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General discussionGOG, it's time for you to reflect!(39 posts)(39 posts)
(39 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted December 17, 2020
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Sachys: Same thing most likely.
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Patias: Yes, but at least they would be noble in presenting a fact and not blaming OWN CLIENTS.

I keep finding this the height of insanity!
No, people will still burn GOG at the stake for doing this at all.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by Elmofongo
Posted December 17, 2020
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Razzzmatazz: It's clear what happened: the CCP threatened to cut off CDPR's access to the lucrative market in China if CDPR dared to list a game on GOG that the CCP has blacklisted. CDPR made this decision for one simple reason: money. Very few companies have "principles" beyond "make as much money as possible." CDPR has shown itself to be no different than most in this regard. Writing heartfelt expressions of disappointment in CDPR while also stating that you'll continue to support the company is telling them exactly what they want to hear. CDPR has made it clear that it's only concerned about money. To get their attention, they'll need to suffer financial consequences for their cowardice. To me, that means never purchasing another game through the GOG store. I already deactivated my ActiBlizz account. GOG is just another dead body on the pile now as far as I'm concerned.
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Patias: Suppose I stop shopping here, now, where am I going to buy? Or do you think Steam and Epic are "fragrant"? In this case it is not optional, we are talking about the "less worst".
At least when the game was removed from Steam, it sounded like it was actually the developer who removed it (given the developer's statements at the time). Maybe I'm unaware of something, but I don't recall a similar situation where Steam or Epic so blatantly bowed to the demands of the CCP censors.

If we're going to criticize CDPR for selling out its "principles" for money, can we really just claim to have no choice in the matter? My hobby of gaming isn't worth compromising my principles. But it's always easier to insist that others follow principle than ourselves.
Posted December 17, 2020
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Patias: Suppose I stop shopping here, now, where am I going to buy? Or do you think Steam and Epic are "fragrant"? In this case it is not optional, we are talking about the "less worst".
If you want the biggest game catalog, lowest prices, quickest updates and decent Linux support
- go with STEAM

If you want DRM FREE - go with piracy sites and if you have moral objections to this, buy the game on developers site or STEAM and download from a reputable site on the high seas.

Last resort there's itch.io, Desura, HumbleBundle, Zoom and similar sites that come and go.

GOG had a great concept - DRM FREE with all the fixes and goodies that were available for each game. A truly complete package. I considered late (sometimes years late) releases an acceptable trade off for that.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by Nalkoden
Posted December 17, 2020
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Razzzmatazz: It's clear what happened: the CCP threatened to cut off CDPR's access to the lucrative market in China if CDPR dared to list a game on GOG that the CCP has blacklisted. CDPR made this decision for one simple reason: money. Very few companies have "principles" beyond "make as much money as possible." CDPR has shown itself to be no different than most in this regard. Writing heartfelt expressions of disappointment in CDPR while also stating that you'll continue to support the company is telling them exactly what they want to hear. CDPR has made it clear that it's only concerned about money. To get their attention, they'll need to suffer financial consequences for their cowardice. To me, that means never purchasing another game through the GOG store. I already deactivated my ActiBlizz account. GOG is just another dead body on the pile now as far as I'm concerned.
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Patias: Suppose I stop shopping here, now, where am I going to buy? Or do you think Steam and Epic are "fragrant"? In this case it is not optional, we are talking about the "less worst".
My thought on this is simple, if GOG goes down the route of Steam, why would I shop here when Steam does most things better than GOG? The only thing left that differentiates GOG from Steam is the availability of offline installers and the lack of a need for a client. Normally I'd feel better about saying that, but when GOG is quick to abandon its other principles and watering down its DRM-free promises (even to the extent of profiting off of sales of DRM games via the Epic store integration, failing to maintain the offline installers, etc.), I don't have much hope for GOG going forward.
Posted December 17, 2020
I'm not sure about Steam, but you know that Tencent has a 40% stake in the Epic Store, right?

bTW, I'm a GOG user for DRM free. I like the Galaxy, I never used offline installers, so my point is DRM free, and for now it remains the only store that respects this issue.

