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General discussionGOG Mafia #26: S.T.A.L.K.E.R - The Dangers of the Zone(1131 posts)(1131 posts)
(1131 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted March 03, 2015
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adaliabooks: Right, I've had a re-read. I was not mistaken, there's not much that stands out but as we are making a list, here we are:

1) Twilightbard - For placing his vote on dedo pretty much out of the blue and for lurking quite a bit.
Out of the blue? Didn't know I had to institute a warning system for when people are scummy. And I've been at work, not lurking, and considering I don't have a computer at work, it's quite hard to actually play.
Posted March 03, 2015
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JMich: Clarification needed.
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dedoporno: Considering I actually quoted a part of the OP, it's kind of silly to accuse me of not reading it. Funny how I was scrutinized for why I think the abilities may shift and when I quoted the OP things moved to PM confusion. Basically half of the people asked why do I believe such a mechanic may be in the game, when the OP clearly suggests it and the the very same people accuse me of not reading the OP. Curioser and curioser.
My asking for clarification was because the phrase
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dedoporno: So seem to not have read my entire post, though.
makes no sense. Who seems to not have read the entire post? Are you talking about me? Someone else? Something else entirely?

And my mention of PMs is only because Artifact is mentioned there as well (at least for my PM), nothing to do with powers shifting or not, no idea why you do such a deflection.

P.S. The phrase is "Curiouser and curiouser", and it's from Alice in Wonderland. No idea why you took u out of it.
Posted March 03, 2015
Ok, to explain what has me voting for Dedo a bit more for people that aren't seeing it. Discussing Mechanics on Day 1 is fruitless. There haven't been lynches, no twilight period, and no final flavor. Like the previous game, we can be in a situation where we won't get a cardflip altogether. It tends to build up lots of pet theories and we end up wasting time discussing these theories instead of actually scumhunting, to a detriment when people cling to these theories by threads, or when the Mafia just flat out feeds misinformation into the equation.

What do I recommend? Scumhunting, putting pressure on people, trying to see what people are playing close to their chest and what they aren't. Day 1 sucks under any circumstance but we get nowhere if we get so tied up in a discussion of mechanics that can only go so far to the point where we rush a lynch to end, and then we have nothing to go on for Day 2. Play the Game, not the Mechanics, because in this case they can only do so much.
Posted March 03, 2015
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JMich: P.S. The phrase is "Curiouser and curiouser", and it's from Alice in Wonderland. No idea why you took u out of it.
If I may, what is the point of this part?
Posted March 03, 2015
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JMich: P.S. The phrase is "Curiouser and curiouser", and it's from Alice in Wonderland. No idea why you took u out of it.
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HijacK: If I may, what is the point of this part?
When I find something curious, I do say it's curious. If the same person gives me reason to proclaim it more often, then I use the Alice in Wonderland quote, like I did in post 124.
In post 150 that dedoporno replies to me, he uses the phrase
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dedoporno: Curioser and curioser.
which I'm not sure if he misspells in purpose or if he truly doesn't know its origin. And I also take a jab at him.
Posted March 03, 2015
I love the WIFOM going on..

Don't talk about roles! Scumhunt instead!

Don't talk about mechanics! Scumhunt instead!

Don't talk about theories! Scumhunt instead!

Don't talk about PM's ! Scumhunt instead!

There's basically two trains of thought.

If you don't at least discuss some of the above, how on earth do you trip scum up and get some scumtells going on?

But - it's in the interest of Town to not reveal such things willy, and indeed, nilly.

Personally, I think any discussion about possible roles present in the game, powers etc - is more scummy than not.
Speculation about the overarching game setup is not so scummy.

I'm in agreement with dedo over the role change thing though - its pretty clear from the OP that roles may change from person to person, disappear entirely, etc etc. Which , on the face of it, is a massive bonus for us.
Posted March 03, 2015
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JMich: My asking for clarification was because the phrase
makes no sense. Who seems to not have read the entire post? Are you talking about me? Someone else? Something else entirely?
There is a missing "you" there. Just like there is a missing "u" in the the Alice quote. By the way I am familiar with the phrase. The misspelling is my own mistake. If you pay attention to my posts you'll see I tend to do lots of errors - missing words and letters, extra words left from re-writing, typos and such. Are you going to give me hard time for that? If yes, you may want to contact HSL.

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JMich: And my mention of PMs is only because Artifact is mentioned there as well (at least for my PM), nothing to do with powers shifting or not, no idea why you do such a deflection.
No deflection at all. That paragraph was originally separated in two for the sake of better content segregation, but the new line has been removed (probably by mistake). First sentence about quoting the OP was the reply on why I stated you seemed to not have read my post. The entire following part was frowning against the shifts you and other people made as soon as I explained my reasoning and showed that it's not me who didn't pay attention to the OP, but others.

I explained about Artifacts and what they are in the context of the game in order to back my theory up and to why I didn't initially recall the anomaly byproducts are actually called Artifacts themselves.

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TwilightBard: Like the previous game, we can be in a situation where we won't get a cardflip altogether.
Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game in that kind of a game.

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TwilightBard: What do I recommend? Scumhunting, putting pressure on people, trying to see what people are playing close to their chest and what they aren't.
Shut up about everything and then look for what people are shutting up about? Right. Sounds like a foolproof plan. I can't believe I missed you, though


The list so far:

1. TwilightBard
2. RWarehall
3. JMich
4. CSPVG
Posted March 03, 2015
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TwilightBard: Out of the blue? Didn't know I had to institute a warning system for when people are scummy. And I've been at work, not lurking, and considering I don't have a computer at work, it's quite hard to actually play.
Piggy backing off someone else's arguments to make a vote has been seen as scummy in all the games I've played, so yeah coming in and voting in the middle of two other player's discussing something does seem a little... eager.

