption to avoid any possible rebuttals of "how do you know there are only 2 scum?". Little did I know both sith and town deal in absolutes...

This quote right here:

Granted, I fixated more on koro's response to the comment coming after the hammer. I didnt realize until looking back that when you made the original comment trent was still at L-2. So really I have nothing further to go on with that being the case, but I did want to respond to your question.

I realize its a stretch as I did preface it by saying it was a very "out-there" thought. I dont have enough history with the group to know if scum!ZFR is as active post wise as town!ZFR, but yes I agree on base level his high presence in the game would be bold if this theory did hold any water.