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General discussionGOG Mafia #61 - Pacifists at the NRA!(435 posts)(435 posts)
(435 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted September 01, 2019
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GameRager: Well that makes 2 confirmations we can write off as NRA/town. Now to analyze the wagons.
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blotunga: Hey, did you just try to buddy up? Even if I were scum I would confirm Redfire sending me to the loo.

As for going back to analyze the wagons, I'll have time for that tomorrow, i hope.
I was just reading through and responding, and misread it a bit as Red confirming you weren't a pacifist as well.

That said, your confirmation would prove he is a jailer and that he jailed you, and I don't see why a pacifist would admit that and(by extension) confirm Red as jailer.

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RedFireGaming: GameRager's refusal to vote, paired with "I have a bad feeling about this" looks off. For now though, I'm going after the new guy. Micro had a few suspicious posts, but more importantly I'd like to get a read on his replacement.

Vote RWarehall
So, Micro, you had to leave on your first time as scum? Bummer.
Fwiw I didn't vote as I don't like rushing a wagon without much proof and the first session(day) is usually without much of that(from what i've seen). As for the bad feeling I had....it was due to people rushing to aim at one person so quickly.

Also why vote RWarehall? Any suspicion based in Micro's posts or something else?

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trentonlf: How exactly does blotunga being jailed clear him as Town?
Good point, and I have now corrected that as per one of my replies in this post.

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blotunga: Gamerager is for sure jailer. I was sent to the loo during coffee break. So in my eyes he's 100% confirmed town
Don't you mean Red and not me? ;)
Posted September 01, 2019
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GameRager: Don't you mean Red and not me? ;)
Did i reallt write that? Sorry I was a tad distracted. Yes, red is jailor ofc.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: Why 3 scum? We already had a Neutral flip. Do you really think the game started with 6 town and 3 scum? Most likely 2 scum.

What's interesting here is it seems, assuming RedFire is town, all 3 major wagons ended up on Town/Neutral. Unfortunately, that makes analyzing them less fruitful as scum let us hang ourselves. They didn't push anything because they didn't need to.
2 Night Kills means a Serial Killer—Kleptomaniac by the flavor—is on the loose.
Posted September 01, 2019
The answer to your question, Gamerager, "why a pacifist would admit that and(by extension) confirm Red as jailer" is because Red brought it up first. If Blotunga denied it, then the entire game focus would go to him or Red as one would be lying and even if we chose Red to lynch, that would confirm Blotunga as scum to be lynched the following day.

In other words, regardless of alignment, Blotunga is essentially obligated to confirm him. Red choosing Blotunga is completely NAI (Not Alignment Indicative) with regards to Blotunga.

Let's drop a bombshell here...

Unless this is a role-madness game and there is also another Roleblocker who blocked the SK, we do not have an SK in the game. People shouldn't jump to conclusions.

I followed the train of thought that Day 1, you arrived at Red's wagon because scum tried to steer clear of one of their own (i.e. get off Agent's wagon onto a town). I thought maybe SPF and Agent were doing some early distancing and attracted more votes than they hoped for. If not that, I also didn't like the way Trent exited that wagon and how quickly it got forgotten. So I took his gun.

With that out of the way, we can try to figure out why the scum wanted ZFR dead and who was responsible.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: The answer to your question, Gamerager, "why a pacifist would admit that and(by extension) confirm Red as jailer" is because Red brought it up first. If Blotunga denied it, then the entire game focus would go to him or Red as one would be lying and even if we chose Red to lynch, that would confirm Blotunga as scum to be lynched the following day.

In other words, regardless of alignment, Blotunga is essentially obligated to confirm him. Red choosing Blotunga is completely NAI (Not Alignment Indicative) with regards to Blotunga.

Let's drop a bombshell here...

Unless this is a role-madness game and there is also another Roleblocker who blocked the SK, we do not have an SK in the game. People shouldn't jump to conclusions.

I followed the train of thought that Day 1, you arrived at Red's wagon because scum tried to steer clear of one of their own (i.e. get off Agent's wagon onto a town). I thought maybe SPF and Agent were doing some early distancing and attracted more votes than they hoped for. If not that, I also didn't like the way Trent exited that wagon and how quickly it got forgotten. So I took his gun.