I'm already limiting my game possibilities a lot because I SIMPLY DON'T BUY on Steam or Epic, so forgetting about GOG will put you in a very complex situation of possibilities.

This whole situation is honestly a drug, and so far they go on without issuing a damn note!
Post edited December 17, 2020 by Patias
Posted December 17, 2020
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I pretty much agree with TC, but since this is not posted to Twitter, Facebook, or Reddit they'll probably just ignore us with the possible exception of a mod stopping by to remind us to "Play nice, and by the way this thread is locked."
Posted December 17, 2020
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Patias: I'm not sure about Steam, but you know that Tencent has a 40% stake in the Epic Store, right?

bTW, I'm a GOG user for DRM free. I like the Galaxy, I never used offline installers, so my point is DRM free, and for now it remains the only store that respects this issue.

I'm already limiting my game possibilities a lot because I SIMPLY DON'T BUY on Steam or Epic, so forgetting about GOG will put you in a very complex situation of possibilities.

This whole situation is honestly a drug, and so far they go on without issuing a damn note!
yup i do , i like epic
Posted December 17, 2020
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Sachys: Same thing most likely.
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AB2012: For many though this isn't just a "single issue". It's more like a "Perfect Storm" of chronic mis-management that's resulting in a "Straw that broke the camel's back" effect:-

- GOG didn't just remove a Taiwanese game from the store due to pressure from China...

- ...they doubled down on stupid by blaming "gamers" for removal despite what was obviously political pressure by China via "50 Cent Army" proxy 'bloggers' that everyone (except GOG) can clearly see, insulting everyone's intelligence in the process...

- ... And did so immediately on the back of a bad launch of CDPR's flagship game Cyberpunk 2077...

- ... To which many are seeking refunds for only to find out that GOG's once excellent customer service is now possibly the worst of all stores (far longer to issue refunds than Steam, Ubisoft or Origin), and they seem to have the same amount of full-time support staff for a store of 4,000x games selling however many millions of units of CDPR games that they did back when they were a store of 400 games. Many people new to GOG due to Cyberpunk are saying "This is the first and last game I'm buying here" due to the customer service "experience". What could have been a great opportunity to bring more people here is fast turning into an "avoid this store at all costs at the moment" PR nightmare.

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the potential impact of GOG selling Epic games via Galaxy, especially with GOG's own moderators tweeting about the future being selling DRM'd games via Galaxy...

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the increasingly obvious "2nd class citizen" treatment of offline installers (out of date installers, needing Galaxy to access 'bonus content' in single-player games, refusing to provide the last good prior versions of offline installers for some games where the newest version is buggy, no pre-loading for CP2077 despite doing it for Witcher 2 & 3, gating free games that were formerly given out as offline installers behind Galaxy, etc)

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the other "2nd class citizen" treatment of GOG releases as a whole vs Steam (missing updates vs Steam, lack of features / languages, no Linux builds, etc)

^ Any one of these is annoying. Everything combined though all seems to have converged to a point a time where this store really is struggling to get the basics right on almost anything to such an alarming degree that a lot of people clearly feel that it's no longer possible to blindly give GOG "the benefit of the doubt for being the underdog" until they attempt to at least begin to show they intend to turn one thing on above list around, let alone actually address all of them...
CDP isn't having a very good month, are they? Kind of a shame given how much hype and effort went into CP2077. Corporate is going to have to do some major damage control, since as you say it's just a perfect storm of bad press.