And I completely understand not everyone can post all the time and I'm sorry if you don't have computer access at work. But your last post was three days ago (or two days before this post), so are you telling me you were at work for 48 hours straight?

This post seems very defensive and I'm not sure I like it...

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TwilightBard: Like the previous game, we can be in a situation where we won't get a cardflip altogether.
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dedoporno: Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game in that kind of a game.
Yeah, and I would take the bit in the OP about being able to tell who has been corrupted by the Monolith by examining their brain as a sign we will at least get alignment flips. (and I realise someone will probably see that as me discussing mechanics which I have said I'm against... so I'm fully prepared to be jumped on for it)
Posted March 03, 2015
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dedoporno: Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game in that kind of a game.
Yet another screwed up sentence. I need to stop posting before being fully awake. It should be more along the lines of "Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game, at least in that area".
Posted March 03, 2015
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dedoporno: Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game in that kind of a game.
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dedoporno: Yet another screwed up sentence. I need to stop posting before being fully awake. It should be more along the lines of "Lift specifically said it's going to be a normal game, at least in that area".
Is "normal" good or bad, I have little experience with such a state of being.
Posted March 03, 2015
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flubbucket: Is "normal" good or bad, I have little experience with such a state of being.
I'd say it's good, as in standard flips instead of no flips. I know you like the no-flips setup from a mod point of view, but do you prefer them as well when you are actually participating?
Posted March 03, 2015
When I started playing, no flip was the standard. Mafia were the only ones getting information on Night Kills. It's what gave them room to lie and slip up should they divulge information not commonly available to townies.
Posted March 03, 2015
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flubbucket: When I started playing, no flip was the standard. Mafia were the only ones getting information on Night Kills. It's what gave them room to lie and slip up should they divulge information not commonly available to townies.
Are you saying the scum need an edge right now? Why?
Posted March 03, 2015
Rereading my last post, I'm glad to see I didn't include as many joke/side comments as I feared, after seeing HSL and adalia's reactions. Mental note: try not to drop in possibly distracting comments/jokes that aren't actually relevant to the game.

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TwilightBard: Discussing Mechanics on Day 1 is fruitless. There haven't been lynches, no twilight period, and no final flavor.
Figuring out what we do and do not actually know seems like an important topic, whether it is mechanics or not. There might not be a lot to figure out in the first day, but putting it out there seems important to me. Scum can put their heads together without townies eavesdropping, so any insight one of them has, all of them have. Townies don't have that benefit: scum gets to hear anything we come up with, unless we don't share it and risk the other townies not figuring it out on their own.


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TwilightBard: What do I recommend? Scumhunting, putting pressure on people, trying to see what people are playing close to their chest and what they aren't. Day 1 sucks under any circumstance but we get nowhere if we get so tied up in a discussion of mechanics that can only go so far to the point where we rush a lynch to end, and then we have nothing to go on for Day 2. Play the Game, not the Mechanics, because in this case they can only do so much.
It has been asked a few times, and maybe I've missed the answer: How do we go about scumhunting at this point?

Additionally, putting pressure on people means what at this point? Making accusations and see what they say? Maybe its just me, but it seems like scum would be aware "Oh hey, no townie has anything at all to go on, so I can almost ignore accusations because they are baseless." Heck, the new player guide pretty much points this out specifically: keep your cool, because town will more than happily kill itself if you stay calm.

And right now, it seems like everyone is playing everything close to the chest. Dedo and I start talking about a part of the game, and several people start shushing us (mostly him, maybe because I'm not arguing back right now).

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Some people are wondering why I seem so focused on mechanics of the game. Its true that I am, for now, because I don't have anything else that is solid to work with. No wagons have formed yet, we have zero reads on anyone, and outing power roles will almost certainly assist scum more than us at this stage. I don't even have any decent scum guesses on anyone yet.

We need to know mechanics and we have some information in that direction from the OP flavor, so I'm inclined to look into that. I guess alternatively we could start looking at lynching the player with the least number of posts (or helpful posts); that should apply some pressure to speak up, but it could very easily be counter productive.

As I understand it, the advantages for Town versus Scum go like this (assuming everyone is either pro-town or on a single scum team):
Town: Numbers. Town outnumbers scum; it will take scum awhile to whittle town down, and town has more eyes looking for trouble.
Scum: Information and cohesion. Scum know exactly who they need to kill, and they have some private chat so they can coordinate and share information safely. They are outnumbered, but they can eliminate one victim each and every night. They can also help town murder itself by turning the scum hunt into a witch hunt.
Posted March 03, 2015
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Bookwyrm627: Scum: Information and cohesion. Scum know exactly who they need to kill, and they have some private chat so they can coordinate and share information safely. They are outnumbered, but they can eliminate one victim each and every night. They can also help town murder itself by turning the scum hunt into a witch hunt.
Bold is my doing.

True and false. Yes scum do know who need to kill - anyone town. However, They do not know which person to kill first. I agree we need to talk and figure things out but we do not need to give away anything that would help scum whittle down there process of who should be killed first or in what order.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionGOG Mafia #26: S.T.A.L.K.E.R - The Dangers of the Zone(1131 posts)(1131 posts)
(1131 posts)