With that out of the way, we can try to figure out why the scum wanted ZFR dead and who was responsible.
Are you claiming Vigilante? But then how is trent alive? Or did you kill agent? Why would you even do that? Just to get your 1 shot off?
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: Why 3 scum? We already had a Neutral flip. Do you really think the game started with 6 town and 3 scum? Most likely 2 scum.
I don't use the term this way, but some people use "scum" to include SKs etc. Given that we have two night kills on our hands it seems likely we're dealing with a kleptomaniac (SK) rather than a thief (vigilante). I wouldn't expect a one-shot vigilante to uh... blow their load on the first night.


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trentonlf: You are correct, I missed that. The Prankster can be any alignment, and all that does is open up a big can of WIFOM. Is he Town that was left alive to get a mislynch on or is he scum who really has this role and was hoping to get lucky and stop a Town PR.
Ok, I missed that yesterday and it seems significant. My initial thought was that a jailer is a town aligned role seeing as the mafia don't need the protection side of the role. However with the possibility of a SK or vig it makes a lot more sense. It's reasonably unlikely that Blotunga and Redfire are both scum, but there's certainly no reason to think their corroboration clears either of them.
Of the two Redfire seems more town, but less town than I thought yesterday.
Posted September 01, 2019
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GameRager: Don't you mean Red and not me? ;)
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blotunga: Did i really write that? Sorry I was a tad distracted. Yes, red is jailor ofc.
Brainfarts happen....I posted a comment above that was supposed to go in the signup thread earlier.

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RWarehall: The answer to your question, Gamerager, "why a pacifist would admit that and(by extension) confirm Red as jailer" is because Red brought it up first. If Blotunga denied it, then the entire game focus would go to him or Red as one would be lying and even if we chose Red to lynch, that would confirm Blotunga as scum to be lynched the following day.

In other words, regardless of alignment, Blotunga is essentially obligated to confirm him. Red choosing Blotunga is completely NAI (Not Alignment Indicative) with regards to Blotunga.

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I followed the train of thought that Day 1, you arrived at Red's wagon because scum tried to steer clear of one of their own (i.e. get off Agent's wagon onto a town). I thought maybe SPF and Agent were doing some early distancing and attracted more votes than they hoped for. If not that, I also didn't like the way Trent exited that wagon and how quickly it got forgotten. So I took his gun.

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With that out of the way, we can try to figure out why the scum wanted ZFR dead and who was responsible.
First off, sorry for the editing...I did it to highlight certain bits and make it easier for you/others to tell what i'm replying to.

1st bit above: Good points...I will cogitate on them.

2nd bit(bolded bit) above: What?!? o.0

3rd bit above: How so? Analyzing the wagons is one good thing to do....anything else?
Posted September 01, 2019
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blotunga: Are you claiming Vigilante? But then how is trent alive? Or did you kill agent? Why would you even do that? Just to get your 1 shot off?
Yes, I took Agent's gun. Use it before you lose it and given Agent is the 3rd wagon of day 1, even being wrong, knowing 2 of the 3 alignments with a claim from the 3rd gives us better information than just wondering about Agent.

I thought through the next step, that if I didn't take his gun last night, then we likely would end up focused on him today as his wagon of 3 mysteriously shifted to a confirmed town and a claimed town. At least I would have been pushing for that.
That would have resulted in a mislynch today.

My predecessor breadcrumbed my role. I was worried that scum would pick up on it and shoot me last night. That is why I don't like breadcrumbs, I feel scum has as much chance of picking up on them as town especially when they are focused on picking out PRs.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: Let's drop a bombshell here...

Unless this is a role-madness game and there is also another Roleblocker who blocked the SK, we do not have an SK in the game. People shouldn't jump to conclusions.

I followed the train of thought that Day 1, you arrived at Red's wagon because scum tried to steer clear of one of their own (i.e. get off Agent's wagon onto a town). I thought maybe SPF and Agent were doing some early distancing and attracted more votes than they hoped for. If not that, I also didn't like the way Trent exited that wagon and how quickly it got forgotten. So I took his gun.

With that out of the way, we can try to figure out why the scum wanted ZFR dead and who was responsible.
Hold up. You are claiming vig and saying that you decided to use your one shot on the first night (you seem to imply the decision was yours and not Micro's) and you did so as your first act as replacement. That seems like madness to me.

Either that or you're a serial killer trying an interesting gambit.
(I say SK, because if you were mafia trying to pass your kill off as a vig there's a reasonably high chance of you being CC'd).

I'm not sure I buy the "vig using their one shot on the first night as they're replacing into the game" shtick.