Of course, if CDP was ever going to crash and burn, I suppose 2020 is the time to do it. Take a number, and all that...
Posted December 19, 2020
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I really appreciate the outrage but unfortunately this will just be another thread GOG will ignore without saying anything at all. No explanations, no apologies, just silence. Because unfortunately that is what GOG has become. They might still bring us great games ... well most of them anyway ;) ... but when it comes to communication with their customer base they now obviously have the policy to lie to them or just say nothing. Both things I dislike a lot. It's really a pity - in 2017 when I talked to them in person I actually believed them every word ... today, I am starting to think about the question if I should believe them anything at all. They simply lied too much, they simply broke too many promises. This is just the tip of the iceberg. Yes, right ow I am quite angry with GOG - not the store, but their policy and everybody who is responsible for this crap lie/silent policy.

But like I said, all our outgrage will simply be ignored anyway - so maybe it is just wasted time after all :(
Post edited December 19, 2020 by MarkoH01
Posted December 19, 2020
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MarkoH01: I really appreciate the outrage but unfortunately this will just be another thread GOG will ignore without saying anything at all. No explanations, no apologies, just silence. Because unfortunately that is what GOG has become. They might still bring us great games ... well most of them anyway ;) ... but when it comes to communication with their customer base they now obviously have the policy to lie to them or just say nothing. Both things I dislike a lot. It's really a pity - in 2017 when I talked to them in person I actually believed them every word ... today, I am starting to think about the question if I should believe them anything at all. They simply lied too much, they simply broke too many promises. This is just the tip of the iceberg. Yes, right ow I am quite angry with GOG - not the store, but their policy and everybody who is responsible for this crap lie/silent policy.

But like I said, all our outgrage will simply be ignored anyway - so maybe it is just wasted time after all :(
Maybe it's wasted time. Maybe not. But quite simply there's no need to waste any more money on this sinking ship. That's pretty easy to do really.

Oh that and stop wasting time recommending them to friends. Seriously I did that for the past 11 years. It's also pretty easy to do. Just stop.
Post edited December 19, 2020 by BluesyMoo
Posted December 19, 2020
I generally dislike and shun the negativity circlejerk that internet outrage invites more and more these days but in this case, I'll call it justified. Maybe it's because I went out of my way to get scammed by preordering Cyberpunk, maybe it's because the expectations that were nourished are so vastly different from the reality of this situation. Who knows?

When something so unexpected happens I go through my past experiences and think if I should have seen this coming.
Was the fall of CDP, CDPR and GOG a contingency I should have planned for? I was willing to wholeheartedly support them with my money just a month ago. Looking back at it, the signs of trouble were there. I didn't want to see them because of good will and benefit of the doubt and all that. I think this moment in time is a turning point, though.
There is no shame in walking away from this and not being fooled twice.

Give your money to better companies. Save your money and build a better company yourself if you have to.
Posted December 19, 2020
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MarkoH01: But like I said, all our outgrage will simply be ignored anyway - so maybe it is just wasted time after all :(
Bu...bu...but they said that they listen to their customers, that's why they dropped Devotion. :P
Posted December 19, 2020
Except they can talk about it. They are not owned by china. they do not have to respect any chinese laws. They are a store front that makes their own rules. The fact that they don't want to talk about it has nothing to do with the Chinese government or censorship laws and everything to do with the fact that an honest answer would tank their reputation even more than a blatant lie. Let that sink in for a while.
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MarkoH01: I really appreciate the outrage but unfortunately this will just be another thread GOG will ignore without saying anything at all. No explanations, no apologies, just silence. Because unfortunately that is what GOG has become. They might still bring us great games ... well most of them anyway ;) ... but when it comes to communication with their customer base they now obviously have the policy to lie to them or just say nothing. Both things I dislike a lot. It's really a pity - in 2017 when I talked to them in person I actually believed them every word ... today, I am starting to think about the question if I should believe them anything at all. They simply lied too much, they simply broke too many promises. This is just the tip of the iceberg. Yes, right ow I am quite angry with GOG - not the store, but their policy and everybody who is responsible for this crap lie/silent policy.

