a wonderful theory. how much conviction do you have for it?


you do fail to consider that with AI racers there will be no moral qualms about the racers dropping banana peels under each other's wheels, ramming each other with ben hurr spikes, and knocking each other off cliffs with giant boxing gloves on springs.


how much conviction do you have that zfr scum?


i'm tired and freezing to death but still alive for the moment


which comment sorry?

it's usually trent calling out other people for casting shade at him...

do you think there may be some element of omgus to this list?

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I remember the thing dedo said which I thought might make him town, it was about thinking that each night would alternate odd and even numbers of players - which sort of means he forgot about there being night kill, which I think someone playing mafia is less likely to do?
in the cold light of evening-two-days-later it's not as compelling but I'm gonna town read dedo anyway

still think korotan is town

and I accept pooka's derpclear.

which means mafia is among
zfr, trent, micro, lifthrasil, bucktooth, nmillar, joppo, gym.

I don't think team trent-lift gang up on zfr how they did.

I like zfr thinking lift and joppo are team because of lift missing zfr from his list. that feels like how zfr looks for answers. heck it might even be true!

today I vote

vote nmillar

ha

Typical mafia game is about 25% mafia, with 12 people and only 2 mafia that is only 16.6666... percent giving town the number advantage, and as much as you keep making this about math I figure you already knew this and I'm not sure why you feel I need to explain it.

As for your bragging rights, it's at least 50% wrong, I'm not scum. If Lift is Town then yep we are on the same team, otherwise that's a big no.

I also don't see why I have to explain how Town knowing how many scum gives them an advantage, seems pretty obvious. If we have only 2 scum and we lynch one then there is no more suspicion involved with how they are engaging and acting around a possible teammate. Not knowing how many actual mafia are in play means we have to figure it out instead of knowing, and knowledge like that is an advantage.

I'm good with my vote, ZFR seems to be acting way more "I don't understand and I am confused" than seems necessary. Trying to portray a confused Townie is a scum ploy.

they say that in a game with no power roles mafia has an advantage, so 16.66 percent mafia is fairer chances for both teams they say

I disagree. It all comes down to individuals and how they play, and with less than 17% of the players being mafia it is a disadvantage for them unless they play an almost perfect game.

Miniscule. Which is why it makes such a nice fringe theory for a bragging rights duo. If I'm wrong it doesn't influence the game, and if I'm right I can say at the end "I knew it all along!".

scum!Lift is too experienced to make such a slip. Then again, he himself said it's a game of human mistakes, so...

I think there was a recentish case of a newish player who forgot to include his scumbuddies in his reads?

I acknowledged there might be. I'm not drilling any more on the D1 NL thing since at this point it's going to be just tunneling from my side, and anyway, I think Lift and I cleared up what we mean.

In trent's case however, the bigger reason for me to think him scum is unrelated to the D1NL issue; it's his "LOL" post. It does read like exasperation from someone who perceives they're at a disadvantage and just found out they're at an even bigger one.

The human brain is wired to think that when an action has a sequence of steps, partity would alternate every step. So it's quite natural that someone would think parity of players alternates between D1, D2, D3 and so on.

I wouldn't put that much into it to Townclear dedo.

Still, it *is* something. So thanks for noticing and pointing it out.

Which is why they didn't. Lift didn't vote me.

But I see your point. They would be disatnacing more.

Post yours.

PR Mafia. Vanilla Mafia is completely different kind of animal.

Have you ever play Vanilla Mafia before? Can you corraborate the 25% rule to Vanilla Mafia from your own experience?

You don't. I never questioned it.


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trent, game's been going for 5 days now and practially every single post of yours has been directed at me. Do you have anything about all the stuff the others have written?

well maybe it's worth taking it to the website that catte got his info from to pursue your case there?

bitch did I say lift was voting you?

You're free to believe what you want, but I'm more inclined to believe a Mafia community where lots of Vanilla games have been played and Mafia wins more with less than 15% of the players.

Regardless, this is irrelevant to the game at hand here that has already started.

You said gang up. What does ganging up mean?

the way they were elbowing each other out of the way to give you a hard time over statistics and no lynches and this and that

you never responded to my 169. :'(

Also, I know my argument was weak, @everyone, but it was something more than "shall we NL or L on D1 or later?" which is going nowhere but in circles, and fast.

i had another comment but i forgot it. I doubt that was what ZFR wanted, but that's what he gets :P

Here is your direct quote "So you're basically saying that at 10 vs 2 Town have an advnatge because... no reason, I gave you my reason.

Anything else you want to cast some shade on me about?

What do I think of everyone else, they seem to be playing mafia and not the math game.

Nobody's playing any maths games, but again you're free to believe what you want.

Sorry I whas absont for the day. Still getting rest of SL Launch night. If someone asks for my opinion I thirst thought of Trent and Lift being Scum of how the from the start trying to bring us doupt to ZFR.
Well after the talk I think Lift is just so personally against it but rest being normaly town investigator. About Trent I still have my uneas feeling. So for the case I will get NK in two days just because Mafia chooses me to make me a favour I want bring my words to paper.

Well, as discussed in the signup thread, the numbers come from here: [url=https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Category:Vanilla_(Open_Setup]https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Category:Vanilla_(Open_Setup[/url])

The EV table there claims that with 12 players, two of which are scum, Town has a 40% chance to win. So they still give Scum the advantage with these numbers. I agree that that does look strange. Especially since the percentages don't cross the 50% threshold until 17 vs 2.

However, these numbers are apparently what is valid for a pure number game. I.e. Town lynch randomly, Scum kill Town at Night. This isn't the point of a Mafiagame at all. Especially not if there are more than one Scum. Not lynching randomly but trying to analyze behaviour is exactly the point of the game. Which this list completely ignores.

So, I think that the chances of Town are definitely better than given in the list. How much better, well, that depends on the skill of the players involved. How much better than random lynching can we be?

With no power roles, town have no additional knowledge at any point, hence the increased chance for scum to win, as any investigations will only be based on interactions and wagons.

I could provide the mathematical proof to demonstrate where the magical 40% comes from, but like Trent, I'd rather play mafia.