Aim at RWarehall for a bit of pressure.
Posted September 01, 2019
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SirPrimalform: I wouldn't expect a one-shot vigilante to uh... blow their load on the first night.
Except RWareHall is claiming vig.

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GameRager: Fwiw I didn't vote as I don't like rushing a wagon without much proof and the first session(day) is usually without much of that(from what i've seen). As for the bad feeling I had....it was due to people rushing to aim at one person so quickly.

Also why vote RWarehall? Any suspicion based in Micro's posts or something else?
Micro votes Agent then jumps to me then says he's willing to lynch Pooka. Then he pulls back at the end of the day.
But with RWarehall claiming vig NK, it's doubtful Micro's drawback was planned.

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blotunga: Are you claiming Vigilante? But then how is trent alive? Or did you kill agent? Why would you even do that? Just to get your 1 shot off?
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RWarehall: Yes, I took Agent's gun. Use it before you lose it and given Agent is the 3rd wagon of day 1, even being wrong, knowing 2 of the 3 alignments with a claim from the 3rd gives us better information than just wondering about Agent.
So, why Agent and not SPF or Trent? Of the three, I read Agent as the most Town at the day's end.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RedFireGaming: So, why Agent and not SPF or Trent? Of the three, I read Agent as the most Town at the day's end.
Because likely only one or the other would be Agent's partner in that scenario.

Were Agent and SPF really distancing or just having fun?
Did Trent come off the Agent wagon because he liked better?
Ground zero was Agent. 3 votes which turned into a pile onto Red then Pooka. If Agent were scum and scum were fleeing to protect him, it wasn't exactly clear which one was his partner.

It's not like this is a 13 or 16 player game. It's just 10 people, there aren't going to be many nights.

AIm at SPF

You clearly aren't thinking things through very well before putting me at L-2, in range of Game Over if my wagon is 2 Town and we actually have 3 scum...

Why would Micro breadcrumb this role day 1? How would revealing myself help me win this game? Either way, scum wants me dead now...if not to be completely sure I'm not 3rd party, then to eliminate a confirmed town.

As such, I have to now wonder if you are taking the opportunity to push Town into doing your dirty work.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RedFireGaming: Except RWareHall is claiming vig.
He made that post while I was typing mine, hence the followup post.
Posted September 01, 2019
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SirPrimalform: He made that post while I was typing mine, hence the followup post.
You ninja'd me and got first post anyway.
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RWarehall: You clearly aren't thinking things through very well before putting me at L-2, in range of Game Over if my wagon is 2 Town and we actually have 3 scum...
Which isn't very likely, unless someone targeted Blotunga last night. As I understand it, if you're town we have 2 scum, and probably no more Town PRs.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: You clearly aren't thinking things through very well before putting me at L-2, in range of Game Over if my wagon is 2 Town and we actually have 3 scum...

Why would Micro breadcrumb this role day 1? How would revealing myself help me win this game? Either way, scum wants me dead now...if not to be completely sure I'm not 3rd party, then to eliminate a confirmed town.

As such, I have to now wonder if you are taking the opportunity to push Town into doing your dirty work.
1. It's called pressure. You're clearly responding to it!
2. You made the post mentioning the breadcrumb while I was typing the one in which I voted you.

Aim away from RWarehall for now, can you point me to the breadcrumb please.
Posted September 01, 2019
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RWarehall: You clearly aren't thinking things through very well before putting me at L-2, in range of Game Over if my wagon is 2 Town and we actually have 3 scum...

Why would Micro breadcrumb this role day 1? How would revealing myself help me win this game? Either way, scum wants me dead now...if not to be completely sure I'm not 3rd party, then to eliminate a confirmed town.

As such, I have to now wonder if you are taking the opportunity to push Town into doing your dirty work.
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SirPrimalform: 1. It's called pressure. You're clearly responding to it!
2. You made the post mentioning the breadcrumb while I was typing the one in which I voted you.

Aim away from RWarehall for now, can you point me to the breadcrumb please.
You do know, I brought this up without "pressure"...
Why you now act like your actions are accomplishing anything additional is beyond me...

I brought all this up so Town could focus on the situation better. That Town's one flaw is lack of clarity. It's certainly important to know who was the target of scum. What roles we might have...

From the Micro notes passed along:
Post 32 - all that weird coffee stuff...additionally the O and S are capitalized to mean "One-shot" - don't ask me...
Post 152 - at the top capitalized letters spell VIG backwards...
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionGOG Mafia #61 - Pacifists at the NRA!(435 posts)(435 posts)
(435 posts)