But like I said, all our outgrage will simply be ignored anyway - so maybe it is just wasted time after all :(
It's not a waste of time at all. Everyday the optics of the situation grows worse for them. Their excuse was that gamers don't want Devotion on the store. Every single person who speaks up is challenging that claim and that's all that matters. Exposing them for the liars they are will have an impact far greater than you think. It's already choking their marketing channels. Their twitter is afraid to tweet. They are hurting their reputation day by day, and even if that only means a few lost sales on this platform, that's still a success that is worth the effort. Personally I can't bring myself to buy anything on this store right now and I'm not even boycotting them. It just feels wrong giving them money right now. It makes my stomach uneasy.
Post edited December 19, 2020 by FallenHeroX1
Posted December 19, 2020
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AB2012: For many though this isn't just a "single issue". It's more like a "Perfect Storm" of chronic mis-management that's resulting in a "Straw that broke the camel's back" effect:-

- GOG didn't just remove a Taiwanese game from the store due to pressure from China...

- ...they doubled down on stupid by blaming "gamers" for removal despite what was obviously political pressure by China via "50 Cent Army" proxy 'bloggers' that everyone (except GOG) can clearly see, insulting everyone's intelligence in the process...

- ... And did so immediately on the back of a bad launch of CDPR's flagship game Cyberpunk 2077...

- ... To which many are seeking refunds for only to find out that GOG's once excellent customer service is now possibly the worst of all stores (far longer to issue refunds than Steam, Ubisoft or Origin), and they seem to have the same amount of full-time support staff for a store of 4,000x games selling however many millions of units of CDPR games that they did back when they were a store of 400 games. Many people new to GOG due to Cyberpunk are saying "This is the first and last game I'm buying here" due to the customer service "experience". What could have been a great opportunity to bring more people here is fast turning into an "avoid this store at all costs at the moment" PR nightmare.

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the potential impact of GOG selling Epic games via Galaxy, especially with GOG's own moderators tweeting about the future being selling DRM'd games via Galaxy...

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the increasingly obvious "2nd class citizen" treatment of offline installers (out of date installers, needing Galaxy to access 'bonus content' in single-player games, refusing to provide the last good prior versions of offline installers for some games where the newest version is buggy, no pre-loading for CP2077 despite doing it for Witcher 2 & 3, gating free games that were formerly given out as offline installers behind Galaxy, etc)

- On top of that, many GOG customers are already disillusioned about the other "2nd class citizen" treatment of GOG releases as a whole vs Steam (missing updates vs Steam, lack of features / languages, no Linux builds, etc)

^ Any one of these is annoying. Everything combined though all seems to have converged to a point a time where this store really is struggling to get the basics right on almost anything to such an alarming degree that a lot of people clearly feel that it's no longer possible to blindly give GOG "the benefit of the doubt for being the underdog" until they attempt to at least begin to show they intend to turn one thing on above list around, let alone actually address all of them...
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NovusBogus: CDP isn't having a very good month, are they? Kind of a shame given how much hype and effort went into CP2077. Corporate is going to have to do some major damage control, since as you say it's just a perfect storm of bad press.

Of course, if CDP was ever going to crash and burn, I suppose 2020 is the time to do it. Take a number, and all that...
Cyberpunk is one thing. A problem that can be fixed and any fan of the Witcher games knows that they will put in the effort to do right by their fans. Good luck wiping the stink of china off though. Once it's there, it's stuck, just like with Epic games, NBA, etc. The only recourse on the subject is to put Devotion on the store, there is no other way to control that damage. That will follow them forever. They can either rip the band aid off and let the wound heal, or let it fester in the dark as if it doesn't exist, but we know it does and it will be fuel ready to light again and again, whenever they make a misstep.
Post edited December 19, 2020 by FallenHeroX1
Posted December 19, 2020
I am so disapointed CDPR.... First releasing a game cleary unfinished like Bethesda and now bending the knee to China like Blizzard...
CDPR, you lost a lot of goodwill and trust. 2020, what a crappy year...
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionGOG, it's time for you to reflect!(39 posts)(39 posts)
(39 posts)